All things Peyton Manning?

[Ivan]

One thing is for certain, Gary Kubiak will not be able to run his offense while Manning is the QB, and they essentially conceded that last night. Manning has to be in the shotgun full time so there will be no real run game in Denver this season. Manning arm is toast and will continue to deteriorate, I seriously doubt he is still starting when December rolls around.

 

[aluminum seats]

You know it doesnt make us pats fans look all that great when we have to dedicate an entire thread to making peyton look bad AFTER already dominating him throughout his career.

Some people seem to have the strangest hang up with regards to manning and its never made a whole lot of sense to me..

If you hate the way the media strokes him then fine hate the media, we already do anyway, but finding glee and happiness in his failures and looking for every excuse in the book to downplay his success is borderline disburbing and obsessive IMO

We can all see he has declined, but last night proved he's still far from dead like everybody apparently hopes for him to be..

Maybe im just in the minority, idk

I don't see glee here so much as conversation and back-and-forth about where Manning is in his career and how it might affect competition in the AFC.

Brady and Manning has been the primary rivalry this century, so it's hardly strange that we might dedicate a thread to him. I think it's kind of strange to question it, honestly.

 

[Rob0729]

Expect plenty of Broncos' arse kissing by the media for the next month or so. Their upcoming schedule is at Detriots, vs. the Vikes, vs the Raiders, and at Cleveland. After the bye, their schedule gets tough though. Every team they face are potential playoff teams other than the Raiders and Bears.

 

[50-yard-line]

GMA this morning was all Manning...HE won that game all by himself!

Seriously, I have nothing against the guy as a QB - I've loved watching him play for well over a decade, adn I think he's got to mentioned among the greats, of course.

But really, if that was Brady leading the pats back, or Brees, or any other team, it would have barely gotten a mention.

 

[JMC00]

Honestly, considering what happened there last year, I'm happy for any development that minimizes our chances of playing in KC in January.

Not sure why I keep seeing this on here. You don't think the Pats would be up for payback? If the Pats played them this year they'd win by 14+.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I'm not a big Manning fan because of his well known annual playoff choke jobs. However, last night, the game was on the line, and he found a way to get it done. Great pass to Sanders, and he drove them all the way down the field, despite averaging about 5 ypa up to that point.

KC really are a bunch of losers, though. I just knew they wouldn't get to PM with their pass rush when they needed to most. Andy Reid is such an F'ing joke, it's like listening to a broken record. His teams are always undisciplined idiots. I believe the Chiefs had four holding penalties on punt returns, as well as a fumble. I disagree that Alex Smith is "average" and he is certainly not a veteran who can handle pressure. He plays like a rookie whenever the stakes are higher...he flat out sucks. It's comical watching the Reid-Smith combination in KC, as they waste so much talent around those two clowns. Both Reid and Smith are very similar in that everyone knows they suck, but at one point, they were both destined for success, so the Chiefs can talk themselves into believing they are the answer.

 

[zydecochris]

Riddle me this, Batpersons,
How does Andy Reid keep his job?
Seriously?

This is probably a rhetorical question, but let me pretend it isn't.

In the Ryan Press Conference thread, Ken has a couple of really interesting (IMHO) posts on the pluses and minus of Rex Ryan, and he pointed out that most coaches have things they are good at and things that they are not so good at. I would argue that BB checks more "is good at" boxes than any other coach, but I won't list what those BB strengths are because it would stimulate so much argument that I'm afraid the server might go down.

I would argue that Andy Reid does has some clear strengths, just far fewer. He seems to be great with quarterbacks (a very important skill for a coach), think of how many quarterbacks played very well for him, were traded away for a good draft haul, and then did nothing afterward (A.J. Feeley, Kelvin Kolb, Nick Foles), and he was able to get good seasons from Michael Vick also. Although he didn't look great last night, Alex Smith has played pretty well for him. And, just look at the KC Record before and after he took over: from 2007-2012, it was 4-12, 2-14, 4-12, 10-6, 7-9, 2-14. Since he took over it has been 11-5 and 9-7. Before last night's game, KC was ranked on "they-who-shall-not-be-named" website as the 7th best team, so they are fairly solid, especially on defense, he must not be a completely incompetent personnel guy (admittedly, this is more arguable).

Unfortunately Reid is just an abysmal game manager, particularly when it comes to clock management.

