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A More Secular America?

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by PatriotsReign, Nov 8, 2012.

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  1. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Is America becoming more secular?

    From where I sit, I'd say it is.

    But....and a big BUT too....

    I don't want any of our gov't branches at any level attempt to speed up the process. If it's a function of evolution, then fine, let it happen at a natural rate.

    But don't pass any laws or change anything that encourages secularism to prosper. Freedom of religion is far more important than the evolution of American society.

    Besides, our gov't has no business in trying to influence what our society is or is not. That is purely a function of "We, the people..."

    And that folks, is my thought for today!
  2. DocHoliday

    DocHoliday Rookie

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    Yes, but government itself should always strive to be strictly secular.
  3. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Of course...isn't that why we have "separation of church & state"?
  4. Tunescribe

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    #61 Jersey

    I think America is growing up a bit. People are beginning to accept, for example, that homosexuality is physiologically determined, that recreational drug use is more a health issue vs. criminal matter, etc. We're finally catching up to the Europeans in terms of social maturity.
  5. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    I agree we're growing up....but I wouldn't want to use Europe as our benchmark. I don't see them as being any more mature culturally than we are Tune.

    Our society is by far the most complex society on this earth. So any comparison to any other country is irrelevant in my opinion.

    But the purpose of this thread is to discuss moving toward a more secular society vs. a religious based society.

    For example, when I was a child, almost everyone went to church services. Christmas was more religion-based than it is now....just 2 examples.
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2012
  6. RI Patriots fan

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    "Growing up"......lol. I just love the arrogance and the ignorance of that statement.

    Homosexuality.....physiologically determined. Really? Show me the science.
  7. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Do you honestly believe homosexuality is a choice?
  8. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Rookie

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    Europe is a model for complete failure........a pyramid scheme of the worst sort. near zero population growth is requiring those countries to lose their cultural identity through needed immigration to imitate any kind of economic growth

    Europe

    entitlements along with an aging population is a disaster.

    but back to secularity.....yes....this country muct be secular.....maybe the puritans can find another planet
  9. RI Patriots fan

    RI Patriots fan Rookie

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    A homosexual inclination is a disorder. I believe if someone has this disorder that it is not a choice. That being said, the inclination can be psychological in nature or physiological in nature. I believe it is a psychological disorder.
    That being said, I am open to what science tells us...actual science.

    So again, I'll ask.....what scientific evidence do we have that demonstrates that homosexual inclinations are strictly physiological?
  10. shmessy

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    #75 Jersey

    Wait a second.......a "DISORDER"????????

    Can it be covered by insurance?
  11. RI Patriots fan

    RI Patriots fan Rookie

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    It should be as far as I'm concerned. Agaian, I'll ask....do we have conclusive scientific evidence to prove that homosexual inclinations are strictly physiological in nature or is this just secular/progressive "faith"...lol
  12. Harry Boy

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    In mourning,
    Let us pray,
    Oh lord bring us back, bring us back to the days of America The Beautiful, don't let these progressive crazy bastards with their sex obsessions, their filthy racist music and all the rest of their rotten socialist communist shlt take our country over, I beseech thee oh Lord Jesus God please save us.
    Amen

    Closed Because Of Sorrow:
    Virginia store closes for a day to 'mourn the loss of America' - Washington Times
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2012
  13. Tunescribe

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    #61 Jersey

    Here you go, smart guy. But somehow I'm not confident that you're the type who values scientific information.

    Brain Study Shows Differences Between Gays, Straights - washingtonpost.com

    Quoting: Some scientists say the new findings are part of an increasingly convincing body of evidence that suggests sexual orientation results from fundamental developmental differences that are probably caused by hormonal exposures in the womb.
  14. Lurks_All_Day

    Lurks_All_Day Rookie

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    This, finally. After 250+ years of puritanical, guilt-ridden, "thou shalt NOT (insert what you like)!" societal sado-masochism. I've had quite enough of others' self-righteous moral usurping of my fundamental right to live in peace, and an equal shot at EVERYTHING that society has to offer. That's why I don't vote republican.

    My personal bigotries ought not to infringe on your personal liberties any more than yours on mine.

    Fair enough?
  15. Harry Boy

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    I used to like wrestling with girls, the other guys called me "a sissy" I didn't care, I couldn't help it, I used to enjoy taking naps with them too, f--- them other guys.
  16. Lurks_All_Day

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  17. RI Patriots fan

    RI Patriots fan Rookie

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    Obviously you didn't read the whole article, "genius". From your own article:


    "But such research is fraught with uncertainty, and it could not rule out that the findings were the result of changes that occurred in response to experiences and behaviors, rather than being inborn".

    "It takes a snapshot of a group of people at a particular age," said Anne Fausto-Sterling, a professor of biology and gender studies at Brown University. "Even if there are reliable brain differences, it doesn't tell you anything about how those brain differences came into being."


