Are the 2012 Patriots team more talented than the 2007 Pats?

[TyronePoole]

if that's how you want to conclude things, I can't stop you, but as of right now, chandler jones could be another jarvis moss, hightower could be another gary guyton, and bequette could be another jermain cunningham.....we don't know anything as to how they will pan out.

I didn't say anything about those guys, nor did I say Hightower would be great. All I said was that this LBing group is not worse than 2007s.

as for thomas, the pats had let mcginest go and colvin never really got it all together.....

by your logic, seymour sucked because the pats drafted warren, then wilfork

what are you talking about? that was your logic:

the fact they drafted who they did speaks for itself.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

2007 was veteran and established

2012 is about youth and athleticism.

The "dynasty" defenses in 2012 would rack up 200+ yards of penalties per game.

The 2012 offense will not have a Moss but based on today's look could be the most prolific and toughest to defend in history. The options/fomations/personnel possibilities are just endless. If the RB's come along, absent injury, how do you defend?

 

[IllegalContact]

I didn't say anything about those guys, nor did I say Hightower would be great. All I said was that this LBing group is not worse than 2007s.



what are you talking about? that was your logic:

no.....using 3 of your 4 first picks in a draft to address the same relative positional need is different than signing one guy

 

[IllegalContact]

2007 was veteran and established

2012 is about youth and athleticism.

The "dynasty" defenses in 2012 would rack up 200+ yards of penalties per game.

The 2012 offense will not have a Moss but based on today's look could be the most prolific and toughest to defend in history. The options/fomations/personnel possibilities are just endless. If the RB's come along, absent injury, how do you defend?

this offense is no different from the 2007 version when it comes to coming up with how to be successful against a scheme like the giants which you can bet will be replicated time and time again next year. the idea is that you hit brady a few times and he becomes very human.

are any of these guys more athletic than mark anderson? andre carter?

yet there are defense like the steelers and the ravens who operate in the same manner and don't have 200 yards of penalties a game.

 

[TyronePoole]

no.....using 3 of your 4 first picks in a draft to address the same relative positional need is different than signing one guy

we only picked one linebacker in the entire draft

 

[IllegalContact]

we only picked one linebacker in the entire draft

LOL......skirting the issue........that must be why bequette played OLB instead of DE in the senior bowl.

how much you wanna bet that jones and bequette wind up playing LB for the pats?

you just hate being wrong, don't you?

 

[TyronePoole]

LOL......skirting the issue........that must be why bequette played OLB instead of DE in the senior bowl.

how much you wanna bet that jones and bequette wind up playing LB for the pats?

you just hate being wrong, don't you?

So just to be clear, are you arguing that who they draft is indicative of how they view the position or not? I only ask because you've argued both sides and I don't want to waste anymore time before I carry on.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

...this offense is no different from the 2007 version when it comes to coming up with how to be successful against a scheme like the giants which you can bet will be replicated time and time again next year.

I would be just fine replaying SB46 with a healthy Gronk, Lloyd added to the mix, Gaffney added to the mix, Vereen and Ridley added to the mix, then we have the defensive makeover as well to discuss...

I am fine if everyone tries to copy what the Giants did.

Barring multiple catastrophic injuries, the depth of talent has gone way up over the past few weeks/months and will be way higher in 2012, with a training camp under their belt, unlike last year. So we will be both more talented and better prepared.

 

[IllegalContact]

So just to be clear, are you arguing that who they draft is indicative of how they view the position or not? I only ask because you've argued both sides and I don't want to waste anymore time before I carry on.

it obviously appears that you do want to waste your time

need, value, fit as well as some other things are the bases for selecting a player.

this year the draft addressed the biggest need on this team. this is not to say that this was the biggest reason these players were selected. nobody here knows what the biggest reason was.

I am glad they drafted the players that they did. but there is zero evidence that the unit as it is now is as good as the unit in 2007.

 

[IllegalContact]

I would be just fine replaying SB46 with a healthy Gronk, Lloyd added to the mix, Gaffney added to the mix, Vereen and Ridley added to the mix, then we have the defensive makeover as well to discuss...

I am fine if everyone tries to copy what the Giants did.