After being spoiled by BB, Reid would last for about 5 minutes in NE (even as an assistant coach) because of his obvious limitations. However, if you compare KC now and during one of its 2-14 seasons, I think one could make the argument that they are probably better off now than they were then.

 

[Oswlek]

Riddle me this, Batpersons,
How does Andy Reid keep his job?
Seriously?

Because aside from clock management, he is one of the better coaches in the league. This is both a comment on Reid and the state of coaches overall.

 

[zydecochris]

Because aside from clock management, he is one of the better coaches in the league. This is both a comment on Reid and the state of coaches overall.

I basically agree with you (I think we are basically saying the same thing), but I would argue that while clock management is what Reid is most infamous for, there are other aspects of game management that he is pretty bad at. Just think of how under control BB has his team, even during moments of crisis. I will never forget the last minute of the Superbowl, they showed a picture of Pete Carroll (who I think is a very fine coach) and he looked like his head was about to explode from his intensity. They panned away to BB, and he looked completely calm, like his was watching just any other practice. Players feed off their coach, and his demeanor during games and his control of the game (game management) is second to none in my opinion. Of course, having TB in the huddle doesn't hurt any.

Reid doesn't seem to manage the game well, he just doesn't seem to be able to think well under pressure. Sometimes his teams have penalties at very inopportune times, and I think that is a reflection of how well the coach is managing the game and how well he has himself under control.

 

[Marinlik]

No one will say anything about this. But Brady ducked one time 2 years ago in a game when a defender got pushed by him and he was seeing ghosts.

I think it was Von Miller that brought the pressure. I remember a bunch of people saying that Bradys pocket awareness was done. He was seeing ghosts. I think that it can be good for QBs to fall before they get hit sometimes. Sure, it looks silly. But if they know they will get hit right away, and can't find any target, why not fall down and avoid getting blown up and maybe injured? Brady is usually very good at knowing when to just take the sack and starting to fall before he gets hit. But that's usually when he gets a safety or LB coming at him in full speed that the OL missed.

 

[Galeb]

Riddle me this, Batpersons,
How does Andy Reid keep his job?
Seriously?

 

[Bonzo]

Not sure why I keep seeing this on here. You don't think the Pats would be up for payback? If the Pats played them this year they'd win by 14+.

By contrast, if the Pats were to draw Denver in January (at which time Manning's arm will be 100% spent), I'd wager we win by something closer to 114.

 

[Bartmac36]

I don't see glee here so much as conversation and back-and-forth about where Manning is in his career and how it might affect competition in the AFC.

Brady and Manning has been the primary rivalry this century, so it's hardly strange that we might dedicate a thread to him. I think it's kind of strange to question it, honestly.

Oh trust me you'll find plenty of HAHAHAs and big smiley face emojies in last nights game thread when he threw the pick six, and you'll also find a lot of people blaming the chiefs for sucking when manning turned things around instead of giving him credit for getting his act together and playing clutch (even if the chiefs did play a part in it). hence the glee.

And I can understand dedicating a thread to it during say, Broncos week, but after last nights game it almost comes off as Patriots fans wanting so badly for him to be toast and when he doesnt look like complete toast we have to create a whole thread to reassure ourselves that he sucks.

I'm just saying from an outsiders perspective it almost comes off as insecure, and that's the part I dont understand since we've owned him for the majority of his career, ya know? We have no reason to be intimidated by him at this point or obsessed with him in week 2 when we dont even play him for 3 months.

But like i said idk, maybe its just me. Everyone sees things differently and i understand that.

 

[PatsBoy12]

I saw that last week too. He dove to the ground on two of the four sacks. He is hearing footsteps when people pressure him now.

Nonsense, Rob. Only Brady see ghosts.

 

[patfanken]

I think Manning will get better as the season goes on, if for no other reason than he will eventually be more in tune with Kubiak's offense the more he plays in it.

Right now he looks pretty bad. In fact the only time he looked like he had any rhythm was on the last drive when he was back in shotgun and in a hurry up offense. But just like Brady, who knows how good he can be at this point of the season. Have we forgotten so soon how quickly a great QB can turn things around.

It will be harder for Manning because turning it around will mean more than just solidifying the OL. I don't think anyone can deny that his arm is weaker than any time in his carreer. But that doesn't mean he can't adjust and still be effective. He still has one of the best WR's in the league. Just look at what Pennington was able to accomplish in 2oo8 with even a worse arm.

