Bad game for Logan Mankins

[reflexblue]

When it looks to me as if a player is quitting on plays and getting driven off, forcing his linemate to complete the block for him, I consider that to be a very bad job. When it looks to me as if a player is making solid pull blocks, I consider that a good job. When it looks to me as if the same player is doing all those things, I consider that to be wildly inconsistent.

Naturally, you are all welcome to disagree with that assessment.

In going through the posts it seems the vast majority thinks that Connelly has done very well including me. You seem to be about the only one that thinks otherwise, personally if i were in your position i would start to think maybe i'm missing something but thats me.

 

[DarrylStingley]

Mankins is has put himself in a position where the team has no choice but to make an example of him. Not that they want to, but what else can they do?

I think it's great. Exactly what the pats should do. Can it really be that only a handful of guys in the country are good enough to play guard?

I think you are right in that the Pats really have no choice but to give Logan the back of the hand unless he comes crawling back to them...which he wont do.

That said, I don't agree that it's great. Mankins is good at football. The Pats need guys like that. Having someone good at his job on the sidelines is almost never something that can be called "great."

 

[SanAngeloState]

oxy probably goes on IR.

I think Connolly is playing about as well as Mankins did. He'll be as good with experience for sure.

Mankins might not be "rethinking it" but right now the only way he wins is if the pats come crawling back and they're not doing that with an able Connolly doing well. And Ohrnbust looking pretty good too.

So he can't be too happy with that...yes he's an elite guard, albeit one who blew the SB for us, but he's not going anywhere unless someone trades for him.

:rocker:

 

[Deus Irae]

In going through the posts it seems the vast majority thinks that Connelly has done very well including me. You seem to be about the only one that thinks otherwise, personally if i were in your position i would start to think maybe i'm missing something but thats me.

The vast majority of people here thought Cassel would be cut. I'll pass on getting nervous because the vast majority stakes out a different position than I do with regards to exhibition season player assessments. For example:

...I think Connolly is playing about as well as Mankins did. He'll be as good with experience for sure...

I'm fine being on the other side of posts like this.

 

[Bostonian1962]

I was thinking the exact opposite, I thought that last night clearly showed that the Pats have a need for Mankins. I thought that Atlanta was in the backfield all night. Connelly is doing fine, but when was the last time that the Pats went through a season without a lineman missing a game?

If Kazur is healthy, then they could probably deal Mankins, but if he can't play, then it might be time to get Mankins in the fold. I was wholly unimpressed with Larsen and most of the other back-ups last night. Let's face it, the Pats can go with Light, Seabass, with Levior backing them up, but what happens when Neal or Connelly go down? Orenburger is OK, but the Pats would be in much better shape with Connelly coming off the bench backing up the eventual injury to Neal.

This uncapped year and no CBA, is really screwing a few players and messing up the league, nobody knows what the rules will be in the future, and when you are talking about a billion dollar industry, people are going to be careful with that kinda money.

Appreciate your feedback FTW, but teams were in the backfield all last year WITH Mankins in the lineup. Don't get me wrong, Brady usually gets rid of the ball before being sacked, but he was a human tackling dummy last year. I don't have a point other than, men in the backfield this year doesn't mean a drop off in performance from last year. Please don't get me wrong, we'd love Mankins back. The team does too, as they've offered him close to $7M per season. He takes that as his feelings are hurt, but that's on him.

 

[DarrylStingley]

We are working with a small sample size. And I have not seen coaches film. But my eyes have seen Connelly leading the way on many long gains this pre-season and I have trouble believing that Mankins would have played appreciably better had he been in Connelly's position.

That said, the more good lineman the better. I just don't think that the Pats have received materially worse play at LG when Connelly has been in there this pre-season than than they did when Logan was manning the position.

Hold outs suck.

 

[AzPatsFan]

I think we just get used to the idea that Mankins isn't coming back. The words he has used against the FO, he'd have to publicly eat a world of crow and I don't think he does that. He sits out the season and then we get some sort of compensation for him

Albeit in a bad situation not of his doing, he's being an idiot TBH, led by his agent, and you would hope his 'friends' on the team like Neal, Light, Brady etc are pointing this out

Mankins agent is pulling similar things with Jackson, and McNiel in San Deigo as he is with Logan. I suspect he is gambling to get noticed and make his markl as an agent, at the cost of the clients he represents. Eventually, one wil crack, fire him and then sign and come in.

