A little perspective

[MoLewisrocks]

This season is over in terms of winning a Superbowl. It is now time to discuss when to let Belichick go. Just like a gambler at the craps table in Vegas his run is over.

I know it stings the senses to read that but deep down you know it is true. The failures are mounting.

1) Spy Gate
2) AFCCG loss to Colts after being up 18 points.
3) SB loss to Giants who were 14 point underdogs
4) Wild Cat melt down to Dolphins and thus lost division title.
5) 4th and 2

I don't care if it gets me banned from this place for what that's worth lately but you're nothing but a moronic malcontent frontrunning resident troll and that's all you've ever been since the day you arrived here.

That Ian has continued to cater to the likes of you and a dozen or so more like you who only show up to gloat in defeat is part of what sucks about this board these days.

 

[wilfork is beastin']

Let's not fight amongst ourselves and call each other names, we aren't Jets fans

 

[Pats726]

Good post. I had been thinking about all of those situations.

Certainly the season's not over and there's time to regroup. My biggest concerns at this point are:

1. The Pats have no pass rush. That's a huge flaw which will be hard to overcome or disguise come playoff time.

2. The Pats still haven't played a 60 minute game, executed effectively in the red zone, or won a true road game this year.

3. The Pats have fallen flat in 4 of their biggest contests this season.

Those things don't bode well for us. But, as you say, there's no reason to panic at this stage.

1---They have a weak pass rush if I remember they did get a sack last night...and while I agree they need a BETTER pass rush..using Brees and Manning as games they needed a pass rush against is misleading..neither, Manning not Brees have been sacked that much..lowest in the league or close. SO look at other games, not these losses.
2---They did against tennesse...Tampa Bay..NOT against others..Baltimore.??? They were better in the Red Zone back that haunts them..I agree. Won a true road game? True..they haven't but 3 of those 4 were against what are/were the elite teams. Yes, Denver at that point was 4-0...so elite at that time. One would also have to consider the Jets/Denver as having Brady being rusty returning...so the conetion of losing road games as something special means a lot less..if nothing..wait until the lose in Mia, Buffalo Hous befoe making a statement like that.
3---Not sure what games you were watching.."fallen flat"..yesterday..yes..the Colts?? No...not at all in fact they outplayed the Colts..Denver? NY? the team did not fall flat..and playing Atlanta and Baltimore were not big games that they played strong??
Good perspective..and this was a BIG embarrassment..with te team playing really its worst in a long while. So..anything can happen..still...Good that you brought that up so many can see possibilities of past teams that went places...

 

[Rob0729]

Cardinals didn't win the SB so I don't know why you included them in your post. My post was specifically meant for Pitt, Indy, and NY.

As for your stats, coming into the game last night, our defense was ranked third. But that doesn't really paint the whole picture does it?

The teams the Colts were facing knew that Freeney was coming and got rid of the ball early. Just by Freeney's presence, the other teams' pass offense got disrupted. Now you can look at the sack totals, but you're not going to see the number of hurries Freeney and Mathis forced.

You're going to look at the 07 Giants based how effective their defense was based on that stat? Did you see any of their games from December on?

The Cardinals got to the Super Bowl eventhough being 6-5 one year ago today. I think that is pretty relevant to the discussion that the Pats are still in it.

You are reaching about the Colts. Again, the Colts had THE WORST RUN DEFENSE IN NFL HISTORY that year. I think that is bigger deficit than a lack of a pass rush since if teams could run all over the Colts (they were giving up a massive 173 YPG), you keep Manning off the field. If you can't stop the run in the playoffs, you are dead. The Colts miraculously found a run defense the first playoff game.

As for the Giants, I did see their games from December on. That is why those numbers stand out because they were significantly worse from September through November and they flipped a switch on in December. Why can't the Pats do the same thing? In 2005, the Pats flipped the switch on a pass rush mid game with the Chiefs and went from a mediocre pass rush to a dominant pass rush the last month of the season.

