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999 The Second Time

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Mrs.PatsFanInVa, Oct 7, 2011.

  1. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

    Mrs.PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #11 Jersey

    Ok....let's try this again. Don't know what happened with the other thread I tried to start - something about "following an invalid link," and "notify administrator." Beats me.

    Anyhow....I'll ask one more time. Does anyone know anything about Herman Cain's 999 plan? Has anyone done the math or read where someone else has done the math? Would it help erase our deficit or would it increase it? I'll be the first one to admit that I'm not good with math - but it seems to me that it would place much more burden on the poor and the middle class than it would on the wealthy simply because the poor spend much more of their income on "things." Would the 9% federal sales tax replace the individual state taxes or would it be in addition to? If it replaces it, how do states get their money?

    And, just as a final question, Herman Cain says it's not "his" plan but a plan which was worked on and developed by "this country's best economists," but claims he is not at liberty to reveal their names. Why not? Wouldn't they want credit for such a good and simple plan to save the nation's economy? Are they embarassed? Ashamed? Were they former Obama advisors gone over to "the other side?" Or, do they not exist at all?

    Chris Wallace Herman Cain | Cain 999 Plan | Video | Mediaite
  2. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    Uh Oh Herm...


    Looks like you aren't tackling that pesky "spending' problem by adressing a broad sales tax.


    Me thinks Tea-Party foolios will not like this kind of Tax and spend mentality.
  3. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

    Mrs.PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #11 Jersey

    Careful, HD, if you're really his friend and people want you to be his vice-presidental candidate, you gotta call him Herb.
  4. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Rookie

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    I might simply call him "Brachtune"

    Thats the name that Tom Hank's charcater gave to Mr. Belvedere on the SNL skit where he was the head of the Belvedere fan club.

    Mr. Cain?....nah...

    Brachtune

    Dailymotion - Mr. Belvedere - a Film & TV video
  5. shirtsleeve

    shirtsleeve Rookie

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    I was wondering what that thread was about. I saw a decoration in a Halloween Superstore that had a house address that was 999 then spun upside down to demonic laughter...but I digress.

    I do not know specifically of his plan, but I cannot support any VAT as long as the income tax system still exists in its current form.
  6. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well the 9-9-9 is phase 1 of his plan. The goal is to get to the "Fair Tax" that would be phase 2 The Fair Tax replaces both the payroll tax, corp taxes and the personal income tax.

    Details on the 9-9-9 here:

    999 | Herman Cain for President


    Website for the Fair Tax:

    Americans For Fair Taxation: Americans For Fair Taxation

    I would prefer the Flat Tax, but the 9-9-9 transitioning to a Fair Tax wold be far better than the current system (as would the 9-9-9 Phase 1). I gather he would go to the Flat Tax if his conditions for the Fair Tax are not met (abolishing the 16th amendment).

    Videos on the Forbes Flat Tax:

    The Case For A Flat Tax - Forbes.com

    Any of these three would cause an explosion of economic growth and job creation (assuming that the congress that would pass any of the above would also get rid of Obamacare.
  7. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

    Mrs.PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #11 Jersey

    Yes, I read that....but it didn't answer any of my questions - and it did raise a few more....like what about Social Security and Medicare? What are "empowerment zones?"

    And again, why no real figures? Why nothing which says, a 9% tax of all working Americans will raise approximately $XX,XXX,XXX.00 and compare that to what we now collect in taxes? It doesn't have to be exact - but if it's going to raise more money you'd think he'd be more than eager to show us how much. Or even break it down to individuals...say someone making $20,000.00 a year now pays X% of his income in taxes - under Mr. Cain's plan he would be paying Y% - and let us see if it's more or less. Ditto for middle class salaries and upper class.

    Does anyone have any figures?
  8. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #11 Jersey

    Oh, cool. So the spell took, after all!! LOL I substituted the text of Newt for Newt's eye and I wasn't sure it would work out all right.

    P.S. Do watch out for black cats, ladders and anyone from that evil cult religion called Mormonism for the next couple days - I'm not sure the whole thing's going to work out correctly.

