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Any way on earth the Patriots draft Brandon Graham?


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kindle, graham, hughes, or odrick at 22..make ur pick, im saying kindle, said it a year ago
 
Whichever one Miami leaves us?

that's my best bet, but there is no telling what bb will do on draft day. Karlos Dansby, is he an ilb or olb in a 34 defense? I haven't watched him play enough and never paid attention to him probably because i was too busy cussin kaczur or light or randy moss for slacking or not run blocking..ha:D
 
No chance. Doesn't even come close to fitting BB's 6'4 4.6 prototype.

I also may be the only person who doesn't like him as a first-round pick. I know people compare him to Woodley, but I don't think he is as strong as Woodley and isn't as tall, long, agile, or fast. I think the step-up in talent level in the NFL, especially the bigger and more agile OTs, will limit his production.

Woodley: 6'2 266 lbs. 4.66 40. 32 7/8-inch arm length.
Graham: 6'1 263 lbs. 4.71 40. 32 1/4-inch arm length.

I agree with this, i think him and Kindle are both 2nd round talents, and both will make it past the first round.

I don't want a OLB with the first rounder, i think it's a tough position to judge because most don't play the position in college, and over the past few years they tend to have fallen in the draft a bit.

I know most people dont want to hear this, but i think this is a good year to trade down with all this depth.
 
I agree with this, i think him and Kindle are both 2nd round talents, and both will make it past the first round.

I don't want a OLB with the first rounder, i think it's a tough position to judge because most don't play the position in college, and over the past few years they tend to have fallen in the draft a bit.

I know most people dont want to hear this, but i think this is a good year to trade down with all this depth.

problem with trading down to far is we wont have our pick of the top olb pass rusher that we wont and i believe atop our board is graham, kindle, hughes, and maybe sapp...these olbs are prolly going to be taken between 22 and 32..whoever we pick may be a hair of a reach but i think it's our smartest move to stay at 22 and take graham, kindle, hughes, or i guess odrick..
 
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No chance. Doesn't even come close to fitting BB's 6'4 4.6 prototype.

I also may be the only person who doesn't like him as a first-round pick. I know people compare him to Woodley, but I don't think he is as strong as Woodley and isn't as tall, long, agile, or fast. I think the step-up in talent level in the NFL, especially the bigger and more agile OTs, will limit his production.

Woodley: 6'2 266 lbs. 4.66 40. 32 7/8-inch arm length.
Graham: 6'1 263 lbs. 4.71 40. 32 1/4-inch arm length.

Don't know where you got your numbers buddy, but those are wrong.

Woodley was measured in at 6'1.4", 266 lbs, with a 4.74 40 yard dash.
Graham measured 6'1.3", 268 lbs, with a 4.71 40 yard dash.

That would make your analysis completely false. Graham is nearly exactly the same height, and is faster. As for agility, that would come down to watching tape, and I didn't watch tape on Woodley back in the day.

And Belichick clearly is drifting away from the "prototype." Adalius Thomas, Derrick Burgess, Banta-Cain, and Ninkovich, the Pats 4 top OLB's last year, were all 6'2" or shorter.
 
Don't know where you got your numbers buddy, but those are wrong.

Woodley was measured in at 6'1.4", 266 lbs, with a 4.74 40 yard dash.
Graham measured 6'1.3", 268 lbs, with a 4.71 40 yard dash.

That would make your analysis completely false. Graham is nearly exactly the same height, and is faster. As for agility, that would come down to watching tape, and I didn't watch tape on Woodley back in the day.

And Belichick clearly is drifting away from the "prototype." Adalius Thomas, Derrick Burgess, Banta-Cain, and Ninkovich, the Pats 4 top OLB's last year, were all 6'2" or shorter.

I got my numbers from CBS Sportsline/NFL Draft Scout, a pretty reliable source. The discrepancy in our numbers is likely a result of Pro Day, personal workout, and combine numbers.