Barring multiple catastrophic injuries, the depth of talent has gone way up over the past few weeks/months and will be way higher in 2012, with a training camp under their belt, unlike last year. So we will be both more talented and better prepared.

as is every team.

my point was never about the offense. it is about anyones silly notion that at this time, that the pats defense is anywhere near as good as the 2007 defense. so much so that anythin gthat the offense does cannot offset the weaker defense. that can only be hoped for by instant and consistent contribution from the new players including the rookies of the defense.

the offense will be prolific....again......

and agian, the pats are faced with trying to have a defense develop over the course of the season......for the 3rd or 4th year in a row......

here's to hoping they get it right this time.,

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

this offense is no different from the 2007 version when it comes to coming up with how to be successful against a scheme like the giants which you can bet will be replicated time and time again next year. the idea is that you hit brady a few times and he becomes very human.

are any of these guys more athletic than mark anderson? andre carter?

yet there are defense like the steelers and the ravens who operate in the same manner and don't have 200 yards of penalties a game.

Yeah.....OK.......

........how to be successful against a scheme like the giants.....

A healthy Gronk and the SB was a comfortable 2/3 score victory.

That would never occur to you because you are too dumb to comprehend. Since you are too dumb to grasp that, there is zero way you would ever understand the new possibilities.

Actually, based on the "quality" of your posts, you don't deserve to grasp it.

Yeah,.....Anderson and Carter....athletic guys.....signed off the street because nobody else wanted them.........

Steelers and Ravens......yeah...last I saw them they were getting lit up in the playoffs.

Hey Ian, we made the first baby steps in the draft on this type of "posting". Granted, not every poster is an Einstein but....C'mon man!!!

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

LOL......skirting the issue........that must be why bequette played OLB instead of DE in the senior bowl.

how much you wanna bet that jones and bequette wind up playing LB for the pats?

you just hate being wrong, don't you?

You obviously don't

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Yeah.....OK.......

........how to be successful against a scheme like the giants.....

A healthy Gronk and the SB was a comfortable 2/3 score victory.

That would never occur to you because you are too dumb to comprehend. Since you are too dumb to grasp that, there is zero way you would ever understand the new possibilities.

Actually, based on the "quality" of your posts, you don't deserve to grasp it.

Yeah,.....Anderson and Carter....athletic guys.....signed off the street because nobody else wanted them.........

Steelers and Ravens......yeah...last I saw them they were getting lit up in the playoffs.

Hey Ian, we made the first baby steps in the draft on this type of "posting". Granted, not every poster is an Einstein but....C'mon man!!!

I agree with your sentiment. That post was pretty stupid. Kind of like how the Giants scheme would be replicated in '08 and the Jets scheme would be replicated last year.

In regards to the Giants, all you need to do is injure our best offensive weapon, injure Brady in the third quarter, get several fumbles to bounce back to your own team, oh, and did I mention get 4 ridiculously athletic defensive ends on your defensive line who are all pass rushing specialists?

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

I agree with your sentiment. That post was pretty stupid. Kind of like how the Giants scheme would be replicated in '08 and the Jets scheme would be replicated last year.

In regards to the Giants, all you need to do is injure our best offensive weapon, injure Brady in the third quarter, get several fumbles to bounce back to your own team, oh, and did I mention get 4 ridiculously athletic defensive ends on your defensive line who are all pass rushing specialists?

Based on the posting over the last few days, it appears the Village Idiots have organized themselves into shifts and are determined to screw up every thread.

 

[IllegalContact]

except that gronk was perfectly healthy during their regular season meeting. his being healthy doesn't guarantee anything.....except to all the 'geniuses' of the world

some of you are starting to sound like the 'we are set at every position' jet fan

and then the idea that carters and andersons availability is a testament to their athleticism....or lack of......really? you hanging your genius cap on that one? LOL

you sound like an idiot

Yeah.....OK.......

........how to be successful against a scheme like the giants.....

A healthy Gronk and the SB was a comfortable 2/3 score victory.

That would never occur to you because you are too dumb to comprehend. Since you are too dumb to grasp that, there is zero way you would ever understand the new possibilities.

Actually, based on the "quality" of your posts, you don't deserve to grasp it.

Yeah,.....Anderson and Carter....athletic guys.....signed off the street because nobody else wanted them.........

Steelers and Ravens......yeah...last I saw them they were getting lit up in the playoffs.

Hey Ian, we made the first baby steps in the draft on this type of "posting". Granted, not every poster is an Einstein but....C'mon man!!!

 

[IllegalContact]

I agree with your sentiment. That post was pretty stupid. Kind of like how the Giants scheme would be replicated in '08 and the Jets scheme would be replicated last year.

In regards to the Giants, all you need to do is injure our best offensive weapon, injure Brady in the third quarter, get several fumbles to bounce back to your own team, oh, and did I mention get 4 ridiculously athletic defensive ends on your defensive line who are all pass rushing specialists?