Unfortunately Logan is too principled to do it I fear, and will go down with Agent Titanic. On the other hand Logan is no fool, and I can't see him throwing away 14 million or more.

 

[Sicilian]

The vast majority of people here thought Cassel would be cut. I'll pass on getting nervous because the vast majority stakes out a different position than I do with regards to exhibition season player assessments. For example:



I'm fine being on the other side of posts like this.

SanAngelo is not representative of my opinion. It's possible to be opposite both him and you. I don't believe Connelly is better than Mankins (no one in their right mind does), but I also failed to see the huge shift in consistency that you did.

Don't lump us all in with the bonkers.

 

[spacecrime]

I'm not sure how you can say that this was a bad game for Logan Mankins. Even though the line played well, he would still make the line a 1000x's better than it is now.

1000x better? THey have been playing great, so what would 1000x better look like? A touchdown every offensive play?

Anyway, the next OG that takes a team on his back and carries them with be the first one in NFL history.

 

[Deus Irae]

SanAngelo is not representative of my opinion. It's possible to be opposite both him and you. I don't believe Connelly is better than Mankins (no one in their right mind does), but I also failed to see the huge shift in consistency that you did.

Don't lump us all in with the bonkers.

Why on Earth would I not, in the context of what I was responding to:

In going through the posts it seems the vast majority thinks that Connelly has done very well including me.

If you people want to claim that Connolly is getting the job done brilliantly, have at it. I disagree with that assessment.

 

[Sicilian]

Why on Earth would I not, in the context of what I was responding to:



If you people want to claim that Connolly is getting the job done brilliantly, have at it. I disagree with that assessment.

I think it's a verbiage misunderstanding here. Where we're saying "he's done very well" does not mean on par with Mankins, or that we wouldn't welcome him back with open arms. He improves this OL for sure.

Saying he's played well is not the same as playing brilliantly. So in that respect, don't lump me in with someone who says he's going to be better than Mankins. Why do I have to believe that or you? Middle ground, my friend.

 

[Athelas]

Mankins agent is pulling similar things with Jackson, and McNiel in San Deigo as he is with Logan.

Um, Vincent Jackson's agent is Neil Schwartz and Marcus McNeill's agent is Alvin Keels, while Logan Mankins' agent is Frank Bauer.
Did I misunderstand your point?

 

[Richard Camembert]

How many C/Gs can make the team? What type of depth to teams usually carry at those positions? Do other teams have more depth than our two draft picks, a 3-4 year NFL starter and another player with experience on our team and PS for over two years?

That doesn't include rookies.

It also doesn't include all the guards that will come to be available every week from now on.

Well, as you know, last year they played the 6 basic OL (Mankins, Koppen, Kaczur, Neal, Light, Vollmer) plus Connolly for the VAST majority of the snaps. Granted, there were injuries to Vollmer and Light and those guys likely will produce more than last year. Still, I think they need 7 OL including a backup T and C/G.

As things stand now, if they have no injuries, they have to replace production from Mankins (1209 snaps) and Kaczur (956 snaps). Mankins' slot is getting filled by Connolly ATM, I'm assuming he can hold that slot down for the purposes of this thought. Who's replacing the Kaczur and Connolly snaps? And if there's injury, which some anticipate given the health of Neal and Light, then who steps in? They don't need an army here, they need two competent guys, but I didn't see much to get happy about from the 2nd stringers and if Mankins agrees, I think that would hearten his camp.

 

[reflexblue]

Why on Earth would I not, in the context of what I was responding to:



If you people want to claim that Connolly is getting the job done brilliantly, have at it. I disagree with that assessment.

I didn't see anyone say that Connelly was playing "brilliantly." Playing brilliantly is a lot different that playing Well.

 

[JackSpratt]

Yuh. Justin Tuck wants Mankins back too. He's not finished beating him like a rented mule.

