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Are we at war with Muslim Extremeist?

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by PATSNUTme, Jun 25, 2007.

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Are we at war with Muslim extremist?

Poll closed Jul 2, 2007.
  1. Yes, we are at war.

    81.8%
  2. No- we are not at war.

    18.2%
  1. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    It's been almost 6 years since 9/11. I'm just wondering if people still feel as if we are still at war with muslim extremist.

    If we are at war, how should we prosecute the war ? If we are not at war, should we be concerned about them at all?

    Finally for those who are at war, what price are you willing we pay as nation and as an individual?
  2. Pujo

    Pujo Rookie

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    The problem with the question is the vagueness of war. What constitutes a war? A war like World War II? A war like the Cold War? A war like the War on Drugs, or the War on Illiteracy? When I wake up in the morning, do I feel like there's a war going on? Not exactly. So beyond asking people what their definition of war is, what do you expect peoples' answers to mean?
  3. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Yes, we are at war with them.

    Work to address the underlying conditions that lead to extremism. Use political and economic pressure to promote political reform, including a free press, equal rights for women, and democracy. Use the internet to promote freedom of information and thought. Use diplomacy to build coalitions that can better control religious extremism.

    I'm certainly willing to pay more in taxes so that we can use economic aid as a means of promoting change. I'm willing to use my car less and pay more for gas so that we have more leverage over those oppressive societies. I do not agree with those who are willing to sacrifice the children of others to execute the war, but are unwilling to use their car less or pay higher taxes.
  4. PatsWSB47

    PatsWSB47 Rookie

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    I feel they are at war with us so we better be engaged with them. Keep presure on their finances, try and infiltrate suspected groups, and monitor suspicious activity including overseas phone calls to certain known terrorist areas. If I'm gonna call Uncle Joe in Pakistan to shoot the Breeze and some anti-terror task force listens to it to see if I'm planning another 9-1, then I guess I'll swallow hard and accept it because A. I have nothing to hide and B., there may be some other guy who really is planning it and I'd like us to know about it.
  5. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Being at war means just what it says. This is a war like WWII in tha there is an enemy and they are trying to ruin our way of life. In some areas of the world it's a hot war againts people with weapons.

    It's also like the cold war where nations states are using proxy "armies" to fight their fight.

    When I wake up in the morining, I do feel that there is a war going on and just waiting for the next shoe to drop in our homeland. I really don't think most Americans now are treating this seriously enough. Al Queda is just one of the many Islamic extremist groups.

    I do not attend church and would feel the way if it was a radical Christians who were the threat. Let's clear that up before someone strarts throwing around racism. Race has nothing to do with this.
  6. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I hate taxes but I would be willing to pay a tax surcharge as long as it went directly to funding the war and securing our borders. I don't mean just Mexico. Canada has a growing populatin of muslims and a growing number of muslim extremist.

    We should become energy independent. If that means drilling in Anwar and other places then so be it. If that means building new nuclear power stations, then so be it. If that means gradually increasing milage requirement so be it. We cannot all of a sudden lay drastic energy reduction demand because it will ruin our economy and our ability to fight this war.

    I really do think that giving economic aid to countries is a total waste. We can't control where that aid goes to. We also cannot stop the Iman's from preaching hate and that is where it's coming from.
    And, most of it is coming from Saudi and they can't stop it even if it poses a threat to the Royal Family.
  7. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Rookie

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    I think this sort of new conflict needs a new type of word. We weren't at war with some Germans in WW2, we were at war with all of them. And with a new conflict, new tactics and strategies are required.
  8. Harry Boy

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    Pujo was right, it isn't "war as we have known it", there are no uniforms, no rules, and no country for us to Bomb, but our enemy has a country to bomb as they have already shown us, USA, England, Spain, Israel etc.

    We are at war, we are involved in "A GANG WAR" just like the "Gangs Of California" and just like the "Gangs Of Pelican Bay Prison" these gangs all have their names, Bloods, Crips, Arayan, KKK, Nazi's etc.

    Gang Names Involved In This War:
    Muslim VS Infedel

    You may not like it or agree but it is a fact, it is just a matter of time before they strike us again right here at home so be careful when you vote in 2008, if you put a Pansy in the white house you better not go to the Super Bowl in 2009 or let your kids go to the mall at Xmas Time. :rocker:
  9. patsfan13

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    How were at war with the Islamist. That covers the freoup(s) than want to establish a worldwide Caliphate with Sharia law, and eliminate the US in the process.
  10. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    I have to go renew my passport, so I'll keep this brief, but how about building a wall around the US, shooting to kill at all points of entry, enforcing our immigration laws, nuking the ME & building a parking lot in its place, drill for our own oil off our coasts, and in Alaska, invest a few billion dollars on hydrogen fuel cells, investing a few more billion on transforming our infratructure to supply the pop with hydrogen fuel, revisiting how we give out, and who we give aid to in the world, and withdrawing all of our soldiers from foreign countries. Prior to withdrawing our troops, we would buy a few islands in strategic locations around the world, and build a couple of bases incase we needed to send a rapid deployment force somewhere.

