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53 roster slots, not 59

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Fencer, Aug 17, 2012.

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  1. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    I think everybody would be pretty happy with the following kind of depth:

    QB
    3

    Brady, Hoyer, Mallett

    WR, including ST
    7

    Lloyd, Welker
    Gaffney, Branch, Stallworth
    Slater, Edelman

    TE
    3

    Gronkowski, Hernandez
    Fells/Shiantcoe
    Actually, 4 would be better, given the importance of the position, but that seems unlikely now.

    RB and FB
    5

    Ridley, Bolden
    Woodhead, Vereen
    One of the FBs

    OT
    4

    Solder, Vollmer, Cannon
    Umm, somebody else

    Interior OL
    6

    Mankins, Connolly, Waters
    Three of Wendell, McDonald, Thomas, Koppen

    Total offense: 28

    K/P/LS: 3

    Heavies
    6

    Wilfork, Love, Fanene
    Deaderick, Brace
    Warren/somebody young

    End-of-line
    6

    Jones, Ninkovich
    Cunningham, Bequette
    Scott
    Carter/Francis

    LB, including ST
    6

    Mayo, Hightower, Spikes
    Carpenter
    Two of White/Tarpinian/Koutivides

    S, including ST
    5

    Chung, Gregory, Wilson
    Two of Barrett, Allen, Ihedigbo, Ebner

    CB
    5

    McCourty, Dowling, Arrington
    Moore
    Dennard/Cole/whoever

    Total defense: 28

    But that's 59 guys in total, so there have to be 6 more cuts. Where?

    My first try starts:

    1. PUP Vollmer and go with 3 OTs.
    2. Do without an FB. Kettani to the PS.
    3. Start out with 2 TEs. Fells to PUP.
    4. Warren as the 6th heavy, but on the shadow roster.
    5. Cut a pass rusher. After Ninkovich, Cunningham, Jones, Bequette, the others haven't proven all that much.

    Not sure what to do about the last slot.
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2012
  2. HowardRoark

    HowardRoark Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    6. Cut Branch/Stallworth

    I really hope we don't need to PUP Vollmer. We need him.
  3. Brady'sButtBoy

    Brady'sButtBoy Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    my latest courtesy of pats picker-

    QB (3) Tom Brady, Ryan Mallett, Brian Hoyer
    RB (4) Danny Woodhead, Brandon Bolden, Shane Vereen, Stevan Ridley
    WR (6) Wes Welker, Julian Edelman, Jabar Gaffney, Deion Branch, Matthew Slater, Brandon Lloyd
    TE (3) Rob Gronkowski, Visanthe Shiancoe, Aaron Hernandez
    C (2) Dan Koppen, Ryan Wendell
    G (4) Logan Mankins, Dan Connolly, Nick McDonald, Brian Waters
    T (4) Sebastian Vollmer, Nate Solder, Markus Zusevics, Marcus Cannon
    DE (6) Jonathan Fanene, Jake Bequette, Brandon Deaderick, Ron Brace, Chandler Jones, Trevor Scott
    DT (3) Vince Wilfork, Justin Francis, Kyle Love
    ILB(3) Jerod Mayo, Donta Hightower, Brandon Spikes
    OLB(2) Bobby Carpenter, Rob Ninkovich
    CB (6) Devin McCourty, Ras-I Dowling, Kyle Arrington, Alfonzo Dennard, Nate Ebner, Sterling Moore
    SS (2) Steve Gregory, James Ihedigbo
    FS (2) Patrick Chung, Tavon Wilson
    ST (3) Stephen Gostkowski, Danny Aiken, Zoltan Mesko

