2007 Patriots vs. 2013 Broncos

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Ozymandias, Sep 24, 2013.

  1. Ozymandias

    Ozymandias In the Starting Line-Up

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    Since we obviously have folks that honestly believe that the Broncos have apparently the most prolific offense in the league's history, thought the topic deserves it's own thread for comedic purpoes, as it gave me a good laugh in the MNF thread.

    Seemingly every season when any offense starts hot people immediately say it's as good as '07's team. For example, the 2011 Packers comparison was clear indication that a lot people on this board don't actually watch real football games and instead live in a fantasy football land where beating up on bottom feeders makes you the best ever apparently.

    Why do I bring up the '11 Packers? Simply because, they, like the Broncos, benefited from a pathetically weak schedule and beat up on all of those scrub teams, but were destroyed when they actually went up against a legit defense. I don't even see the '13 Broncos being better than the '11 Packers on offense either, never mind the Patriots '07 squad.

    But, I digress. So... let's break it down by virtue of the Tale of the Tape:

    QB - Tom Brady was in his prime at this point and had the best season ever by a QB in any type of elements by any metric. Manning is 37 and his arm strength looks Chad Pennington-esque and we aren't even in the latter portion of the season yet. When the temperature starts to drop his play will along with it. Want proof of that? Refer to the AFCDG against the Ravens, where Manning could barely throw a ball beyond the sticks. Or did you block that out of your memory because it debunks your weak point?

    Advantage: Patriots

    RB - Sammy Morris (pre-injury), Kevin Faulk, and Maroney while nothing special are about the same as what the Broncos got. Moreno has been solid so far this season, but he has been a flop, near bust level. Ball is unproven and couldn't separate himself from the likes of Ronnie Hillman, who is a undersized turnover-prone RB.

    Advantage: Patriots (slight)

    WR - Don't I really need to go over this? Moss, at the tail end of his prime, was still the NFL's most dangerous deep threat and easily the best offensive weapon that season. Welker was 6 years younger, and had more speed and quickness than he does now, and was a lot more sure-handed. He's on the decline now in Denver. His skills are diminishing and his hands failing him more and more with each passing game. While Thomas is a good player, he doesn't compare to Moss in any way. Decker is arguably better than Gaffney and/or Stallworth.

    Advantage: Patriots

    TE - Julius Thomas, Jacob Tamme, Joel Dreessen and Virgil Green as a unit are better than Benjamin Watson, Kyle Brady, and David Thomas

    Advantage: Broncos

    OL - Ryan Clady is on IR and out for the year. Even before that the Patriots OLine still had the edge.

    Advantage: Patriots

    Schedule - In 2007, the Patriots had the 3rd hardest schedule, playing teams who had a .535 Winning %. They went undefeated against that schedule en route to scoring the most points ever.

    Prior to the start of the 2013 season the least difficult schedule of 2013 was:

    1. Denver Broncos (.430)

    That was largely attributable to their weak divisional and inter-divisional match-ups. Three weeks into the season, they still have the fourth easiest schedule from here on out (the Patriots have the second hardest for anyone who cares, by the way). Playing against scrub divisions like the AFCW (sans the Chiefs) and the NFCE will make a lot of offenses look good. As does beating on bottom feeders like the Giants and the Raiders.

    Padding the stats against horrendous teams doesn't suddenly make you the best offense ever. Please, stop spewing this nonsense every time you see an offense that scores a lot points.

    Verdict: 2007 Patriots >>> 2013 Broncos

    Now, let's hear these irrelevant arguments anointing them the best ever when they haven't done anything or beaten anyone of note. Go!
  2. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

    Until people started getting hurt last year, I thought the Patriots offense was lights out. The defense let them down a bit, but the offense was well oiled. Then Gronk went down and everything went upside down.
  3. patsfan-1982

    patsfan-1982 In the Starting Line-Up

    I think everyone is a little bit jealous of how Denver is playing right now, who cares what the 2007 pats did or what the Broncos are doing all I care about are the 2013 pats cause at the end of the day they have the same 3-0 record that Denver dose so there is no reason to be jealous
  4. Sciz

    Sciz PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    At this point, I think it's pretty simple. The 2007 Pats kept up this pace for 10 games. So far, the Broncos haven't.


    #12 Jersey

    I keep hearing of this apparent 'weak' arm Peyton has now.

    Well if 13 TDs,No INTs and a QB Rating of 134.0 after 3 games is a characteristic of a weak arm,then give me a QB with a weak arm anyday.

    Peyton is winning with smarts and knowing where to throw the ball into a safe area....that's all you need,you don't need 80 yard bombs to win in this league.
  6. Ice_Ice_Brady

    Ice_Ice_Brady In the Starting Line-Up

    I'm not tying to be a Manning-hater, but honestly I think the 2011 Packers were more impressive than this Broncos team. The Broncos are very good, but I really don't see them as more dominant than the Pats offense the last few seasons. The 07 Patriots and 11 Packers were both reaching 30 points by second quarter before calling off the dogs.