    I'm kidding about some, and am serious about some others. I'll let you people try to figure out which ones. :D
  11. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    They're All Great

    :rocker: "yup, that's the way to go"
  12. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Are we at war with Muslim Extremists:

    Didn't they "declare war" on us when they came into our country, bombed NY City and slaughtered 3000 innocent human beings in two hours, if that isn't a reason to Go To war I don't know what the "heck" is
    (I have been asked not to use the "F" word anymore, kids read this forum) :singing:

    I can understand why that question was asked though, right after 9/11 there were many blubbering liberals that thought we should negotiate with those smelly murdering savages, now they are going nuts trying to blame America, Bush, Limbaugh, Coulter, and the CIA.

    Yes mother, we are at war.
  13. Pujo

    Pujo Rookie

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    Then we've always been at war. 9/11 was the biggest incident of terrorism, it wasn't the first.
  14. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I know and it was the Biggest Reason to go to war, there comes a time when enough is enough.
  15. Pujo

    Pujo Rookie

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    Why is Biggest Reason in caps? I know you dropped out in the sixth grade and all, but you obviously know how to capitalize, so what are you trying to say?
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2007
  16. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Becuase 9/11 was the BIGGEST REASON we have had to go to war since PEARL HARBOR.
  17. DarrylS

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    Would not pretend to minimally begin to understand all Muslim Extremists, so difficult to say if we are at war. Some extremists focus on Israel, some focus on order within their own borders, some are focuses on instituting and implementing shia law in a locale, some focus on conversion of infidels or non believers in general... are we at war with Muslim Extremists in general, probably not.

    But, we are at war with Muslim Extremists who plan to or have committed terrorist attacks against the US or our allies.
  18. PatsFanInVa

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    Pretty short and sweet summing up, GJA.

    I'd add that it would be much more convenient to have a country called Muslim Extremia to be at war with. War assumes a lot of things. Wars on intangibles like "drugs," "poverty," and "terror" are usually a failure. I suppose substituting "Muslim Extremist" for terror, while bigoted (we are happy with Irish extremism? Basque?) at least rounds up the other "side" a little more than a pure abstraction.

    Unfortunately, all Muslim Extremists do not announce themselves as such or wear uniforms. They do not have one chunk of contiguous territory. There is no capital for them. And all people who sympathize with an extreme reading of Islam are not prepared to purposely target noncombatants (the essence of terrorism), as a methodology.

    What we really have on our hands is an international criminal mob problem. Prior to the last few years, we also had an unprecedented level of international sympathy and support. We have squandered it, by trying to settle our old Iraqi score and calling it our response to completely different people.

    Surprise, surprise. Our old and new enemies make common cause as a result. By the way, the intelligence community warned of the outcome.

    Could we still treat this "war" as a police action distributed among many stakeholders? Ask the Saudis how much they like Al Qaeda calling them an illegitimate government. Ask Lebanon and Israel how much they enjoy being proxy battlegrounds. Ask Fatah how much they enjoy the recent successes of Hamas, and ask the Palestinian people how smart they thought their protest vote for Hamas was, in retrospect. Ask Mubarrek how much fun it is to deal with the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, and even ask Assad how secure he feels as an Alawite, balanced on a knife's edge in his nation surrounded by Sunnis. Or for that matter, ask Musharraf in Pakistan how he feels about being a sort of Shah-in-the-making...

    Every elite in the Middle East is threatened, and every elite in the Middle East would have an interest in cooperation, were we to treat these groups as organized crime syndicates, which is exactly what they are, regardless of the legitimacy they seek to confer on themselves.

    Our mistake was in legitimizing them by calling this a "war." Maybe in Afghanistan... but not in Iraq. Iraq was a war against Iraq... and we have invited the extremists to make it a war against Islam (in their eyes and in the eyes of their as-yet less radicalized sympathizers.)

    PFnV
  19. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How is this bigoted? They are Muslims and they are extremist. If they were Christian and extremist they would be Christian extremist. Would that be bigoted?

    They are what they are. All Muslims are not extremist. Most Muslims are not extremist. However the % that are extremist are carrying out their terror in the name of Islam. They want a extremist Muslim state. They want a extremist Muslim region. They want an extremist Muslim world.

    Yours is one of the most smug and niave post on the subject.

    "We invited the extremist to make it a war against Islam". As if they needed an invition from anyone.:eek:
  20. Pujo

    Pujo Rookie

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    The issue is we've allowed the extremists to both co-opt a religion and a war and we've legitimized it by invoking both the religion and the term "war" when describing it. These are a bunch of pissant terrorists, nothing more. If a Christian militia got together and started murdering people, we wouldn't need a War on Christianity, we'd need an operation against the specific militia.
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2007
  21. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If we legitimized it, we did that 30 years ago when the movement started to take on speed and we did nothing.

    This is not a war on Islam, its a war on Islamic extremist. If they were Christian extremist it would be a war on them.




    I think people in this country are underestimating how powerful this miovement is. Even though they may be in different groups the goals are still the same. So to think of them as malitias, gangs, or groups is not giving them the focus that we need to. There is little difference between Hezballah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Al Queda, the government in Iran and other organizations that you or I haven't heard of yet.

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