    Total players: 53
    Created with Pats Picker: Pats Picker 2012
  4. Batman

    Batman Rookie

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    Here's my best guess

    QB (3) Tom Brady, Brian Hoyer, Ryan Mallett
    RB (4) Danny Woodhead, Stevan Ridley, Brandon Bolden, Shane Vereen
    WR (7) Wes Welker, Jabar Gaffney, Jeremy Ebert, Brandon Lloyd, Donte Stallworth, Matthew Slater, Julian Edelman
    TE (3) Rob Gronkowski, Aaron Hernandez, Visanthe Shiancoe
    C (2) Dan Koppen, Ryan Wendell
    G (5) Nick McDonald, Dan Connolly, Donald Thomas, Brian Waters, Logan Mankins
    T (3) Sebastian Vollmer, Nate Solder, Marcus Cannon
    DE (5) Jake Bequette, Brandon Deaderick, Jonathan Fanene, Chandler Jones, Jermaine Cunningham
    DT (3) Vince Wilfork, Myron Pryor, Kyle Love
    ILB(4) Jerod Mayo, Brandon Spikes, Donta Hightower, Niko Koutouvides
    OLB(2) Bobby Carpenter, Rob Ninkovich
    CB (5) Ras-I Dowling, Kyle Arrington, Alfonzo Dennard, Nate Ebner, Devin McCourty
    SS (2) Steve Gregory, Sterling Moore
    FS (2) Patrick Chung, Tavon Wilson
    ST (3) Zoltan Mesko, Danny Aiken, Stephen Gostkowski

    Total players: 53
    Created with Pats Picker: Pats Picker 2012
  5. BlueThunder

    BlueThunder PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    7 WR's with no Branch and 3 slot type recievers?????

    Not buying it :cool:
  6. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Still too early to predict/project. The next 10-12 days a lot can and will or will not happen. Injuries have a way of making decisions for you. Can't make the club from the tub. Shiancoe seemed like a no brainer the first few days he was here. Hasn't been seen since. Dennard seemed to flash a bit, but between his being out as a rookie and facing pending legal troubles, he could land on the PS. Bolden started out strong but he's struggling more recently. Kettani is the only active FB at the moment... Carter isn't here, and neither is Waters. Koppen appeared done last week, this week not so much. Mallett is being worked out on some ST's... Still haven't found what they're looking for (improvement) in the return game. You'd think with all the versatility on the end of the roster they might have tried teaching one of them to long snap. Because it appears it's going to be a tough cutdown to 53. But again, couple of weeks to go yet before they (let alone us) have enough the information to.

    11 days to 75. 2 weeks to 53. 46 actives on game days. Some roster churning still possible in the first couple of weeks depending on everyone else's cutdowns and this teams early needs, especially if they are waiting for some Puppers.
  7. Batman

    Batman Rookie

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    I was going to go with 6 but didn't have slater in there and I think he will be kept. Slater, Ebert and Edleman are ST picks rather than WR picks I believe Edleman is the only one I think will be out at WR for more than 1 or 2 snaps.. I left branch out as I think Stallworth is better at this stage in their career's.
  8. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Quite agreed.
  9. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    15 FRONT SEVEN

    It seems that we would be fine with 5 of each of the front line groupings, with Pryor on the PUP. We just don't run the 3-4 often enough to need 6 wide-bodies. I would expect the 5th heavy to be inactive in almost all games.

    I see Carpenter is our 2nd ST specialist. While he is a fine asset, I don't expect him to get many reps on the regular team, unless we are sitting Hightower.

    Wilfork, Love, Fanene, Deaderick, Brace/Warren

    Jones, Ninkovich, Scott, Bequette, Cunningham

    Mayo, Spikes, Hightower, Carpenter, White/Tarpinian/Koutouvides

  10. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    We have CB where it's common to have 3 guys on the field at once, at that position isn't getting over 5 heads.

    With TE it's an important rarity to use 3 at once, and we may not even get up to 4 guys.

    So yeah, I can see rolling with only 5 guys at "Heavy" or "End of line/Pass rusher", where as you correctly point out it will be rare to use more than 2 guys at once.

    As for true LB, I can see using 3 at once fairly commonly -- i.e., in the main package for the base defense. But we get extra depth there because a couple of the pass rushers (Ninko for sure, and to a lesser extent Cunningham) have played some form of LB for us in the past.
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2012
  11. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    Here is what I see as of (8/19/2012): This is subject to change during the next 10 days :D

    Pryor - PUP to start season
    Zusevics - NFI list to start season
    Ballard - IR
    Herman- IR
    Richard - IR


    QB: Brady, Hoyer, Mallett
    RB: Woodhead, Ridley, Vereen
    WR: Welker, Gaffney, Lloyd
    TE: Gronkowski, Hernandez
    O-Line: Solder, Vollmer, Cannon, McDonald, Connolly, Waters, Mankins

    D-line: Wilfork, Love, Fanene, Deaderick
    D-Ends / OLBs: Ninkovich, Jones, Cunningham, Scott, Bequette
    LBs: Mayo, Hightower, Spikes, Carpenter, White
    CB: McCourty, Arrington, Dowling, Moore
    S: Chung, Gregory, Wilson

    ST: Edelman, Slater, Gostkowski, Mesko, Aiken

    That is 43 spots, leaving 10 to be filled.

