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Almost 39% of Pats "FANS" have lost faith?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by DaBruinz, Mar 26, 2006.

  1. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    I posted this on the Globe message board after reading that almost 39% of past fans no long believe in BB and Pioli.

    I have to say that I am truly perplexed. Almost 39%% of the "FANS" of this team have lost faith in BB and Pioli? Did I miss us winning 3 SBs in the last 5 years?

    Oh, wait, I get it. People are upset because of Willie, Adam ,and David going. Those 3 took the money and ran. Can't blame them. In each case, they got over-paid. Willie, You were great as a Patriots, but at 34, you aren't worth 4 mill a year. Adam, you were one of the most clutch in history, but stop having your father lie about the fact that you wanted to stay. You didn't. You wanted to kick in warm weather or a dome so you could increase the length of your career. Especially when it was becoming obvious that the Patriots were trying to go for it more on the opponents 30-35 yard line. Its also been 3 years since you made a 50 yarder and your kicks aren't getting into the endzone enough. Its too bad you just kissed a lifetime of endorsements goodbye. I hope it was worth sitting at home every February.

    As for David, 5 mill a year for a guy who hasn't ever had more than 60 catches, even when he was the primary receiver for 6 straight weeks at one point Sorry, but you aren't a #1 receiver. You're a #2 and you should have been happy with that. But reality is that it was about the money. And the Titans treated you right. Can't fault you for that.

    The off-season is about transition. Players come and players go. We have to deal with it. But, I will tell you right now, that I would rather let those 3 walk than keep them and face the almost certain losses of Seymour, Branch, and Koppen (provided he returns to form), to free agency in 2007.

    I am sure that some surats are going to beat the WRONG BOGUS drum, but what WRONG hasn't mention is that his AGENT is the one who was feeding him all the info on David Givens. Why? Because David and Wrong Bogus (Ron Borges for those of you who haven't figured it out) share the same Agent. That should put a different perspective on things. Especially in light of Wrong's constant attack on BB about the fact that BB's agent and Adam's former agent both worked for Neil Cornich.

    I am also sure that some surats are going to try and point to last off-season and last year and how the Pats played as signs that the bandwagon is breaking down. The most common rants are that BB messed up in the off-season getting Beisel, Brown, and Starks. I think that the only mistake that BB made was not knowing the phsyical health of Ted Johnson. Ted Johnson retiring right before training camp was probably the single biggest blow to BB's plan last year. That forced 2 players to the ILB position who had never played there before in Brown and Beisel. Beisel was signed as a project. To try and develop another Bruschi like player who could take over for Tedy when he finally decides to retire. Brown was signed as back-up or, at worst, to play opposite Ted Johnson.

    Then, a lot of things started happening. Ryan Claridge, who looked very promising in camp, went down to injury. Mike Vrabel was injured in camp and basically missed his trianing for the ILB position. Stephen Neal looks like his shoulder wasn't healthy coming out of camp. Guss Scott and James Sanders weren't healthy coming out of camp. Jarvis Green's shoulder was banged up coming out of camp as well.

    After coming out of camp with 10 DBs, the Pats lost 6 of those 10 to the IR.( Harrison, G. Scott, C. Scott, R. Gay, Duane Starks, and Ty Poole) by week 8. Wilfork wasn't playing well. Seymour missed some big games due to injury. Beisel and Brown showed that they hadn't picked up enough of the defense to be effective. Duane Starks played poorly because of a bum shoulder. Eugene Wilson was trying too hard to cover the deficiencies in the secondary as the "VET" back there.

    I mean, seriously people, at one point, the Patriots had 4 defensive starters out (Ty Poole, Richard Seymour, Tedy Bruschi, and Rodney Harrison). And that doesn't include not having Ted Johnson in there. That is a LOT for a defense and a team to over-come.

    It wasn't until players started getting "healthy," that things started changing. Bruschi returned. Seymour returned. Vrabel was healthy enough to move inside. Ellis Hobbs stepped up. Wilfork changed his technique and was playing significantly better. Wilson stopped pressing and then the late addition of Hawkins helped solidify the defense for the last 5 games.

    You can't fault BB for not knowing the future. There is no way he could have known that Light, Koppen, and Harrison would be lost for the year to catastrophic injuries. There is no way he could have know that they'd lose C. Scott, Starks, Poole, G. Scott and Randall Gay to injuries by week 9. Having that many injuries that take away that many players from one position would make it hard for ANY coach. And please, no one knows that if they had kept Ty Law that he would have been healthy all year.

