Already sick of "African American coaches" non-story

[onegameatatime]

I was agreeing that this situation was a little overblown, but some of these comments go too far and ignore history.


It's one thing to try to be color-blind, but that does not mean we ignore history. Just because something can be said about white people does not make it equally apply the other way. When you're on top, you need to be able to take it a little more and be careful how you dish it. That's why if you manage people and have a good relationship, you can take a little ribbing, but need to be more careful how you give it back.

I would not dismiss the role model aspect either. One white guy posted that he was not inspired to be a coach because other white people were. Of course, you probably saw white people in many roles. I doubt a black kid would go into coaching just because Smith and Dungy are in the SB, but maybe it's a factor.

In short, I would not play it up too much, but I do not think it is nothing, either.

 

[oldskool138]

For those of you who think it's a non-story or racist, you need to imagine what it would be like if you and your people had been brought to someone else's country in chains, had been slaves until the mid 19th Century, had experienced legal discrimination until 40 years ago and had it made damn clear to you that your face didn't fit in many clubs and societies since then because you are black.
In such a "colour blind" society, why has there never been a non-white President? Why are most players in the glamour position of Quarterback white, when 75% of players are black? Why are most CEOs, Ivy League professors, actors, newcasters and rich people in general white? If you think that's BS, go to the richest areas in town you know and count how many people you see who are black in contrast to how many white people you see.
Why, in the "colour blind" society, has Chris Leak admitted to receiving racist mail? Was it sent by black people?

My family came down from Canada back around 1900. They were ridiculed because they didn't speak English (French Canadians) and were discriminated against. But, they stuck with it and my family lives comfortably. The Irish couldn't get jobs in Boston when they came over. Same goes for the Polish and other peoples who settled in New England. To say that blacks were the only minority group to be discriminated against in the USA is false.

Why wasn't a big deal made of Belechick and Schottenheimer game? A German vs. a Croatian! Great story line! See, you can get silly when you bring a person's race into it. Sports is supposed to be the great equalizer. Remember Jesse Owens in the 1936 Olympics.

 

[ClosingTime]

Oh boy. The ignorance and bias in this thread is downright scary and prove the contrary of what many are asserting: that racism no longer exists and therefore tshould not be mentioned. Without picking apart some of the more inventive arguments in this thread I will offer a simple poll result.

CNN asked Americans if they would supprt a black president: 60 percent sid yes. And this number is likely inflated because many who answer yes in a poll would not actually do it in the seclusion of a poll booth. So there are more than 40 percent of Americans that would not supprt a black for president.

I will say, though, get over it. Blacks can achieve anything they want to but too many simply don't want to.

Other than the poll proving that this statement is inaccurate all I can say s...um....WOW!!! Now I remember why I left Boston.

 

[BelichickFan]

CNN asked Americans if they would supprt a black president: 60 percent sid yes. And this number is likely inflated because many who answer yes in a poll would not actually do it in the seclusion of a poll booth. So there are more than 40 percent of Americans that would not supprt a black for president.

I don't disagree about that. There's enough anti-blacks to skim off the small percentage that it would take to move from winning to losing.

Other than the poll proving that this statement is inaccurate all I can say s...um....WOW!!! Now I remember why I left Boston.

Not to worry, I live in CA. I stand behind what I said, blacks, whites, women, men, whatever, can all be successful, they just have to choose to be.

 

[ClosingTime]

My family came down from Canada back around 1900. They were ridiculed because they didn't speak English (French Canadians) and were discriminated against. But, they stuck with it and my family lives comfortably. The Irish couldn't get jobs in Boston when they came over. Same goes for the Polish and other peoples who settled in New England. To say that blacks were the only minority group to be discriminated against in the USA is false.

Were the Irish and Poles brought to this country in shackles, separated from any every single family member, placed together with members of other nationalities with differnt languages and customs, enslaved, raped, murdered and continually barred from education for over 400 years.