So both the Colts and Giants flipped a switch and turned their defenses around late in the season or in the playoffs. The Pats may or may not be able to do that. They have history of doing it in the past. So it isn't out of the question. We will have to wait and see.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Excellent post and it shows how a blowout loss is no more significant than any loss.

I felt we lost the game at the end of Q1 and in Q2. It should have been tied at halftime, when you consider the bad INT (at least 3 points there), the missed PI on Welker (4 points), and the missed FG (3 points). We go into the half tied, with the ball to open the 2nd half, and who knows what would have happened? I still think we lose because the defensive backfield wasn't mentally up to the challenge last night, but it would have been a much better game.

So just a few breaks is what turned it into a rout.

Our opponents in the AFC are a lot more beatable than NO is right now. We still have a decent shot at getting to the SB, and the D will be a lot better than they showed last night.

 

[blackglass3]

I don't care if it gets me banned from this place for what that's worth lately but you're nothing but a moronic malcontent frontrunning resident troll and that's all you've ever been since the day you arrived here.

That Ian has continued to cater to the likes of you and a dozen or so more like you who only show up to gloat in defeat is part of what sucks about this board these days.

Amen to that, brother. Rabthepat and NEPatriot are two of the worst posters this site has ever seen.

 

[Its_The_Patriots]

For all you Chicken Littles out there I want to point you to several facts of the last four years:

On December 1, 2005, Pittsburgh were 8-4 coming off back to back loss including a 26-7 loss to Indy.

On December 10, 2006, the Colts finished a streak losing 3 out of 4 games including a 44-10 loss to Jacksonville and went on to have statistically the worst run defense in NFL history.

On December 1, 2007, the Giants were 6-5 coming off a 41-17 loss to the Vikes.

On December 1, 2008, the Cards were 7-5 and coming off a 48-20 loss to the Eagles.

What do all these teams have in common other than not looking like strong Super Bowl contenders entering December? They all won the Super Bowl (except the Card who came close to winning the Super Bowl, but lost it in the final two minutes of the game) in the years listed eventhough all were expected to either not make the playoffs at all or be one and done once the playoffs started.

Now this doesn't mean the Pats will win the Super Bowl, but it definitely means that the people writing them off too prematurely. Barring a total collapse the Pats will win the AFC East. Once the Pats get into the playoffs, anything can happen.

Finally someone who is talking positive! Great post Rob!

 

[Patspsycho]

the missed PI on Welker (4 points),

How do you get 4 points in football? Two back to back safeties?

 

[mcmurtry86]

This season is over in terms of winning a Superbowl. It is now time to discuss when to let Belichick go. Just like a gambler at the craps table in Vegas his run is over.

I know it stings the senses to read that but deep down you know it is true. The failures are mounting.

1) Spy Gate
2) AFCCG loss to Colts after being up 18 points.
3) SB loss to Giants who were 14 point underdogs
4) Wild Cat melt down to Dolphins and thus lost division title.
5) 4th and 2

Belichick is so bad that he coached a team to the first ever 16-0 regular season record (and brought in the players to accomplish that feat). He's so bad he coached a team to an 11-5 record (a playoff team in 95% of other seasons) after losing their most valuable player 7 minutes into the season and replacing him with a guy who hadn't started a game since high school.

That Belichick, he's finished. Let's call **** MacPherson and see if he wants to finish out this obviously doomed season.

 

[mayoclinic]

I don't care if it gets me banned from this place for what that's worth lately but you're nothing but a moronic malcontent frontrunning resident troll and that's all you've ever been since the day you arrived here.

That Ian has continued to cater to the likes of you and a dozen or so more like you who only show up to gloat in defeat is part of what sucks about this board these days.

I don't think you should sugar-coat it so much.

 

[dtbrks]

I don't care if it gets me banned from this place for what that's worth lately but you're nothing but a moronic malcontent frontrunning resident troll and that's all you've ever been since the day you arrived here.

That Ian has continued to cater to the likes of you and a dozen or so more like you who only show up to gloat in defeat is part of what sucks about this board these days.

Cosigned.