Whether Graham is similar in measurables to Woodley is irrelevant as far as the Patriots are concerned. Woodley plays in the **** LeBeau zone-blitz 3-4 and is thus relied much less on to set the edge in the run game. Sure Woodley would probably succeed here situationally, but it is unlikely BB would take a chance on someone he projected as situational high in the first 2 or 3 rounds unless he felt he was truly special. I was simply using the difference in their measurables to further add to my point that from what I have observed on the field, even the pointless (from a Pats perspective) comparison of Graham to Woodley is off-base.

As far as the veteran acquisitions you listed, I'll address each individually and explain why they don't indicate BB doesn't adhere to his 6'4 4.6 prototype as you claim.

Adalius Thomas: His 2000 combine numbers indicate he was 6'3 270 lbs and ran a 4.56. Has very long arms and had proven he could play in the NFL with the Ravens before BB acquired him. Also was valued in part because of his ILB/OLB versatility.
NFL Draft Combine History - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

Tully-Banta Cain: Doesn't fit the prototype, your right. But was drafted in 7th round and has been best used situationally as a pass rusher. When he has been asked to be a base 3-4 OLB on run downs, he struggles setting the edge. See the 2006 AFC divisional game v. San Diego (in which he was benched the following week v. Indy) and his unremarkable stint with San Francisco.

Derrick Burgess: Acquired in the preseason because BB was desperate for a pass rush in any way shape or form. Like TBC, was used as little as possible on run downs in the base 3-4. Notice how Woods and AD got most of the time on 1st and 2nd down in 2009.

Rob Ninkovich: According to NFL Draft Scout, he measured in at 6'3 260 lbs. at the combine and ran a 4.71 at his Pro Day in 2006. Again, close to the prototype and was a waiver wire acquisition.
Rob Ninkovich, Purdue, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

My point is that even when BB has varied slightly from the prototype, it has been for a situational guy and has not been with a high draft pick. Given his hsitory and my best translations of Belichick-Neese, I highly doubt BB will spend a high pick on someone he deems to be only a situational player. What the Patriots need is an OLB who can rush the passer and has the size, length and strength to stay on the field all 3 downs. BB has deemed this type of player to be someone who is 6'4 and can run in the 4.6s. Given this, it is highly unlikely BB spends the top 60 pick required to select player such as Graham or Hughes.
 
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I got my numbers from CBS Sportsline/NFL Draft Scout, a pretty reliable source. The discrepancy in our numbers is likely a result of Pro Day, personal workout, and combine numbers.

.

NFL DRAFT SCOUT is definitely a good tool to go back and look at how others players performed. They have woodley measurements at:

40 Time: 4.74 40 Low: 4.68 40 High: 4.84

Height: 6-2 Weight: 266
 
Here' s my interest in this entire conversation.. We need to draft someone who can come in on day ONE and make a play.. I'm sick and tired of having to wait for players to develop in year 2 or 3.. NO offense but the way the league is built now, you can't do that.. By year 4 when the player is hitting his stride, we'll have to pay out because he'll be either a UFA or RFA..

It worked in 01-07 because we had Vets that were in the system for sometime or played with BB when Parcells was here (milloy, law, brusci).. When Seymour, Warren, Wilfork, Light, ect came in, they were starting by their mid rookie season or were impact players in year 2..

We need that player.. If its a so deep of a draft, we need players on the field contributing.. Not learning a flawed system that takes years to learn.. This is my biggest complaint with our defensive system..
 
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LaMarr Woodley, Michigan, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

This CBS Sports link draft profile of Woodley, which is copyright property of NFL Draft Scout, has Woodley running a 4.62 during his Michigan Pro Day.
Pretty standard disparity, many Pro-Day 40's tend to be a tenth of a second faster, you will frequently find that some colleges have notoriously fast surfaces - Penn State and I believe Michigan tend to fall into this group - when compared to Combine "official" times. Mike Mayock used to harp on that when explaining timing differences.
 
To be honest I'm not even looking at 40 times when evaluating prospects. The measurables I care about are 3 cone drill for receivers and corners, short shuttle for non-rushing linebackers, arm length for offensive linemen, 10 yard split for rushing defenders, and above all else.....


Production.
 
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