    Branch - Been relatively quiet. Would be an easy cut financially
    Stallworth - He'd be nice to have to help stretch the field, but a 1 trick wonder off the bench isn't ideal.
    Ebert - is a prototypical slot-receiver. Though he put up a 4.38-40 at his Pro-Day, the knock on him is that his game speed isn't nearly as good. Some people have said he's similar to Victor Cruz, the UDFA that signed with the Giants instead of the Pats a couple years ago. So far, he's been non-descript at camp. I think he could be another Deion Branch, but only time will tell.
    Holley -primarily a STer, but has some height
    Demps - has yet to put on the Pats. Is touted as a KR/RB/WR.
    Bolden - started off camp well, but has gone down-hill. Likely headed to the PS.
    Kettani - Haven't heard/seen much of him.
    Larsen - has versatility in that he can play both FB and LB. Is excellent on STs.
    Daniel Fells - has 2 Mil in guaranteed money. Currently on the PUP but rumored to be coming off soon. If actived, he's on the team.
    Vinsanthe Shiancoe- started off really well. Has been hurt, though.
    Tyler Urban - Probably headed for the PS. Has seen a lot of time with Gronk still coming back from his ankle injury. Primarily a blocking TE in college, but does have the ability to catch the ball as well. A PS candidate.
    Alex Silvestro - - Started with the team in 2011 on the PS. Was a DE, but was switched to TE. Has seen a lot of action with Fells on the PUP and Shiancoe and Gronkowski hurting. Probably PS bound.
    Donald Thomas - Reserve O-lineman.
    Darrion Weems - OG/OT reserve lineman. Has done well in camp.
    Kyle Hix - Spent time on the PS last year. Been injured.
    Matt Kopa - Pats were high on him as a potential swing Tackle. He's been hurt.
    Ryan Wendell - Been with the Pats for awhile. Is a OG/OC, with OC being his better position.
    Dan Koppen- Has been exclusively at center for the Pats. His play has been going downhill for the last few years, imho. Can't seem to hold at the POA anymore. Would be an easy cut financially.
    Derrick Dennis-was originally cut by the Phins and was brought in when the Pats had a rash of injuries on the O-line. Has done ok. Don't believe he's been outstanding, but hasn't been a sieve either.
    Kyle Hill - Brought in when the Pats were extremely short on healthy OTs. Don't believe he's distinguished himself in any way.
    Dustin Waldron- Brought in when the Pats were extremely short on healthy OTs. Hasn't really distinguished himself.
    Jeremiah Warren - OT/OG likely to be cut.. Been non-descript.
    Gerard Warren - has been solid for the Pats. Is at the end of his career. wouldn't be a huge loss if cut
    Ron Brace - Has been a disappointment in his 1st 3 years, mainly due to injury. Has shown some flashes of talent. Is fighting well for a roster spot.
    Justin Francis - This kid has been quite a find. He will be a very hard cut as he's likely to get scooped off waivers.
    Tim Bulman - Jounreyman D-lineman. Not really a pass rush-specialist. Don't see how he fits on the Pats long-term
    Marcus Forston - Probably PS bound, though some desperate team may look at him for a depth D-lineman.
    Marcus Harrison - He clearly showed enough to the Pats during his brief stint last year for them to bring him back. He's been non-descript.
    Aaron Lavarias - With the depth at DE/OLB, I see Lavarias destined for the PS.
    Mike Rivera - MLB - has played very well and been noticed in camp. ST play is a bonus.
    Jeff Tarpinian - - Coverage LB and STer. Saw his chances of making the team go up with Dane Fletcher's ACL injury. But, he's still got an upward battle.
    Niko Koutouvides - almost strictly a STer. I see him losing out and either being cut or traded.
    Alfonzo Dennard - There is no denying that the kid has talent. But brains are something he's not shown yet. Plus he has pending legal issues. He has an outside shot at the 5th CB position.
    Sergio Brown - Best on special teams. Proved to be horrible in regular safety duty. The additions of Gregory, Wilson, and Ebner have Brown facing being cut.
    Josh Barrett - "Stolen" off waivers from the Broncos 2 years ago, Barrett spent his first year on the IR. Last year, his "promise" was enough to lead BB to believe that James Sanders was expendable. Barrett didn't live up to that promise and is not fighting for a roster spot.
    James Ihedigbo - Ihedigbo was brought in last year before the safety exodus of Meriweather and Sanders being cut. He's a solid tackler and good special teamer, but he should be considered for regularly playing time only in an emergency.
    Will Allen - Veteran CB who has spent the entire TC at safety. Allen could provide veteran depth at that position.
    Marquice Cole-Cole is a STer who is fighting for the 5th CB spot.
    Ross Ventrone - Ross seems to be the forgotten man. He set a record (imho) for the number of transactions in which a player was involved in.
    Nate Ebner - This is a kid who everyone is rooting for. He's a former rugby player and excelled on special teams for Ohio State. And from the sounds of it, this kid is going to force his way onto the team because of his ST coverage skills.
  12. WhiZa

