An Achilles’ heel is a fatal weakness in spite of overall strength

[Synovia]

Come on the defense had the flu. I think the sun was in their eyes and the crowd noise pumped into the dome distracted them too. That 3 TD lead at halftime just wasn't enough, the offense should have known that the defense was just trying to let some clock run off while allowing the Colts to move up and down the field, and scored more. How can you blame the D when the O didnt even score 80 points or have 50 minutes t.o.p.?

That 3 TD lead that they scored 14 points of, right?

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

In the second half of the indy game, the whole team was gassed. Consider it was the 4th road game in 5 weeks and after a trip to the west coast.

Look at another active thread and think what it's like to be a Vikings fan.

 

[borg]

No, average starter is not a JAG.

Jag means "JUST A GUY".


"JUST A GUY" means replacement level. Average is not replacement level.



Average and replacement level are two entirely different things. JAGs are guys who can be replaced by street free agents with no decline in performance. Deltha o'neil was a JAG.

Insert a picture of Tully Bunta-Cain here...or Monty Beisel, or Doug Gabriel. But don't include Redd or Crable because they are not yet JAGworthy

 

[AzPatsFan]

The QB sub played a hell of a lot better than the OLB subs.

But he had four years of grooming... The OLBs subs didn't, except for Woods who in his third start went on IR. The others were rookies.

 

[Deus Irae]

Come on the defense had the flu. I think the sun was in their eyes and the crowd noise pumped into the dome distracted them too. That 3 TD lead at halftime just wasn't enough, the offense should have known that the defense was just trying to let some clock run off while allowing the Colts to move up and down the field, and scored more. How can you blame the D when the O didnt even score 80 points or have 50 minutes t.o.p.?

Because they gave up more than 30 points?

Look, people look for scapegoats, and Caldwell (and the receiving corps as a whole) was an easy target. But the reality of the Patriots in recent years is that the team's strength has been what's failed it in the playoffs. In 2007, the #1 scoring offense in history scored only 14 points in the Super Bowl. People blamed the defense even though only 1 team in history has won a Super Bowl when scoring just 14 points (ironically, it's the Dolphins that did it). People blame the offense from the year before when it was the defense that collapsed as the Colts scored 32 points in the second half.

In both cases, it was the team's strength that failed.

 

[hwc]

The achilles heel last year was Brady's injury. That would be the same achilles heel this year.

My theory is that playing with a lead was a key part of Belichick's strategy to cover weaknesses in a rebuilding defense last year. Both the pass rush and the secondary magically improve when you've got your opponents 17 points down.

 

[mgteich]

Both Woods and Banta-Cain have had much more experience playing OLB for the patriots than Cassel did playing QB. And yes, Crable and Redd are wildcard possibilities.

But he had four years of grooming... The OLBs subs didn't, except for Woods who in his third start went on IR. The others were rookies.

 

[capetide]

The achilles heel last year was Brady's injury. That would be the same achilles heel this year.

Yes, exactly.

BTW Especially in the salary cap era, EVERY team has an area of weakness. Even the 2008-2009 Steelers. Even the 2001, 2003, and 2004 SB Champion Patriots. Doesn't anybody here remember the no-name wide receiver corps, over-the-hill free agents, or the free agent/7th round defensive backs during those SB years???? SB's are won despite glaring weakness and when they are, those weaknesses are fogotten. When results fall somewhat short of a SB victory, those weaknesses become an "achilles heel".

 

[Ring 6]

The defense scored 7 points directly. The special teams scored a second touchdown by putting the ball on the opponents 20 yard line. The offense scored a total of 24 points against a terrible defense during a fast paced game.


I don't expect the offense to score 50 points. I expect them to get a handful of first downs in the 2nd half. The defense held the colts to much less than their average yards per play, and Peyton Manning had one of his worst games of the season as far as ratings go, but unfortunately, so did Brady.

You are defending a defense that blew the largest lead in Championship game history based on yards per play and QB rating. Are you insane?
You are out of touch with reality. I'm moving on to discuss something with sanity.