    With nearly all of the record-breaking offenses of the last ten years or so, 2004 Colts (along with several other teams in that era), 2007 Patriots, 2010 Patriots, 2011 Packers, 2012 Patriots, the irony has been that in the playoffs, the offenses failed to put up even an average amount of points (21 or so). The common link is that they were all very one-dimensional with excellent timing-based passing systems but could do very little against cold weather, a fierce pass rush, and the high expectations of the postseason. It's almost like they had run out of gas when they needed it the most.

    I hope we can add the 2013 Broncos to that list eventually.
  7. MrNathanDrake

    MrNathanDrake In the Starting Line-Up

    #95 Jersey

    Who gives a *****.

    The only thing that matters is Manning will choke in the playoffs again.
  8. PATRlOT

    PATRlOT Banned


    end thread


    #12 Jersey

    Hate to say this but Brady hasn't exactly been stalwart in the playoffs either lately the past few years ... Both of these future HOFs have struggled in the playoffs.
  10. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    With 127 points through the first three games of the season, the Broncos are comfortably ahead of the 114 point 2007 Patriots scoring pace.
  11. Salva135

    Salva135 Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

    I think Peyton hates that Brady holds the TD record. They are cordial but I don't think he respects Brady all that much and wants to regain this record. Sadly, he's a favorite to do it.
  12. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    #3 Jersey

    For now. . . .
  13. Bravo777

    Bravo777 In the Starting Line-Up

    #12 Jersey

    Even though the Broncos offense looks scary good, I still don't think they'll go undefeated or win the SB. Seahawks and 49ers would dismantle the offense and defense if they were to play in the SB. Given how difficult it is to go undefeated (2011 Packers, 2009 Saints and Colts, and the 2008 Titans) I just don't see it happening. All of those teams (maybe minus the Titans) were absolutely great teams, and yet, they didn't go undefeated. And all of them, minus the Saints, didn't win a SB.
  14. Ozymandias

    Ozymandias In the Starting Line-Up

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    These stats without the proper context are meaningless though.

    Manning went up against a Ravens defense starting six new starters than last season's Super Bowl team including two new safeties, in the horrendous Michael Huff and immortally garbage James Ihedigbo. I'd expect a lot competent QBs could have a career day against that tandem. Are people forgetting what Ihedigbo looked like in a Patriots uniform in 2011's epic failure attempt at a secondary? They must be.

    Secondly, week 2 the Broncos got perhaps the NFC's worst secondary in the Giants. Their Pass D is awful and can't stop anybody. Even Cam Newton looked good against them.

    And finally, tonight against the Raiders, who are easily among the top 3 least talented rosters in the NFL. So those stats don't mean as much because from a contextual point, having a field day against terrible secondary/teams doesn't prove anything. Let's see how they do when the teams they're facing actually look like legit NFL defenses, and not CFL ones.
  15. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Of course. I don't expect Manning to be able to keep this up forever, but the Broncos are killing their opponents right now. Their next 5 opponents:


    Manning should be able to keep piling on the points all the way through the Broncos bye week.


    #12 Jersey

    We could also say that while the rookie WRs of the Pats are learning slowly doesn't mean they'll be great receivers by season's end while we will surely rely on Gronkowski and Amendola to stay healthy and at the end it will be those 2 who will determine of how good...or not the offense will be in December and beyond,the rookies will have to contribute as well of course.

    and look who we faced....the Putrid Jets,the Bills who have a horrid defense and the Bucs who have no respectable QB and the 2 divisional games were nailbiters.

    Lets face it,neither the Pats or the Broncos have faced anybody yet,as a matter of fact I will go and say that of both teams 6 combined opponents thus far,only the Ravens may enter the playoffs and starting next week the Pats will have an early idea of the team they have when facing a decent opponent and pretty good QB for the first time in 2013.

    And while we discuss Denver and New England...don't go to sleep on Cincy,the Bengals are a sleeping Giant this season and have won some quality games against good teams.


    #12 Jersey

    550 Points and 5,000 Yards is definitely not impossible for the Broncos and Peyton should their offense stay healthy
  18. Salva135

    Salva135 Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

    They are going to beat both points and passing TDs. Make no mistake, Peyton is on a mission to beat Brady's records.
  19. DocHoliday

    DocHoliday In the Starting Line-Up

    I agree. The only way Manning doesn't break it is injury.
  20. Ozymandias

    Ozymandias In the Starting Line-Up

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    The majority of this post is irrelevant and nonsensical.

    Notice that the title of the thread is '2007 Patriots vs. 2013 Broncos'. No one is comparing this year's Patriots to either of them. I know this is difficult for you to do, but it helps to read and stay within the proper context of the thread, then you could appear to at minimum give off the illusion that you know what you're talking about.

    Most of what you stated has nothing to do with the thread at hand. Good try, good effort.

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