LOL....its a rough game......obviously, the giants 'out-toughed' the pats

it really just sounds like you are making excuses

 

[IllegalContact]

Based on the posting over the last few days, it appears the Village Idiots have organized themselves into shifts and are determined to screw up every thread.

because unlike you, I can't grasp the notion that the 2012 pats are going 16-0?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

LOL....its a rough game......obviously, the giants 'out-toughed' the pats

it really just sounds like you are making excuses

No, it just seems like you are naive in that you think teams will replicate the scheme of hitting Brady time and time again.

It's just silly to think that teams are just going to to replicate the Giants effectiveness, because they do not have a slew of athletic pass rushers and or have a personnel that matches up just right with the Patriots' offense. If I had a dime for every time I heard some "genius" proclaim the way to beat a team is to get to their quarterback, I sure would be rich. What do we always say is the way to beat our opponent? What have other fanbases been saying about Brady, and every other quarterback in the NFL, since the beginning of the modern passing era?

You beat a team by getting to the quarterback.

So, you are really brilliant to come up with awesome gameplan, and I'm sure the Patriots are in big trouble, because this is the first time I've ever heard that it's important for teams to put pressure on Brady. What do you think defensive coordinators are thinking about ALL offseason and weeks up to the game? Coverages that allow Brady to sit in the pocket for five seconds before giving up and throwing the ball away?

The Giants went 8-0 in the playoffs during their two SB runs, and they beat some pretty darn good QBs (on the road) in the process. The problems the Giants pose are not just problems for the Patriots.

But even our biggest nemesis needed a couple of breaks to beat us in the final minute. This isn't an excuse, it's just a fact. This isn't like we got whitewashed 38-0 because our scheme was exposed; we could have put the Giants away with one play in both of our losses to them.

 

[IllegalContact]

LOL....well, the giants are pretty consistent at it....... 3 in a row won pretty much exactly the same way. very similar how the pats had the colts number from 2001 through 2004. it could change some day, but unitl it does, it is what it is. the ravens replicated the feat, only that a dropped lee evans pass and a missed chip shot FG gave the game to the pats.

you can sit here and gawk at how dynamic the pats offense is, but smash mouth is not something within their capabilities. something that would come along very usefully during the post season. they obviously don't make the same calls on the defense come playoff time, so you can't continue to hope for the track meets

No, it just seems like you are naive in that you think teams will replicate the scheme of hitting Brady time and time again.

It's just silly to think that teams are just going to to replicate the Giants effectiveness, because they do not have a slew of athletic pass rushers and or have a personnel that matches up just right with the Patriots' offense. If I had a dime for every time I heard some "genius" proclaim the way to beat a team is to get to their quarterback, I sure would be rich. What do we always say is the way to beat our opponent? What have other fanbases been saying about Brady, and every other quarterback in the NFL, since the beginning of the modern passing era?

You beat a team by getting to the quarterback.

So, you are really brilliant to come up with awesome gameplan, and I'm sure the Patriots are in big trouble, because this is the first time I've ever heard that it's important for teams to put pressure on Brady. What do you think defensive coordinators are thinking about ALL offseason and weeks up to the game? Coverages that allow Brady to sit in the pocket for five seconds before giving up and throwing the ball away?

The Giants went 8-0 in the playoffs during their two SB runs, and they beat some pretty darn good QBs (on the road) in the process. The problems the Giants pose are not just problems for the Patriots.

But even our biggest nemesis needed a couple of breaks to beat us in the final minute. This isn't an excuse, it's just a fact. This isn't like we got whitewashed 38-0 because our scheme was exposed; we could have put the Giants away with one play in both of our losses to them.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

LOL....well, the giants are pretty consistent at it....... 3 in a row won pretty much exactly the same way. very similar how the pats had the colts number from 2001 through 2004. it could change some day, but unitl it does, it is what it is. the ravens replicated the feat, only that a dropped lee evans pass and a missed chip shot FG gave the game to the pats.

you can sit here and gawk at how dynamic the pats offense is, but smash mouth is not something within their capabilities. something that would come along very usefully during the post season. they obviously don't make the same calls on the defense come playoff time, so you can't continue to hope for the track meets

Yup

Classic chump, truthers, flat earthers, the yeti/sasquatch crowd right here at patsfans.com

Somehow an obscure event "lucked" the Patriots a victory over the Ravens. The Patriots are just continually lucky knocking the snot out of Baltimore and Pittsburgh for the past decade............................................................................................ but the Welker drop that would have sealed the game or the Blackburn INT would never had happened with a healthy Gronk or fumbles majically bouncing.......proves some systemic inferiority.

What's amazing is this is actually how these clowns think.