 

[Synovia]

Because they gave up more than 30 points?

Look, people look for scapegoats, and Caldwell (and the receiving corps as a whole) was an easy target. But the reality of the Patriots in recent years is that the team's strength has been what's failed it in the playoffs. In 2007, the #1 scoring offense in history scored only 14 points in the Super Bowl. People blamed the defense even though only 1 team in history has won a Super Bowl when scoring just 14 points (ironically, it's the Dolphins that did it). People blame the offense from the year before when it was the defense that collapsed and surrendered 32 points in the second half.

In both cases, it was the team's strength that failed.

Again Dues, football is a game of field position, and looking at points scored and points allowed as judges of the strength of each side of the field is infantile. No, neither side played well.

Facts:

The patriots offense had consistently better starting field position than the Colts offense. (36yd line vs 24yd line)

Despite the consistently great starting field position, the Patriots offense scored only one touchdown that did not directly result from a turnover.

The Patriots offense average 21 yards per possesion in the 2nd half, 17 yards less than the NFL average.

 

[Synovia]

You are defending a defense that blew the largest lead in Championship game history based on yards per play and QB rating. Are you insane?
You are out of touch with reality. I'm moving on to discuss something with sanity.

Manning had a 79.1 rating for that game. What the hell are you talking about?

 

[Ring 6]

Because they gave up more than 30 points?

Look, people look for scapegoats, and Caldwell (and the receiving corps as a whole) was an easy target. But the reality of the Patriots in recent years is that the team's strength has been what's failed it in the playoffs. In 2007, the #1 scoring offense in history scored only 14 points in the Super Bowl. People blamed the defense even though only 1 team in history has won a Super Bowl when scoring just 14 points (ironically, it's the Dolphins that did it). People blame the offense from the year before when it was the defense that collapsed as the Colts scored 32 points in the second half.

In both cases, it was the team's strength that failed.

I was being sarcastic

 

[Ring 6]

Manning had a 79.1 rating for that game. What the hell are you talking about?

So. How many points did he put on the board. You are trying to tell me the defense played well because while blowing the biggest lead in CG history, they held down Mannings QB rating?

 

[Deus Irae]

Again Dues, football is a game of field position, and looking at points scored and points allowed as judges of the strength of each side of the field is infantile. No, neither side played well.

Facts:

The patriots offense had consistently better starting field position than the Colts offense. (36yd line vs 24yd line)

Despite the consistently great starting field position, the Patriots offense scored only one touchdown that did not directly result from a turnover.

The Patriots offense average 21 yards per possesion in the 2nd half, 17 yards less than the NFL average.

I understand the game, and I understand that it helps a defense if the offense can stay on the field. Now, can you tell me what the average amount of points allowed per half by a #2 ranked defense is?

The Colts scored on 6 of their last 8 possessions in the game. The Patriots couldn't even slow that offense down, for the most part. TOP in those scores:

2:59
6:47
And then the floodgates opened
2:50
3:01
2:11
1:17

Blaming the offense is just ridiculous. It's not the fault of the offense that Bruschi was on the sidelines while Alexander was getting torched.

 

[Deus Irae]

I was being sarcastic

My apologies for missing the sarcasm then....

 

[Ring 6]

No, average starter is not a JAG.

Jag means "JUST A GUY".


"JUST A GUY" means replacement level. Average is not replacement level.



Average and replacement level are two entirely different things. JAGs are guys who can be replaced by street free agents with no decline in performance. Deltha o'neil was a JAG.

There are many starters that are JAGS. Just because you want to redefine it, doesnt mean what Bill Parcells meant when he coined the phrase has changed.

 

[Synovia]

So. How many points did he put on the board. You are trying to tell me the defense played well because while blowing the biggest lead in CG history, they held down Mannings QB rating?

No, I'm trying to tell you that the defense isn't the only side of the ball responsible for points. FOOTBALL IS A GAME OF FIELD POSITION.


