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Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discuss.

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by betterthanthealternative, Aug 10, 2011.

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  1. betterthanthealternative

    betterthanthealternative Rookie

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    Twenty five years of rooting for this team and I'm more optimistic than I've ever been. Dementia setting in? You be the judge. Here's what's possible:

    On D
    DL: Big Al, Ellis, Carter, play well; Brace and any other second year player improve; Warren and Wilfork play as well as last year. Wright's recovery is an added (but not required) bonus.

    LB: Mayo maintains; Spikes, Ninko, Cunningham improve; two of a half dozen OLB possibilities fulfill their potential.

    DB: the best CB duo in the league shows up and stays healthy; one of Arrington/Butler plays well; Ras-I works his way into packages for the second half of the year and handles big receivers; Chung continues to improve, and the other safety plays average.

    On O
    OL: The youngsters learn and get healthy, so last year's "good" line gets better. Connelly's confidence from last year improves his play for this year.

    Receivers: 85 is reborn; Welker and Branch benefit from 85's presence; the tight ends get better (almost inevitable); Price blossoms.

    Backfield: Brady maintains; the young backs show up well; Woodhead is better in his second year in the system; Law firm is better (as camp reports indicate).

    Special teams are good as usual, with even more competition for punt and kickoff returners.

    Just forget about injuries for the purposes of this post (it's about kool aid, after all).
  2. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    Good team, but the 2007 team was stacked. Go back and look, depth everywhere.
  3. NEPats1

    NEPats1 Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    Good post man. I was re-watching the Pittsburgh game last season and Collinsworth brought up an interesting point: The Pats started 3-4 rookies last year on defense alone. (5-6 if you count Gronk and Hernandez)

    He said for any other team that would've been considered a rebuilding year by starting that many young players, and the Pats came out of it 14-2.

    I think there's a lot of optimism with this current group.

    I'm so excited! :rocker:


    (I think I misunderstood the OP so please don't hold it against me! :D )
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2011
  4. TheSolderKing

    TheSolderKing Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu




    We LACKED the BIG TE. We LACKED a plethora of weapons in which Brady could share the wealth w/ it was a Randy Moss throw it up kinda situation (yes we had stallworth and Jabar.
    I'd take 2010 offense over 2007's any damn day of the week. The weapons NOW create so many mismatches and our possibilities are endless.


    2007 didn't FINISH our O-Line s_ hit the bed in the SB. Our current O-Line is going to be far better than that extremely impressive 2007 version. 2007 O-line was not the best. I believe we posses the BEST O-Line right now. Every player must stay healthy and we do not need key injuries derailing our chances of GLORY.


    G-men had best O-line did they not?
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2011
  5. fumbrunner

    fumbrunner Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    Injuries are always the wildcard. If they stay healthy, they are in good shape. The DL was a mess last year with injuries. Losing Bodden killed us in the secondary. I agree, this team could replicate their record from last year. Here's hoping they stay healthy in key positions.
  6. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    tjis team may not score as many points as that team, I think it is a more physical team.

    I think these guys will be able to play rogh with anyone.....something we havent had for the last few years......
  7. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    I barely like to even mention 2007, the Superbowl was brutal but the fact is that the 2011 offense will not be as good as the 2007 offense (best ever). They were stacked at every position and decided to play an average game when the Giants played their best game.

    I don't have time now but later I will go through position by position and we can continue the debate.
  8. PATSYLICIOUS

    PATSYLICIOUS Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    I find it hard to temper my expectations this year. A 14-2 team that looks to have significantly improved itself and hopefully sees continued improvement from a high % of young players.

    2007 team had more firepower, more talent. But this team has better depth and is younger/more versatile. Should be better built for January. Then again, experience was another advantage in '07.
  9. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu



    Don't forget Mesko....

    He was arookie starter too.

    All and all we had 8 rookies play significant roles on a 14-2 squad!

    So let's see....


    all 22 Starters from last season are back from a 14-2 team. Add Haynesworth, Ocho, Carter, Ellis, Anderson etc.


    PLUS: Our 1st, 2nd, and 3rd picks in the draft might not see the feild for a while...


    I'm just glad teh Eagles are siging everyone under the sun and taking some of the shine off the Patriots.


    (Shhhhhhhhhhhhh....... don't tell anyone, but we are WAY deeper than last year)
  10. TommyBrady12

    TommyBrady12 Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    I've been thinking the same thing for the past week or so. Here are my thoughts. The offense has the potential to be equal to or better than the 2007 offense.

    RB - no more laurence "dancing with the stars" maroney." BJGE, woodhead, ridley, vereen, faulk/morris (one will get cut) is way better than the 2007 RBs.

    WR/TE - Ocho takes the place of Moss, who is better than 85 but throw in Branch and the Hernandez, Smith and Gronkowski and the 2010 TEs are better. I mean brady had little TE help in 07' from Watson. Now this position is loaded.

    OL - agreed it is younger and a little deeper.