    :singing::singing::singing:
  9. shirtsleeve

    shirtsleeve Rookie

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    :eek:

    That explains alot about the "reeducation process" I recieved yesterday upon being beamed up to the mothership...:bricks:
  10. KDPPatsfan85

    KDPPatsfan85 Rookie

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    #51 Jersey

    At least Herman Cain has a plan unlike Obama. I kinda like this 999 plan. 9% business tax when the tax for them is well over 25% and that would bring companies back overseas and there will be more jobs for americans. 9% Flat tax will likely put an end to the IRS which is a waste. Then finally something I am def for is a 9% national sales tax, why, because it will make people who dont pay taxes will end up having to pay taxes such as illegal immigrants. I think this is a better plan than what obama has going.
  11. PatsFanInVa

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    I have a better plan. It's my 8 8 8 plan. It's lower! Look, it's lower!

    Hey KD, how can you like it if it's not going to bring in the same revenues? Does that part even matter? Any other bright ideas from the anti-math crowd?

    PFnV
  12. DarrylS

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    It may or may not be a better plan, that remains to be seen. But there is a lot invested in the current system, and any change that equalizes the tax structure will be fought against. If we taxed everybody equally, that would not benefit those who have utilized the current loophole system.. as the "real folks in power" currently pay lower than this threshhold.

    You need to understand power and who really runs this country, and much of what goes on inside the beltway is just an illusion..

    Personally like the Steve Forbes, "Post Card" Tax plan.. simple, no bureaucracy and no loopholes..
  13. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I intend to vote for Cain for the "Same Reason" that Oprah and millions of other racist democrat rats stabbed Hillary in the back and voted for Barack Hussein Obama.

    God Willing
  14. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #11 Jersey

  15. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    I support any plan that blows up the current tax code. The IRS is staffed with many bright, good people who think they're doing a good job. They, the accountants who battle them, and the lawyers who referee the diputes are locked in a bizarre and obscene choreography that would baffle any alien race watching from orbit. Hell, it must be baffling to Canadians and Mexicans!

    Don't wish ill on these fine accountant folks, but their minds would be better used on real economics and assessment of our consumption of resources. The lawyers can form a club and argue with (or otherwise do something else) each other. Better yet, they can grab a shovel and fix a road.
  16. PatsFanInVa

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    Wistah, you're smarter than that.

    You want to blow up the current tax code, fine. But you better at least raise the same amount of revenue with whatever dumbass gimmick someone's peddling that day.

    Regressive plans that make the burden greatest on the poor would suck, like this 9 9 9 bullcrap. But at least do the math and take in enough to pay the country's bills.

    Amazing as that sounds, that's what taxes are for, not just because the gubmit enjoys annoying us with their annual demand for more funds.
  17. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    No, I get that.

    I'm just saying that it's a good start. I've stated many times on this forum that I would prefer a flat tax combined with a consumption tax at the POP on everything other than food, water, and medical care. At least I think I have. Ican't remember much as i get older and more complicated. (I'm very complicated, you know). Of course, the numbers have to be worked out, but I think that they can be sufficiently.

    There should also be a separate tax on every individual to support any military adventure abroad. Dollar-for dollar. No borrowing from other countries. No borrowing from the treasury. what an insane funding mechanism for foreign policy (aka: corporate welfare) enforcement.

    It all adds up. I get it.

    Do you do agree that the current system of the IRS code and related management structure is insane?

    Please keep your response as brief as possible. My male ADD is in high gear today, and I don't have to tell you about the other members' problems with your verbosity!;)
  18. The Brandon Five

    The Brandon Five Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    We know where his wife stands.

    http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/12/824331-who-said.html#post2724369
  19. PatsFanInVa

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    Agree: All added up the IRS code is stupid complicated.

    Vastly unappreciated: All the "loopholes" we complain about have specific reasons for them in many cases. Simple example: Philanthropy is tax-advantaged. No tax break, philanthropy goes poof.

    Philanthropy goes poof, more poverty mitigation spending. That kind of thing.

    No tax code also means government cannot incentivize anything. So you're left with lack of any planning for anything, or mandating stuff. Lots of thou shalt and thou shalt not style government, rather than "I'll give you tree fitty if you..."

    This stuff isn't my whole answer. I just have a big appreciation of unintended consequences.

    I'd love it all to be simpler. Now - let's come up with a kind of "simpler" that somehow makes me comfortable that we won't go way backwards.

    It would have to be at least as progressive as what we've got, which all told, you can easily argue isn't progressive at all. It would have to somehow cover what we'd lose in tax-advantaged stuff we like. It would, in a word, be lampooned as a Soviet style command economy, if you tried to hold the ground of the middle class and the poor while trotting out a feel-good "get rid of the IRS" proposal.


    I think this post is about the length of yours? Maybe just a little longer? I'm trying ;)

    PFnV
  20. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #11 Jersey

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