But you all are right, the glorious civil rights act fixed all that in that past 50 years. They should just lay off the story because you are sivck about hearing about race lo these many years of racial cohesion this country has enjoyed.

 

[oldskool138]

Other than the poll proving that this statement is inaccurate all I can say s...um....WOW!!! Now I remember why I left Boston.

Yeah, you're right. Boston is a racist city.

When was the last time someone you know who happened to be black got denied a job due to the color of his skin? Not perceived but actually told, "We don't hire blacks". Back during the huge influx of Irish to the Boston area signs went up all over the city "Irish need not apply" and that was 100 yrs ago. We don't live in a perfect world but it's a heck of a lot better than those days IMO.

 

[gomezcat]

Oh, gomez, you came SO CLOSE to getting me to say something I avoid desperately (not racist but wouldn't be taken well). If I were ever to say it, today would be the day.

I will say, though, get over it. Blacks can achieve anything they want to but too many simply don't want to.

I'm white, British, university-educated and middle-class so have nothing to get over. I have never felt held back by my colour and never will, hopefully. I would never pretend that life is as easy for me as it is for people who grew up poor and black on housing projects.

 

[ClosingTime]

I don't disagree about that. There's enough anti-blacks to skim off the small percentage that it would take to move from winning to losing.

Well here's helping you acheive your dreams of reading comprehenion. This small percentage is 40 percent of all Americans and very conservative esimates would say this is at least 50 percent of Americans. Again, to be clear, that is over 50 percent of Americans would not support a black for president. Any black. No matter what. Skim off a small percentage? Umm...ok.
Then you consider that around 12 percent of the population is black and presumably would support a black man for president and the number of whites that would vote for a black president is a, you guess it, "a small minority."
So clearly blacks cannot acheive anything, and if they can they do it against a stacked deck.

Not to worry, I live in CA. I stand behind what I said, blacks, whites, women, men, whatever, can all be successful, they just have to choose to be.

You can stand behind what you said if you like, you should just wear a condom.

 

[BelichickFan]

I'm white, British, university-educated and middle-class so have nothing to get over. I have never felt held back by my colour and never will, hopefully. I would never pretend that life is as easy for me as it is for people who grew up poor and black on housing projects.

Ha ha. Very funny. Who said anything about life being equally easy for everyone ? Does everyone have a chance ? Yes. Do some people have to work harder ? Yes. Too bad. I wish I was Bob Kraft's son. I'm not. Too bad.

 

[gomezcat]

Ha ha. Very funny. Who said anything about life being equally easy for everyone ? Does everyone have a chance ? Yes. Do some people have to work harder ? Yes. Too bad. I wish I was Bob Kraft's son. I'm not. Too bad.

Okey doke. I still feel it's a good news story though. It shows that people can make it from a disadvantaged background.

 

[ClosingTime]

Yeah, you're right. Boston is a racist city.

At least you agree on this so aren't totally clueless. Ever spend any time in Roxbury? Ever look at the conditions there and the investment the city puts into those neighborhoods as opposed to others? Boston is the most segregated city outside of LA.

When was the last time someone you know who happened to be black got denied a job due to the color of his skin? Not perceived but actually told, "We don't hire blacks".

Why would an employer tell a person that? They just don't hire. Please, try not to deal in ends of the spectrum arguements.

Back during the huge influx of Irish to the Boston area signs went up all over the city "Irish need not apply" and that was 100 yrs ago. We don't live in a perfect world but it's a heck of a lot better than those days IMO.

Yes it is better. What is your point.
When your poor irish folks were reading signs that read 'Irish need not apply", blacks were reading signs that said, "Black need not apply, we'll grab you out of your house and make you work."
A minor difference I know.

 

[gomezcat]

Were the Irish and Poles brought to this country in shackles, separated from any every single family member, placed together with members of other nationalities with differnt languages and customs, enslaved, raped, murdered and continually barred from education for over 400 years.

But you all are right, the glorious civil rights act fixed all that in that past 50 years. They should just lay off the story because you are sivck about hearing about race lo these many years of racial cohesion this country has enjoyed.