    Defense: in general the team is younger at certain positions, but i think our secondary is better than the 2007 team, particularly at CB.
  11. Run DMC

    Run DMC Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    We're good. We always are. The O should be a juggernaut as usual.
    Let's just hope the D can step it up this year and maybe we can make a run at this thing. As Bart Scott so eloquently put it, last year's D "couldn't stop a Kleenex". Yes, we were great at forcing turnovers, but the 3rd down passing D was an effing farce last year. We are definitely better with the return of Bodden and hopefully Ras-I can help. Butler is a bust, sorry homers.
    I am hoping AH and Big Vince in the middle can be a force this year.Love the Ellis signing. The LB corps should have improved-I'm talking to you, Spikes. However, we got alot of geriatrics out there, so it's still hit or miss.
    It's going to be fun year, thats for sure!
  12. patsinthesnow

    patsinthesnow PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    My opinion:

    QB: 2007 (No QB will ever play like Brady did in 07)

    RB: 2011 (BJGE>Maroney. Woodhead=Faulk)

    WR: 2007 (2007 Moss unstoppable, Welker best slot WR, Gaffney & Stallworth decent)

    TE: 2011 (Gronk and Hernandez by a mile)

    OL: Wash (2007 had a younger Light and Neal; 2011 has Vollmer)
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    DL: 2007 (Seymour, Wilfork, Warren; but if Haynesworth and Ellis play to their abilities, then I'm not sure about this)

    LB: 2007 (old but I prefer this group)

    DB: 2011 (Better starting CBs and CB depth, 2007 had Harrison though)
  13. RelocatedPatFan

    RelocatedPatFan Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    I would hope they score less than the 2007 team as that shows they are going more for ball control (or that's the reason I expect they will score less).

    I want to see the team as balanced (season-wide) as possible and that the offense can game plan to the opossong defense's weakness. If the defenseive backs are stout (i.e. the Eagles play as everyone expects them to play), then win the game pounding the ball if necessary (though how you expect to cover all the ofeensive talent, I have not idea).

    This is the year BB brings balance to the run game.
  14. PushnPencils

    PushnPencils Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu



    On paper.......

    Our great offense hid our defense's deficiencies.
  15. Ivan

    Ivan Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    Can't wait for this team to come together. Overall I think they have the potential to be their best team ever, but potential doesn't win championships and many things can derail it. This team is deeper than 2007 and the defense should be better but I don't expect the offense to score more points than they did, although they could be more dominant in time of possession and more difficult to match up with as I think this OL, TE's, and the run game will be better.

    I love what they have done thIs offseason, great draft and free agency. Really looking forward to the season.
  16. Patriot 37

    Patriot 37 Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    I agree !

    QB lose no one

    add Mallett

    RB lose Taylor (nothing)

    add Vareen (who was the pick I'm most excited about) and Ridley, hopefully a healthy Faulk.

    TE lose, Crumpler great blocker and leader.

    add Smith, should help with the blocking, but this position I think upgrades the most on Offense. Gronk didn't get into a rythem until mid-season and Hernadez kinda hit the rookie wall (they were both 20 years old). Gronk is the next Patriot Superstar and Hernandez is a match up nightmare.

    WR lose no one

    add Ocho, getting old yes, but he goes from the #1 threat w/ the Bengals to #3 w/ us behind Wes and Gronk. Big difference should have plenty off opporntunities.

    OL

    lose Neal, underated player very good Gaurd.

    add Solder, the only position I don't think upgrades in the short term anyway Light is getting old; Solder might not be ready, but we get Makins for a full year and Volmer is on the verge of Pro Bowl status. Connelly isn't as good as Neal but a solid starter.

    DL (I 'm considering last year OLBs as DEs for the alleged 4-3)

    lose TBC decent situational passer

    add Haynesworth, Carter, Ellis, Anderson, Carter/Anderson make up for TBC ; probably an upgrade. Adding Ellis and Haynesworth is obviously huge. I love the Ellis pick up. It also allows Warren and Wright to play part time making them very effective. Love is improved. Huge upgrade here.

    LB lose no one

    add no one, but Spikes and Fletcher look like they have made a jump up from there rookie year.

    DB

    Lose Page (JAG)

    Add Bodden (IMO the most important additional on the team), Dowling. Arrington looked good in camp when I was there I like him at nickel.

    ST lose Tate ?, might not keep him, but he's the best KR on the team

    add Gost, with the new rules and his leg touchbacks all day long.

    I don't think I missed anything, but either way this team on paper is significantly improved.
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2011
  17. Patspsycho

    Patspsycho Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    It's not just about the personnel, but also about everyone doing their jobs. We had a lot of blown coverages last year, especially in zone. I am not going to get excited until I see what a real game does to our ability to drop back in coverage, especially on 3rd and long and when coverages are passed upfield, from one AOR (Area of Responsbility) to another. In TC this year, zone coverage seemed to be much tighter, but there's no telling until the stress of a real game is experienced.
  18. betterthanthealternative

    betterthanthealternative Rookie

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    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    And then, with the extra second of hesitation that creates in the opposing QB, what a stronger push from the front line can produce in hurries and related.
  19. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #51 Jersey

    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    Whilst being happy with the pre-season acquisitions this team has made I'd like to see how the Patriots fare as a unit 4 games in to the season proper before making any claims.
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2011
  20. TommyBrady12

    TommyBrady12 Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Re: Assertion: this team has more upside potential than any in recent history. Discu

    ...except that the 2007 patriots D gave up the fewest yards/points of any patriots team in history. the 2007 D was good, it just wasn't physical.
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