    When people stop and take a step back and look at REALITY, they will see that, in the era of the salary cap, we can't keep our favorite players their entire career unless they want to stay for a reasonable price. Its why I don't expect we'll ever see Tedy Bruschi go through this. Its why I don't see Tom Brady ever going through this. For all the other players, they will have to make a choice. Will it be to stick it out and earn the hearts of some of the greatest fans on the earth while making a modest football income and be part of Patriot Lore, or will it be to get as much money as they can and kiss the lifetime of endorsements and love from the fans goodbye.

    BB and Pioli have done everything they can to earn our faith. A bump in the road because of catastrophic injuries and the loss of some free agents shouldn't cause us to lose that faith. If it does, the we weren't ever truly fans. We were bandwagoners. And we don't deserve the gift of 3 SB CHAMPIONSHIPS that the Pats, with BB and Pioli at the helm, have given us.
     
  2. p8ryts

    p8ryts Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Fair weather fans

    Come and go with the tide!
     
  3. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I sat through rain and lightning storms in the foulest weather imaginable for 8 games a season in the late 70's and 80's. If that Schaefer stadium sh!thole didn't stop me, then how does this offseason plan to? I'm a Patriot fan...thick or thin, up or down....I could care less about craving success...and there is a core group of long time fans that are exactly the same....you play in red white and blue and we'll show up, I don't care how many Tony Easons or Joe Kapps you trot out there, we're dug in til death do us part
     
  4. Krugman

    Krugman Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    #87 Jersey

    Not me...

    Still a firm believer....see what they say next December when we are on our way to another superbowl....
     
  5. Remix 6

    Remix 6 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    I believe in them still

    Givens - 2nd WR for us, asking for #1 money. he wasnt supposed to be as good as he got being a 7th rounder. Maybe replace him for less?

    Vinatieri - I dont know if anyone else noticed but last year he seemed on decline a bit..why pay him a lot of guranteed money.

    McGinest - Hes very old, we didnt want to pay him that much money of bonus i think that we owed. We released and were going to resign him..he probably got an offer from us but I think Browns overspent on him having 3 years MAX left. Hes still productive but Bill wants youth and speed and youth doesnt fit Mr. McGinest

    I admit, Im sad about these guys moving on but we let other people in past go and we replaced them well.
     
  6. fgssand

    fgssand PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #17 Jersey

    Good, let the little fair weather fans crawl back under the rock they come from and stay away for a while. There will then be plenty of room at training camp and maybe even the EBAY ticket prices will fall as the whine and cheese crowd finds something else to do.

    Of course, as soon as the Patriots demonstrate the utter superiority over the rest of the NFL - the bastids will be back. You can set your watch by it as that will be just about the time the Colts trolls become harder and harder to find. Do the Colts really think they will achieve success without their star running back or significant losses on the defense that was just starting to look good? Oh right, I forgot, an overpaid kicker will solve all their woes.

    Is it really that hard to look at how a team was built and realize NOTHING has changed in Foxboro. Why mess with success? Last time I checked, we came within a very rare poor team performance of yet another Superbowl win - in yet another season spent playing awesome football down the stretch overcoming adversity the likes of which no team has ever had to deal with.

    If this team ever happens to have an injury free year - watch out NFL, 19-0 just may happen.

    Honestly, having followed this team for over 45 years now, I could not be any more confident with ownership & the leadership it has chosen.
     
  7. Pats726

    Pats726 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    I agree..that is what the 40% is..fair weather and NOT understanding what this FO does. It wins Super Bowls and it is time for transition as the team gets older....the team will do fine. Be patient.
     
  8. Mainefan

    Mainefan Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    Atta boy, DaBruinz. I'm sure at the end of this season, every last one of those 39% will claim they were among the 61% who knew better than to mistrust BB and SP.

    Those 39% all believe they're smarter and they know more about football than the Patriots' front office. Oh really? They also have the patience of a housefly. Some fans.
     
  9. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I had season's tickets in 206 until they built the new stadium...they sent me a letter and said if I wanted to remain a season ticket holder all they could give me were tickets in the 300's. I went to look at them and got a freaking nosebleed...when I asked why I couldn't get MY seats I had for over 20 years they said...corporate now....now I look down at 206 when I'm at games and it's half freaking empty by halftime....pinheads in pinstriped suits do it every time
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2006
  10. IndyKen

    IndyKen Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Wow, so many with ye of little faith.....we'll be fine.
     