When your offense is consistently going 3 and out, your defense is going to give up more points.


6 8:13 6:50 1:23 Kickoff NE 18 3 8 0 8 0 NE 26 Punt
7 4:00 1:25 2:35 Kickoff IND 21 5 21 0 21 2 * IND 6 Touchdown
8 13:24 11:06 2:18 Kickoff NE 27 3 8 0 8 0 NE 35 Punt
9 10:26 7:42 2:44 Punt IND 43 6 38 -5 33 2 * IND 10 Field Goal
10 5:31 3:49 1:42 Kickoff NE 46 5 29 0 29 1 IND 25 Field Goal
11 3:22 2:17 1:05 Punt NE 40 3 11 -5 6 0 NE 46 Punt
12 1:00 0:16 0:44 Kickoff NE 21 4 34 0 34 2 IND 45 Interception


Those are the Pats possesions in the 2nd half. The Touchdown is after a 79 yard Ellis Hobbs return.

No possesions longer than 2 and a half minutes. No long drives. Just 3 or 4 downs followed by a punt/fieldgoal/turnover after the defense put them in great field position.

The offense was TERRIBLE in the 2nd half.

 

[Synovia]

There are many starters that are JAGS. Just because you want to redefine it, doesnt mean what Bill Parcells meant when he coined the phrase has changed.

Bill Parcells meant Replacement Level. And yes, there are starters who are replacement level, but not a lot of them. Why? Because they get replaced so easily.


"Average" is not a bad thing. 50% of the starters in the NFL are average starters or worse.

 

[Ring 6]

No, I'm trying to tell you that the defense isn't the only side of the ball responsible for points. FOOTBALL IS A GAME OF FIELD POSITION.


When your offense is consistently going 3 and out, your defense is going to give up more points.


6 8:13 6:50 1:23 Kickoff NE 18 3 8 0 8 0 NE 26 Punt
7 4:00 1:25 2:35 Kickoff IND 21 5 21 0 21 2 * IND 6 Touchdown
8 13:24 11:06 2:18 Kickoff NE 27 3 8 0 8 0 NE 35 Punt
9 10:26 7:42 2:44 Punt IND 43 6 38 -5 33 2 * IND 10 Field Goal
10 5:31 3:49 1:42 Kickoff NE 46 5 29 0 29 1 IND 25 Field Goal
11 3:22 2:17 1:05 Punt NE 40 3 11 -5 6 0 NE 46 Punt
12 1:00 0:16 0:44 Kickoff NE 21 4 34 0 34 2 IND 45 Interception


Those are the Pats possesions in the 2nd half. The Touchdown is after a 79 yard Ellis Hobbs return.

No possesions longer than 2 and a half minutes. No long drives. Just 3 or 4 downs followed by a punt/fieldgoal/turnover after the defense put them in great field position.

The offense was TERRIBLE in the 2nd half.

How does that justify allowing 30+ points.
You are telling me if an offense has a bad game, the defense is justified in allowing 68 points?
You are trying to excuse a defense that couldn't stop the Colts AT ALL.
There is no doubt the offense didn't have a good 2nd half.
But the defense went out on the field to stop the other team a number of times and failed miserably. With a big cushion.
A mediocre or below average offensive half does not compare the THE WORST HALF OF DEFENSIVE FOOTBALL EVER IN A CONFERENCE CHAMPIONSHIP GAME.

 

[BradyFTW!]

So. How many points did he put on the board. You are trying to tell me the defense played well because while blowing the biggest lead in CG history, they held down Mannings QB rating?

I think he's trying to say that the offense, by being unable to stay on the field or advance the ball, played a role by putting the defense in a no-win position. And that the only reason why we had a 3 TD lead in the first place was because the defense scored two of them. Nobody's arguing that the defense played well (it obviously didn't), but to collapse that badly both sides pretty much have to be at fault.

This really isn't all that complicated, just go back and watch the game.