Closing Time, I am awaiting all of those pics from wealthy American suburbs, showing me that 12% or more of rich people are black. Technically, I could be wrong as I have never been to the US. I would put a large sum of money on not being though.

 

[BelichickFan]

Well here's helping you acheive your dreams of reading comprehenion. This small percentage is 40 percent of all Americans and very conservative esimates would say this is at least 50 percent of Americans.

The wording of what you said sounded misleading, I'd have to see the poll.

You said "CNN asked Americans if they would supprt a black president: 60 percent sid yes."

But you didn't say how many undecideds there were. There may have been 38%. Lots of assumptions could have been made about the actual candidate as one is running now. Bottom line, I don't believe the number.

You can stand behind what you said if you like, you should just wear a condom.

Too late, baby :rocker:

 

[ClosingTime]

Closing Time, I am awaiting all of those pics from wealthy American suburbs, showing me that 12% or more of rich people are black. Technically, I could be wrong as I have never been to the US. I would put a large sum of money on not being though.

Where did I say this? I said 12 percent of the total US population.

 

[ClosingTime]

The wording of what you said sounded misleading, I'd have to see the poll.

You said "CNN asked Americans if they would supprt a black president: 60 percent sid yes."

But you didn't say how many undecideds there were. There may have been 38%. Lots of assumptions could have been made about the actual candidate as one is running now. Bottom line, I don't believe the number.

There is no undecided. Would you support a black for president? You can't answer, "I dunno."

 

[oldskool138]

Yes it is better. What is your point.
When your poor irish folks were reading signs that read 'Irish need not apply", blacks were reading signs that said, "Black need not apply, we'll grab you out of your house and make you work."
A minor difference I know.

Please if we want to talk about today in relation to history, can we stick to the last 30 or so years? I know you'll come back and say that I don't want to talk about the distant past because I don't want to deal with the slavery issue. I'll say this, slavery was horrible and is a black eye on this country...but it was abollished in 1865. Sweeping reforms were made in the 60's. It's now been 40 years since then. Race should not matter. Isn't this the great melting pot? In the end, Dungy and Smith are two men who coach two NFL teams, both of which are in the Super Bowl. That's it.

 

[BelichickFan]

There is no undecided. Would you support a black for president? You can't answer, "I dunno."

Sure you can. Lots of people may have though "I dunno, depends who it is". I understand what you're saying but I think you're taking the poll as an absolute statement of fact which it isn't.

 

[ClosingTime]

OK, in the last 30-40 years a predominant amount of the players have been black but there are still very few black coaches. Very few have been able to transition into coaching after playing. Most coaches in college and pros are former players. Explain this anomaly?

The lack of representation in the college ranks is sickening. NFL isn't much better. To the NFL's credit, they recognized the bias against black coaches and instituted a rule to make some attempt to level the playing field.

I think Dungy and Smith being the first two black head coaches in the SB is a great story and is a sign of progress. But I also find it disheartening tht not an hour after the game I see posts such as this saying, "I'm sick of hearing about it."

 

[BelichickFan]

I really don't want to say much more due to the risk of being misunderstood. But, yeah, I'm sick of hearing about it.

Hey you're a Steeler fan right ? You've got your black coach . . . smile

 

[ClosingTime]

Sure you can. Lots of people may have though "I dunno, depends who it is". I understand what you're saying but I think you're taking the poll as an absolute statement of fact which it isn't.

If you respond "It depends who it is" the pollster asks the question again stating that it is not about any particular person and to answer yes or no.

If someone asked you would you support a white president, think there would be a lot (say 38 percent) that said, 'um..I dunno..depends on who it is." Get my drift?

And if this large a percentage wouldn't supprt a black president, would they supprt a black CEO, a black chairman of the board, a black middle manager?

Say what you want about the poll but it is very telling. At very least it completely debunks these claims that, 'hey, this isn't the 1950s, everyone is equal, racism doesn't exist and we as a nation are all united holding hands and singing kumbaya."