On the down side, his arm will make it even easier for defenses to squeeze his options. Teams with good safeties will be able to cover the sidelines over the top even if the WR totally beats the CB. Also his mobility, which was never good to begin with, seems to have gotten even worse. He's never been a QB looking to run, but he seems to have lost the ability to move in the pocket, like Brady.

BOTTOM LINE, they have an impossibly easy schedule and have already won 2 games they very easily could have lost. They WILL make the playoffs and Manning WILL adjust to the new offense and his current arm strength and get better. But in the end, I bet that this will be another one and done for Manning and will cement his legacy as being one of the worst playoff QB's in NFL history, and force Elway to blow up his team next year.

 

[Oswlek]

I basically agree with you (I think we are basically saying the same thing), but I would argue that while clock management is what Reid is most infamous for, there are other aspects of game management that he is pretty bad at. Just think of how under control BB has his team, even during moments of crisis. I will never forget the last minute of the Superbowl, they showed a picture of Pete Carroll (who I think is a very fine coach) and he looked like his head was about to explode from his intensity. They panned away to BB, and he looked completely calm, like his was watching just any other practice. Players feed off their coach, and his demeanor during games and his control of the game (game management) is second to none in my opinion. Of course, having TB in the huddle doesn't hurt any.

Reid doesn't seem to manage the game well, he just doesn't seem to be able to think well under pressure. Sometimes his teams have penalties at very inopportune times, and I think that is a reflection of how well the coach is managing the game and how well he has himself under control.

I can't disagree. I thought about adding "game management" but I think that is too broad a criticism for Reid since he is quite good at much of it. A clock management criticism was better for the lazy-of-heart since it can be levied more liberally.

 

[aluminum seats]

Oh trust me you'll find plenty of HAHAHAs and big smiley face emojies in last nights game thread when he threw the pick six, and you'll also find a lot of people blaming the chiefs for sucking when manning turned things around instead of giving him credit for getting his act together and playing clutch (even if the chiefs did play a part in it). hence the glee.

And I can understand dedicating a thread to it during say, Broncos week, but after last nights game it almost comes off as Patriots fans wanting so badly for him to be toast and when he doesnt look like complete toast we have to create a whole thread to reassure ourselves that he sucks.

I'm just saying from an outsiders perspective it almost comes off as insecure, and that's the part I dont understand since we've owned him for the majority of his career, ya know? We have no reason to be intimidated by him at this point or obsessed with him in week 2 when we dont even play him for 3 months.

But like i said idk, maybe its just me. Everyone sees things differently and i understand that.

Yeah, agree to disagree on this one.

I would say one thing about the smiley faces, etc. We are an opposing fan base. That's part of rooting. But I've gone to several opposing fan boards--Jets, Ravens, Colts, now the Bills, etc.--and at EVERY ONE I've seen multiple posts about how they can't WAIT to see Brady "carted off the field," and how much they wish to see him get hurt, get concussions, etc. Not to mention the endless "jokes" about Brady being gay and the painfully unfunny BS that goes along with that.

You do not, with VERY few exceptions, ever see that kind of crap here. Just sayin'.

 

[PatsBoy12]

I bet Kubiak goes back to his same offense next week which is a bad fit for Manning and isn't helping the running game either.

I still think Manning is done. He will show flashes of brilliance like last night, but be wildly inconsistent in that way. But if they keep running Kubiak's offense and not let Manning run his offense, he will be one of the worst QBs in the league. He only looked remotely comfortable when they let him get in the shotgun play after play and run the no huddle.

Cowher was practically begging for them to put him in the shotgun at halftime.

 

[venecol]

You know it doesnt make us pats fans look all that great when we have to dedicate an entire thread to making peyton look bad AFTER already dominating him throughout his career.

Some people seem to have the strangest hang up with regards to manning and its never made a whole lot of sense to me..

If you hate the way the media strokes him then fine hate the media, we already do anyway, but finding glee and happiness in his failures and looking for every excuse in the book to downplay his success is borderline disburbing and obsessive IMO

We can all see he has declined, but last night proved he's still far from dead like everybody apparently hopes for him to be..

Maybe im just in the minority, idk

I'm just wondering which one of these Manning numbers will be greater:

1. Number of TDs this season, or
2. Number of times he appears on commercials this season.

So far, not counting the pick-6s 2 above is winning.

 

[1960Pats]

He always plays his best games against KC. That game last night was as good as it will get for him. And it was a mediocre game at best.

P6's record vs KC might be better than Brady's record vs Buffalo.