 

[SunnyDenmark]

Mankins agent (assuming he is not totally braindead) - should understand that Pats FO rarely caves in to players demands. Recent history (hello Ty Law, Lawer Milloy, Asante Samuel, ) should be enough for Mankins and agent to realize that holding out through to game 10 won't get them much (except 6/16ths salary at the reduced $1.x Mill offer). Ok one more year service but probably wont count for much as the wind is blowing in the direction of less (or equal) years of servcie until free agency - in the new labor agreement.

My take is that they (Mankins /agent) will see the light as regular season dawns.....Bu as they need to make a symbolic stand - and don't want to cave immediately after the Pats FO told them 'NO' - then the Mexican standoff has to continute another week or 2 to show the world that they were 'serious' about their demands.

Hopefully, in a week or so he will have shown his resolve -but will also finally realize that $7 million/ yr is enough to 'feed his family' - and be respected as one of the top 10 guards in the game. I can't imagine him wanting to risk injury during the pre-season before signing a new contract.

 

[Deus Irae]

Mankins agent (assuming he is not totally braindead) - should understand that Pats FO rarely caves in to players demands. Recent history (hello Ty Law, Lawer Milloy, Asante Samuel, ) should be enough for Mankins and agent to realize that holding out through to game 10 won't get them much (except 6/16ths salary at the reduced $1.x Mill offer). Ok one more year service but probably wont count for much as the wind is blowing in the direction of less (or equal) years of servcie until free agency - in the new labor agreement.

My take is that they (Mankins /agent) will see the light as regular season dawns.....Bu as they need to make a symbolic stand - and don't want to cave immediately after the Pats FO told them 'NO' - then the Mexican standoff has to continute another week or 2 to show the world that they were 'serious' about their demands.

Hopefully, in a week or so he will have shown his resolve -but will also finally realize that $7 million/ yr is enough to 'feed his family' - and be respected as one of the top 10 guards in the game. I can't imagine him wanting to risk injury during the pre-season before signing a new contract.

1.) The Patriots caved on Branch, Seymour and Samuel.

2.) As I just posted in another thread:

Mankins' original tender amount was $3.268 million. When he didn't sign it in timely fashion, the Patriots lowered the tender, as per the team's rights, to $1.54 million. Mankins has already given up more money this year than he'd get by signing, so there's really no reason to expect him to cave at this point.

Is it possible that Mankins will cave? Sure, but I wouldn't go betting the farm on it. Lowering the tender was a bad move by the Patriots (and Chargers).

 

[Kontradiction]

Connolly's a very solid run blocker. It's always been his pass blocking that needed to be polished. Just having watched the game from a bar with my friends (I guess I got tired of arguing about the run defense from 2009 being SOLID, BRO!!! and wanted to experience life), I didn't see that he was struggling any in either phase of the game. Of course, I have the game taped and still need to go back to watch it and take a closer look at him. But I didn't really think he looked like a liability out there.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Um, Vincent Jackson's agent is Neil Schwartz and Marcus McNeill's agent is Alvin Keels, while Logan Mankins' agent is Frank Bauer.
Did I misunderstand your point?

If true I stand corrected. I thought I remembered an interview with Bauer regarding Jacksons' contract...

 

[SunnyDenmark]

1.) The Patriots caved on Branch, Seymour and Samuel.

2.) As I just posted in another thread:



Is it possible that Mankins will cave? Sure, but I wouldn't go betting the farm on it. Lowering the tender was a bad move by the Patriots (and Chargers).

1) Caving in on Branch?? They didn't give him the money he wanted. Showing him the money that would be caving. They took a lemon situation and made lemonade out of it by getting a first round pick from the Seahawks.

Seymour -they did show him the money (new contract or was it an extension?). Probably because they realized he was worth it.

Assante Samuel: I don't believe that it is caving in by agreeing to not franchaise him as a tradeoff to making him happy and getting him into camp. It was a decent tradeoff for Pats when you realistically know you wont be resigning him due to his salary demands (not matching anywhere near your own).

So I will give you only 1/3. Plus look at Ty Law, Lawer Milloy, and others who have been shown the door when their salary (demand or actual) doesnt match their production (hello Adalius Thomas). Those and other situations (demanding Wilfork/ Ben Watson sign 6 year rookie contracts) doesn't sound like Pats FO caving in to me.