  11. tatepatsfan

    tatepatsfan Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    #75 Jersey

    That is so ridiculous. Sure losing those guys is a tough pill to swallow, but how can you not trust what Belichick has done here. The bottom line is that Givens wanted more than he is worth (and got it elsewhere) Vinatieri's numbers have been going down, and Willie is old. Losing those three guys hurts a lot, especially from a loyalty persepective, but they are most certainly not irreplaceable.

    Givens - trade for Walker, Moulds, etc.

    Vinatieri - Josh Brown, Edinger, etc.

    Willie - 1st round pick, Arrington, etc.

    And we'd be saving money too, so we can get better at other positions.

    I fully admit to being extremely upset after losing those players, especially Vinatieri, but anyone who loses faith in our organization can really be labeled as nothing more than a fair-weather fan.
     
  12. Bill's Girl

    Bill's Girl Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    I saw the poll results this morning and was dismayed by the results. I've given up fighting with the bandwagoners about BB's plan, his genius and his style. Make no mistake, the people who don't believe in BB now will be the first to call him brilliant and claim they were with him all along once the 2006 team is in place and the new kicker nails one from 50.......
     
  13. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    25% of any group is usually stupid anyway. Then you add another 14% that are dumb and you have your 39%.:eek:
     
  14. NovaScotiaPatsFan

    NovaScotiaPatsFan In the Starting Line-Up

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    #50 Jersey

    I've said this before and I'll say it again. There is nothing wrong with questioning your team, and anyone who thinks there is needs their head examined. There's also a difference between jumping ship and having doubts. The Patriots could lose every player they have including Brady and I would still root for them, but would I still think they had a shot to win the SB? Maybe not. I'm so sick of people on here bashing people for criticizing the team. It's what informed, passionate fans do. We just lost the best clutch kicker in history people have a right to be upset.
     
  15. BionicPatriot

    BionicPatriot In the Starting Line-Up

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    People question champions. Some of you just don't get it. First, I agree with the one above me. ANYONE has a right to QUESTION what is happening. However, if they've lost faith, I dunno what to tell ya? The offseason is not even over yet and people have quit? that's stupid.

    But what some of you don't realize, the Patriots are still in the spot light. Their every move will be watched, and if they ever have a loss, we'll hear how it's all over, blah blah. It happens when your a main stream team. The world actually cares about this team, which means you have to hear EVERYONE'S opinion. so your gonna hear alot of criticism. you folks just need to learn this.
     
  16. drew4008

    drew4008 In the Starting Line-Up

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    I won't change my frame of mind until I see a couple years in a row of not making the playoffs... So put down a notch for me in the "In BB we trust" column.
     
  17. patpatriot

    patpatriot Banned

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    Come On!

    F'n Bruins cut the sh@t! We went through this exercise a month ago (newcomers vs oldtimers ...now on vacation...remember?) Enough! It's not footballl and it doesn't deserve the attention of this excellent board.
     
  18. Pats726

    Pats726 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    Bledsoe was benched when he returned in 01...do you not think people were upset about that??? Or when Milloy was cut??? Their starting QB for years..teh franchise..and BBis deciding upon an unknown rookie??? I think fans need to chill out...simply put..see what happens and don't jump off the bandwagon..and yes it is your right...the fans were wrong in the past on those crucial issues...so??? one has the right to always be wrong.. and certainly while I think BB is usually correct on things..he does miss..he's human..but what FO is better???
     
  19. Bill's Girl

    Bill's Girl Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    No offense Nova and the rest, but the next kicker we get will have the chance to be clutch as well because of the rest of the team that will be surrounding him and the opportunities being on a winning team will afford him. There are other kickers who can make 48 and 41 yard kicks in a dome, there are also other kickers who can kick in the snow. Don't forget that Janakowski also nailed a 45 yard kick in that game. Adam will always be a part of our history, but whomever BB chooses to be the next kicker will also earn our trust, admiration and even respect! But honestly, throwing our coach under the bus in March is insane!
     
  20. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    That's a poll that can easily be skewed...let's face it.

    A poll from readership who just read negative articles all the time?

    Just because we are well informed here(better anyways), I would say that if i only read the newspaper chances are good I would be skeptical also.
     

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