    Well, so much for "conclusive".
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2012
  18. Lurks_All_Day

    Lurks_All_Day Rookie

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    So, when did you decide your sexual affiliation? conclusively?
  19. RI Patriots fan

    RI Patriots fan Rookie

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    I didn't "decide" my sexual inclination and if you read what I said, I clearly said that true sexual inclination was not a choice.
    But again....where is the science to demonstrate it conclusively?
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2012
  20. Lurks_All_Day

    Lurks_All_Day Rookie

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    Sorry, could not find where you said that. Truthfully, I only read 3/7 of the thread.
    :bricks:
  21. Tunescribe

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    #61 Jersey

    You must've heaved a sigh of relief after discovering a potential out for your bigotry. Few things in life are "conclusive." Yet to me, this is pretty compelling and reinforces discussions with gay friends of mine on how homosexual orientation is determined.

    Quote: ... an increasingly convincing body of evidence that suggests sexual orientation results from fundamental developmental differences that are probably caused by hormonal exposures in the womb.

    "This research is pointing to basic differences in the brain between homosexual and heterosexual people that are likely there right from the beginning," said Sandra F. Witelson, a professor of psychiatry and behavioral neurosciences at McMaster University in Ontario. "These could be reflecting some genetic or hormonal factors that predetermine your sexual orientation."
  22. Lurks_All_Day

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    "So, you're some big-shot perfesser? Well, we don' like yer kine. Mister Big-shot perfesser...

    Attached Files:

  23. DocHoliday

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    As of anyone in Americas long history of homophobia would willingly choose homosexuality.

    It wasn't more than 20 years ago people were being out through hugely harmful "gay-fixing" therapy
  24. RI Patriots fan

    RI Patriots fan Rookie

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    Progressive ad hominems....lol. It's like you know they just can't help it.

    Well of course it's conclusive for you because you have an agenda and it fits right into your progressive little world. Of course as William Byne, a professor of psychiatry at Mount Sinai School of Medicine in New York said in the article, "I remain skeptical. There's been a history of jumping to conclusions and overinterpreting findings in this field."

    Translation....."This is advocacy {science} if I ever saw it"

    But see, I'm willing to change my view if science proves that homosexual inclinations are physiological in nature (which it hasn't btw...not even close).

    Are you willing to change yours if nothing conclusive can be found to prove that these inclinations are physiological in nature ?

    LOl....of course you're not willing to change your view because it doesn't fit into your "faith" and your friends wouldn't like you very much (tsk, tsk).
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2012
  25. Lurks_All_Day

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    In your world-view, there will never be "proof" as long as there is one skeptic.
    So give it up. There's no argument to be made, won, or lost.

    You've surrendered before the battle began with your trite and all-encompassing caveat that can never be assuaged.
  26. Harry Boy

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  27. Lurks_All_Day

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    Where do I sign up for ice picks jabbed in my eye-socket? Because this is some scientifically proved shizzt, right here!

    Lobotomy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    THIS IS FOR SCIENTS.... BOTH OF 'EM!!1!!
  28. RI Patriots fan

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    It's like you guys have problems reading....I made it clear that I would be open to changing my position. I have no problem with changing it. It doesn't affect me one way or the other.

    The funny thing is that if there is no conclusive scientific evidence, none of you would be willing to change your postions.....hmmmm, I wonder why? :rolleyes:

    Unless of course you're saying that it isn't possible to prove anything conclusively with science, which I doubt.

    I think....and I know this is a stretch......that when it comes to the tenets of the Progressive "faith" it's better to lower the necessary standards of proof to avoid having to prove anything at all. See....isn't that sooooo much easier?

    This way, you guys can commune with your gay and lesbian friends and not have to worry about scientific truth which contradicts your "faith".
  29. Lurks_All_Day

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    This is so easy, it's pathetic. You hang for dear life onto one singular quote from one singular story and use it to attempt to completely debunk every other finding.

    You would happily grasp that singular straw, no matter how stringent the evidence against your loon theories based on invisible super-heroes, no matter how irrelevant your argument.

    Having said all that, at what date, on the calendar, did you make a conscious decision to become hetero- (or homo-, I'm not sure what your personal lot is) sexual? Let's be clear... if you're gonna make a statement such as you've been ranting all evening, whether implied or implicit, there's got to be an answer to this very important question.

    so... when was it? tell us all how you came to your conclusion?
  30. RI Patriots fan

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    Actually, I was responding to an article linked here as "scientific" proof that homosexual inclinations were physical in nature. I didn't provide the article, I just read it.

    As I read it, I came across several, not one but several quotes and observations made by scientists (not just one) who saw the conclusions as dubious, at best. I also noticed that even the most supportive of scientists in this article used terms like "could" and "may" to describe their findings which suggest, again, at best a possibility and not even a probability.

    You know, Im starting to wonder if progressives have reading comprehension problems on this site.
    But I will answer your question and I will answer it one more time (since I've answered it already.
    I did not choose to be heterosexual. I believe that those with a true homosexual inclinations do not choose their inclination. This doesn't necessarily mean that the inclination is physiological in nature but could still be either psycological or physiological in nature. Looking at the scientific evidence, I see nothing of any substance to demonstrate even remotely that these inclinations are physiological in nature.

    But again.....for the 4th or 5th time, I am open to any scientific evidence that demonstrates conclusively that it is physiological in nature.
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