AFC East Top 25, per Erik Frenz of the Boston Globe

[LetsGoBuffalo]

I'm not wrong about either of them, so why would I make such an admission



Sure, but asking for one year of numbers when that year's over and players have entire careers to look at is either amazingly naive or deliberately framing the question on your part, particularly when you were the one showing disdain for numbers just a few posts earlier.

Frenz's list is right now.

Seriously dude, what do Rice's numbers in 08 have to do with who the better player is now?

 

[Ring 6]

I understand, easy way out. If you really believe Rice is better, prove it.

Don't let an offhanded comment by me stop you.

Or are my comments the criteria by which players are measured these days?

Prove Ray Rice is better, man.

You can't be really serious.
Here are a few items for you to consider:

NFL career
Rushing yards Rice 5520 Spiller 2088
Receptions Rice 311 to 106
TDs Rice 39 to 16
100 yard games Rice 17 to 6
20+ touch games Rice 42 to 5

There you go, that should be sufficient.
We have not even begun to discuss Rice contributing to wins, playoff berths, playoff wins and a Championship, while Spiller has contributed to a lot of losses.

 

[LetsGoBuffalo]

You can't be really serious.
Here are a few items for you to consider:

NFL career
Rushing yards Rice 5520 Spiller 2088
Receptions Rice 311 to 106
TDs Rice 39 to 16
100 yard games Rice 17 to 6
20+ touch games Rice 42 to 5

There you go, that should be sufficient.
We have not even begun to discuss Rice contributing to wins, playoff berths, playoff wins and a Championship, while Spiller has contributed to a lot of losses.

Was the post too complex for you? Using 2012 numbers (i.e RIGHT NOW), prove Rice is the better player.

 

[Deus Irae]

Frenz's list is right now.

Seriously dude, what do Rice's numbers in 08 have to do with who the better player is now?

Seriously, dude, if you can't figure out that you have to extrapolate "now" by looking at all the past and factoring in changes since the end of the season, I don't know what to tell you. Ray Rice had more than 2000 all purpose yards in 2009 and 2011, 1776 in 2010 and 1621 in 2012. Spiller's had one season, total of more than 1000 yards from scrimmage, and he had only 82 yards more than Rice had last year, so it's not as if he was miles ahead.

If you can't figure it out from there, I don't know what to tell you.

 

[LetsGoBuffalo]

Seriously, dude, if you can't figure out that you have to extrapolate "now" by looking at all the past and factoring in changes since the end of the season, I don't know what to tell you. Ray Rice had more than 2000 all purpose yards in 2009 and 2011, 1776 in 2010 and 1621 in 2012. Spiller's had one season, total of more than 1000 yards from scrimmage, and he had only 82 yards more than Rice had last year, so it's not as if he was miles ahead.

If you can't figure it out from there, I don't know what to tell you.

I noticed you didn't post how many less touches Spiller outgained Rice on. Spiller is the superior player. He's top 10 in football.

 

[Ring 6]

Was the post too complex for you? Using 2012 numbers (i.e RIGHT NOW), prove Rice is the better player.

No, it was too obtuse.
2012 stats are not the judgment of who is a better football player.

By the way, you do realize that Rice essentially sat out the final, meaningless game of the season right?

Rice in 15 (real) games averaged 107.7 yards from scrimmage and scored 10 TDs.
Spiller in 16 averaged 106.4 and scored 8 TDs.

are you saying playing week 17 because his team didn't clinch a playoff spot makes Spiller better?

 

[LetsGoBuffalo]

No, it was too obtuse.
Rice in 15 (real) games averaged 107.7 yards from scrimmage and scored 10 TDs.
Spiller in 16 averaged 106.4 and scored 8 TDs.

How many touches per player? Thought so.

 

[Ring 6]

How many touches per player? Thought so.

So you think Spiller is better because his team won't give him the ball?
The fact that he has not handled the load is one of the reasons your rating of him is severely high.
Ray Rice has produced at a high level for 4 years. Spiller had a handful of good games last year, so in meaningless situations, such as 3 of his top 5 games being in lopsided losses, representing over 1/3 of his rushing yards.