    WhiZa Rookie

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    QB (3) Tom Brady, Brian Hoyer, Ryan Mallett
    RB (4) Danny Woodhead, Shane Vereen, Brandon Bolden, Stevan Ridley
    WR (7) Wes Welker, Matthew Slater, Julian Edelman, Donte Stallworth, Deion Branch, Jabar Gaffney, Brandon Lloyd
    TE (3) Rob Gronkowski, Visanthe Shiancoe, Aaron Hernandez
    C (1) Ryan Wendell
    G (4) Dan Connolly, Nick McDonald, Donald Thomas, Logan Mankins
    T (3) Sebastian Vollmer, Marcus Cannon, Nate Solder
    DE (5) Brandon Deaderick, Jonathan Fanene, Jake Bequette, Trevor Scott, Chandler Jones
    DT (4) Vince Wilfork, Justin Francis, Myron Pryor, Kyle Love
    ILB(4) Jerod Mayo, Brandon Spikes, Donta Hightower, Niko Koutouvides
    OLB(3) Bobby Carpenter, Rob Ninkovich, Jermaine Cunningham
    CB (5) Ras-I Dowling, Kyle Arrington, Sterling Moore, Marquice Cole, Devin McCourty
    SS (2) James Ihedigbo, Steve Gregory
    FS (2) Patrick Chung, Tavon Wilson
    ST (3) Stephen Gostkowski, Danny Aiken, Zoltan Mesko

    Total players: 53
    Created with Pats Picker: Pats Picker 2012

    I had 45 locks and had to pick 8 more (those 8 were Branch, Gaffney, Pryor, Shiancoe, Thomas, Koutouvides, Cole, and Ihedigbo). It ended up perfect because I was able to keep Branch, Gaffney, and Stallworth. I figure it will be a high flying attack and we will see a lot of 4 WR sets as compared to last year with the 2 TE sets.

    The toughest choice was Visanthe Shiancoe or Daniel Fells. Both deserve to be on a 53-man roster somewhere in the NFL. Best-case for Pats is to keep Fells on PUP and put Visanthe on the 53. Then after 6-9 weeks they can make a 2nd decision on who to keep.

    I picked Ihedigbo over Brown/Barrett because he was starting over them last year.

    Cole over Dennard. Best-case is Dennard going to IR and red-shirt his freshman year.

    I have Stallworth as a lock because reports say he still has speed, he's more mature and can contribute on ST. Can't say all that about Branch and Gaffney. Though all could contribute.

    I kept Waters off, but if he comes back Thomas probably will be the odd man out.

    Also no Koppen here. I just think he is older and not as flexible as a younger guy with room to grow. The Pats didn't sign him right away either, but with Waters not showing up (assuming they knew in advance) probably made him more valuable.
  13. QB12

    QB12 Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    What about Demps Whiz-a?
  14. BananaRepublican

    BananaRepublican Banned

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    I'm glad you raised these issues. Too early yet. Koppen could in fact find his game and be right in the middle of things.
  15. BananaRepublican

    BananaRepublican Banned

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    Mallet - do we need him? I'd rather see Edleman play if an emergency came up.