I very really get into these types of board battles but this has been ridiculous of late. I can barely stand to log on anymore. The achievements this team, along with it's ownership and management, had made this Decade are on par with the best decade ANY team has ever achieved.

LETS GET PETE CARROL BACK!! BB SUCKS

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Cardinals didn't win the SB so I don't know why you included them in your post. My post was specifically meant for Pitt, Indy, and NY.

As for your stats, coming into the game last night, our defense was ranked third. But that doesn't really paint the whole picture does it?

The teams the Colts were facing knew that Freeney was coming and got rid of the ball early. Just by Freeney's presence, the other teams' pass offense got disrupted. Now you can look at the sack totals, but you're not going to see the number of hurries Freeney and Mathis forced.

You're going to look at the 07 Giants based how effective their defense was based on that stat? Did you see any of their games from December on?

Giants in December 2007?

Week 15 they were humiliated by the Redskins in the Meadowlands
Week 16 they beat Buffalo
Week 17 the Pats beat them by putting up 38 points.

Where do you clowns come up with these beliefs that have zero correlation with reality?

The only thing that should be added is last year the Steelers were hammered in December by the Titans 34-13.

Also, in December 2005, the Steelers were 7-5 and on a 3 game losing streak.

What's interesting is that for the past 10 years only one #1 seed (Pats 2003) has actually won the Super Bowl.

 

[patriots pam]

Here's my perspective and how I'm dealing:

They lost. Badly. And I'm in no way happy about it. But at least it was against arguably the best team in the league right now. It's not like the Pats are the reigning SB champs who got bested by the Chiefs, or something, right?! I mean, I hate to pick on the Steelers while they're down, but...okay, I don't really hate it. Or the Eagles losing to the Raiders, and probably a couple of other good teams unexpectedly losing to known crap teams so far this season that I just can't think of ATM.

As has been noted, the Pats have had some stinkers, even in the championship years (and other teams, too, as stated in the OP), and have come back strong, so I've still got it in me to believe they can do it again.

I fully expect this to light a fire under the Pats collective asses...players, coaches, et al. If it doesn't...well, I'll worry about that later.

Things look promising still to win out the rest (thank you cake-looking remaining schedule) and get into the playoffs. If beating up on "lesser" teams is the only way they can get there, then so be it! This is their chance to figure something out now and be ready and able when it counts the most!

Maybe I could come up with more, or maybe not, but anyway, I hear some tequila calling my name. That should be instrumental in my "dealing" part. Drown a little sorrow today, be busy with nursing a little hangover tomorrow and start looking forward to some squishing of the Fish! :singing:


P.S. Love the tag! You know which one! HEE!

 

[mcmurtry86]

Giants in December 2007?

Week 15 they were humiliated by the Redskins in the Meadowlands
Week 16 they beat Buffalo
Week 17 the Pats beat them by putting up 38 points.

Where do you clowns come up with these beliefs that have zero correlation with reality?

The only thing that should be added is last year the Steelers were hammered in December by the Titans 34-13.

Also, in December 2005, the Steelers were 7-5 and on a 3 game losing streak.

What's interesting is that for the past 10 years only one #1 seed (Pats 2003) has actually won the Super Bowl.

I remember for much of the 2007 season, Giants fans wanted Coughlin fired and Manning benched. People seem to forget that the 2007 Giants were something of a Cinderella story. They played very poorly and erratically most of the year and should have lost to Green Bay in the NFCCG. Yet, they ended up being champs that year.

That's not to say that there aren't real causes for concern in New England, but there is a whole lot of football to be played, and on any given Sunday (yeah it's cliche but true) any team can win. Given the fact the Pats have Brady, Moss and Belichick, I wouldn't count them out of any game - even rematches against the Colts or Saints.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

I remember for much of the 2007 season, Giants fans wanted Coughlin fired and Manning benched. People seem to forget that the 2007 Giants were something of a Cinderella story. They played very poorly and erratically most of the year and should have lost to Green Bay in the NFCCG. Yet, they ended up being champs that year.