 

[ausbacker]

How many touches per player? Thought so.

I hope you realize the longer you attempt to make this discussion the more foolish you look. Clearly, you're not interested in your standing for further topical discussion given your current troll effort.

 

[Ring 6]

How many touches per player? Thought so.

Perhaps that has something to do with Rice having 7 fumbles in 1527 career touches and Spiller having 10 in 494?
Spiller had as many last year as Rice has had in the last 3 combined.

 

[LetsGoBuffalo]

Perhaps that has something to do with Rice having 7 fumbles in 1527 career touches and Spiller having 10 in 494?
Spiller had as many last year as Rice has had in the last 3 combined.

Keep grasping. Spiller is the better player, it's not questionable.

 

[Deus Irae]

I noticed you didn't post how many less touches Spiller outgained Rice on. Spiller is the superior player. He's top 10 in football.

Ok, you're one of the Bills trolls I took off of ignore at draft time. Well, congratulations! You're the first Bills troll to go on the list this year.

 

[Ring 6]

Keep grasping. Spiller is the better player, it's not questionable.

Grasping? I think losing for so many years has jaded you. Fumbling over 4 times as often is a big factor.
So, lets recap.
Spiller is better because while losing badly he padded his stats, and surpassed Rice because Rice's team sat him with a playoff berth secured while Spillers team played him because they have nothing to play for. And since all you do is lose, fumbling doesn't matter.
You are correct that it isn't questionable, you just have the players backward.
If Spiller can actually produce like a starting player 2 years in a row, maybe he belongs in the discussion with Ray Rice.

 

[LetsGoBuffalo]

Grasping? I think losing for so many years has jaded you. Fumbling over 4 times as often is a big factor.
So, lets recap.
Spiller is better because while losing badly he padded his stats, and surpassed Rice because Rice's team sat him with a playoff berth secured while Spillers team played him because they have nothing to play for. And since all you do is lose, fumbling doesn't matter.
You are correct that it isn't questionable, you just have the players backward.
If Spiller can actually produce like a starting player 2 years in a row, maybe he belongs in the discussion with Ray Rice.

Just post the touches, man.

 

[supafly]

Spiller is the superior player. He's top 10 in football.

I understand the potential ceiling that CJ Spiller seems to have, not to mention the flashes that we've all seen. I don't disagree with you about his potential.

That said, he hasn't really proven himself capable of doing too much on a consistent enough level to this point. On top of that, he's shown a propensity to putting the ball on the ground too.

If you want to be excited about Spiller's possible future, then I could totally understand that; but to act like he's consistently shown to be a "top 10" NFL talent is downright ridiculous.

 

[Gunnails]

Ivory<Spiller, I can tell cause I gots eyes.

 

[Joker]

who's better, Guns....Chez face or Butts?

 

[strngplyr]

Grasping? I think losing for so many years has jaded you. Fumbling over 4 times as often is a big factor.
So, lets recap.
Spiller is better because while losing badly he padded his stats, and surpassed Rice because Rice's team sat him with a playoff berth secured while Spillers team played him because they have nothing to play for. And since all you do is lose, fumbling doesn't matter.
You are correct that it isn't questionable, you just have the players backward.
If Spiller can actually produce like a starting player 2 years in a row, maybe he belongs in the discussion with Ray Rice.

Lets not even start talking about blitz pickup. Rice is a wall compared to Spiller.

I don't understand why it's so hard for the troll to fathom that rice is a much better player. He's comparing stats in a vacuum and discounting everything outside of yards and ypc. Blitz pickup, reliability, ball security, etc.

 

[Ring 6]

Just post the touches, man.

That isn't really relevant to me other than as I stated, that Rice is counted on more by his team.
If you wish to have stats posted, feel free.
You seem to have abandoned any argument and fallen back to "I'm right so I'm right" so perhaps your reputation here could stand you posting something of substance.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Gronkowski has set numerous records, is one of the most productive WIDE RECEIVERS in NFL history through three years, despite being a stud tight end blocker as well, but he isn't as good as a one-dimensional sack artist like Wake? Wilfork is also much better than Wake.

The Wake positioning screams "I don't want to be thought of as a homer."