    He's got his shot coming over the next ten days but I don't think I've read one encouraging bullet point on this kid since he had that good appearance last year in pre-season. And then flopped in the next, and next, and next appearances.

    I think they got it wrong with Mallet. Is anybody willing to deal for the kid? Highly dubious. Even the Dolphins wouldn't want him.
  16. WhiZa

    WhiZa Rookie

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    I put him in the same boat as Waters. I need to see him practice before I make any changes. If I had to put him on though I'd probably cut one of the WRs (Branch, Stallworth, Gaffney). It actually might be Stallworth who would of contributed most to ST. It really depends on who BB thinks provides the least at the WR position.
  17. TheComeback

    TheComeback Rookie

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    QB (3) Tom Brady, Ryan Mallett, Brian Hoyer
    RB (4) Danny Woodhead, Shane Vereen, Brandon Bolden, Stevan Ridley
    WR (6) Wes Welker, Brandon Lloyd, Jabar Gaffney, Donte Stallworth, Matthew Slater, Julian Edelman
    TE (3) Rob Gronkowski, Aaron Hernandez, Daniel Fells
    C (2) Dan Koppen, Ryan Wendell
    G (4) Logan Mankins, Brian Waters, Dan Connolly, Nick McDonald
    T (3) Sebastian Vollmer, Nate Solder, Marcus Cannon
    DE (6) Chandler Jones, Ron Brace, Brandon Deaderick, Jonathan Fanene, Jake Bequette, Trevor Scott
    DT (2) Vince Wilfork, Kyle Love
    ILB(4) Jerod Mayo, Brandon Spikes, Donta Hightower, Niko Koutouvides
    OLB(3) Bobby Carpenter, Rob Ninkovich, Jermaine Cunningham
    CB (6) Devin McCourty, Ras-I Dowling, Sterling Moore, Kyle Arrington, Marquice Cole, Alfonzo Dennard
    SS (2) Steve Gregory, James Ihedigbo
    FS (2) Patrick Chung, Tavon Wilson
    ST (3) Stephen Gostkowski, Zoltan Mesko, Danny Aiken

    Total players: 53
    Created with Pats Picker: Pats Picker 2012

    Dennard either ends upon the 53 or IR, depending on his injury status. He won't make it through waivers.
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2012
  18. patsinthesnow

    patsinthesnow PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    QB (3) Tom Brady, Brian Hoyer, Ryan Mallett
    RB (5) Stevan Ridley, Shane Vereen, Danny Woodhead, Brandon Bolden, Jeff Demps
    WR (5) Wes Welker, Brandon Lloyd, Jabar Gaffney, Deion Branch, Matthew Slater
    TE (4) Rob Gronkowski, Aaron Hernandez, Daniel Fells, Visanthe Shiancoe
    C (3) Dan Connolly, Ryan Wendell, Nick McDonald
    G (3) Logan Mankins, Brian Waters, Donald Thomas
    T (3) Nate Solder, Sebastian Vollmer, Marcus Cannon
    DE (5) Chandler Jones, Brandon Deaderick, Jonathan Fanene, Jake Bequette, Trevor Scott
    DT (3) Vince Wilfork, Kyle Love, Ron Brace
    ILB(4) Jerod Mayo, Brandon Spikes, Donta Hightower, Jeff Tarpinian
    OLB(3) Rob Ninkovich, Jermaine Cunningham, Bobby Carpenter
    CB (5) Devin McCourty, Ras-I Dowling, Kyle Arrington, Sterling Moore, Alfonzo Dennard
    SS (2) Steve Gregory, Tavon Wilson
    FS (2) Patrick Chung, Nate Ebner
    ST (3) Stephen Gostkowski, Zoltan Mesko, Danny Aiken

    Total players: 53

    -This is a TE offense, I chose a 4th TE over a 6th WR. Edelman is a waste of space IMO.

    -I trust the reports on Brace, he makes it over Warren.

    -The toughest was Alfonzo Dennard. He hasn't been at camp much, but then I thought, by the time Superbowl 47 rolls around 1 or 2 of our CBs will be injured. Do I want Dennard as our 3rd CB or some bum off the street? (Molden)
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2012
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