That's not to say that there aren't real causes for concern in New England, but there is a whole lot of football to be played, and on any given Sunday (yeah it's cliche but true) any team can win. Given the fact the Pats have Brady, Moss and Belichick, I wouldn't count them out of any game - even rematches against the Colts or Saints.

Not to mention how great the Giants were for the first 12 weeks in 2008. They then lost 3 of 4 and bombed in the playoffs.

Again, only 1 (ONE) number 1 seed has won the Super Bowl this decade. Every other winner has had issues but things fell into place come playoff time.

Does anyone remember a Miami loss in 2004?
A 6-5 record in 2001?
Dolts 11-0 in 2005?
Bolts 14-2 in 2006?
Dolts riding 9 game winning streak in 2008?

 

[Sivy]

Tru say. Alot can change between now and January.

Who here wouldn't want another shot at the Colts? We should have beat them.

The only team we have reason to not feel confident against is the Saints, and we may not even have to see them if we do get to the bowl.

Nope, we wouldnt, the Vikings are going to the superbowl.

 

[Bella*chick]

Belichick is so bad that he coached a team to the first ever 16-0 regular season record (and brought in the players to accomplish that feat). He's so bad he coached a team to an 11-5 record (a playoff team in 95% of other seasons) after losing their most valuable player 7 minutes into the season and replacing him with a guy who hadn't started a game since high school.

That Belichick, he's finished. Let's call **** MacPherson and see if he wants to finish out this obviously doomed season.

Amen. Anyone who calls for BB to be fired should automatically be placed a. in a straitjacket or b. on ignore.

Those people are pseudo-Pats fans with a Jets fan's attitude.

 

[Deus Irae]

This season is over in terms of winning a Superbowl. It is now time to discuss when to let Belichick go. Just like a gambler at the craps table in Vegas his run is over.

I know it stings the senses to read that but deep down you know it is true. The failures are mounting.

1) Spy Gate
2) AFCCG loss to Colts after being up 18 points.
3) SB loss to Giants who were 14 point underdogs
4) Wild Cat melt down to Dolphins and thus lost division title.
5) 4th and 2

I think Belichick overextended himself this year after Pioli and McDaniels left, and I think he's made a lot of poor decisions, many of which may be a result of such an overextending. This post of yours just makes no sense to me, however.


How the hell is going 18-0 and then losing to a great pass rushing team when your QB is hobbled, your 3rd down back is injured, your tight ends are injured, and your best pulling offensive lineman is lost for the game any sort of 'failure' that can be put on the head coach? Heck, even with all of that, the Patriots still win that game if Asante doesn't decide to freelance and let Tyree get open.

How is losing the AFCCG to the Colts on the head coach when seemingly half the team was missing for the second half and the defense was forced to put Eric Alexander in to try defending the tight end?

How is Spygate a failure?

How is a bad call on 4th and 2 some sort of proof that the best coach in the game, and the man who's played a huge role in the team getting 3 Super Bowl wins this decade needs to be fired, as opposed to just a mistake that happens when humans are making decisions?

 

[Kontradiction]

I've always said that it's how you play in December and January that counts. Well, today is December 1st. Did we look good last night? Nope. There were failures on both sides of the ball. However, it appears that we are getting healthier for the stretch run and we have five weeks of relatively "easy" teams to work the kinks out against. If we go 12-4 and get in, I still think we can do some damage in the playoffs. There are some HUGE needs that need to be assessed in the offseason though. But, for now, let's just see how this team plays in the stretch run. We have the talent to get it done and #12 is still leading us, so we always have a chance.

This season is over in terms of winning a Superbowl. It is now time to discuss when to let Belichick go. Just like a gambler at the craps table in Vegas his run is over.

I know it stings the senses to read that but deep down you know it is true. The failures are mounting.

1) Spy Gate
2) AFCCG loss to Colts after being up 18 points.
3) SB loss to Giants who were 14 point underdogs
4) Wild Cat melt down to Dolphins and thus lost division title.
5) 4th and 2

I think you should go run into a raging inferno after a post like that.

 

[mosslost]

How do you get 4 points in football? Two back to back safeties?

My guess is that they settled for a FG instead of getting the TD?