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"18 suicides per day among America's 25 million veterans."

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by weswelker#83, Apr 22, 2008.

  1. weswelker#83

    weswelker#83 Rookie

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  2. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

  3. FreeTedWilliams

    FreeTedWilliams pfadmins PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    I bet you it is a much lesser percentage as Goth kids.
  4. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand Rookie

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    #37 Jersey

    Or Emo's.
    :bricks:
  5. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Is this another NYT piece on vet murder rates that proved to be eroneous. Also, where I'd suspect combat veteran rates would be higher, how do they compare to past wars? Are we doing a better job of helping soldiers deal with PTS, or are we doing more poorly?
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2008
  6. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    The latest data here :

    http://www.who.int/mental_health/prevention/suicide/suiciderates/en/

    says the rate was 17.6 per 100,000 among U.S. males (which is what most veterans are). That is a rate of 4400 per 25 million. That's annual. Knocked down to daily it comes to 12.

    So the rate is higher but that doesn't take into account the fairly decent percentage of, say, 13 and younger who aren't reasonable suicide candidates. There might be one here of there but to count them in the stats (which the % out of 100K for the general population would), makes the stats off some.

    Bottom line, the Veteran number is 33% higher. This probably can't quote be accounted for based solely on population analysis but is puts veterans and the general population very much in the same order of magnitude.
  7. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    It always gets me when I see something like that. It implies that veterans are mentally scared and can't handle dealing with the "bad things" they have done.

    The vast majority of veterans return home and live normal life. Some others who are predisposed to mental illness or become drug or alcohol dependent have a hard time.

    Have you ever seen a Hollywood movie in which a veteran of any war from Vietnam on is portrayed as a happy and well adjusted person? I haven't, and the press reflects the same thinking.
  8. Wildo7

    Wildo7 Totally Full of It

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    Well the act of war isn't a normal thing to go through so it would logically follow that many wouldn't be "normal" when they return. The rates of psychological trauma and mental health issues amongst veterans are astounding, and understandably so, whether or not they "did bad things" as you so simplistically put it. Human beings aren't meant to deal with people around them dying in front of their eyes all the time.

    So you can't try to twist this into an attack on the soldiers by claiming it implies "soldiers are to weak to deal with the bad things they have done." What it does imply is that war is hell and it takes a pretty huge toll on the domestic front as well.
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2008
  9. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    I've known plenty of soldiers--in my own family--from WWII and Vietnam, who came back and got on with their lives.
  10. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    I've been there and done that so I happen to know what I'm talking about. And yes, many of us never forget what we experienced, nor should we.

    But a huge percentage of us did return and have lived normal lives and contributed to society.

    The media and entertainment industry over the past 35 years have portrayed war veterans as deeply mentally scared individuals who can't cope with normal life. I and many veterans resent this and know it's the furthest thing from the truth.

    But maybe you know more about it than I do.
  11. bmf31c

    bmf31c Rookie

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    Carry me home by John M. Del Vecchio is a great book about "coming home." He delves into how some adjust well and some don't, great read.
  12. Wildo7

    Wildo7 Totally Full of It

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    Never claimed to know more than you about it. Also ever claimed that 100% come back mental wrecks. But a large portion do and there's plenty of evidence for that. Getting defensive and lashing out at a supposedly false media and entertainment industry portrayal isn't going to change that. The machismo culture of the military doesn't lend itself to people opening up about their mental problems either. It's not a sign of weakness, it's a natural human reaction to high stress and death. The fact that you take PTSD as some sort of insult or weakness shows the lengths to which veterans most likely go to cover it up.
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2008
  13. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Thanks for enlightening me. I'll run down to the VA tomorrow for treatment.
  14. Wildo7

    Wildo7 Totally Full of It

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    I take it back, you don't seem defensive at all:rolleyes:
  15. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Nah, he just thinks you're a mercenary.
  16. Wildo7

    Wildo7 Totally Full of It

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    trying to stir the pot huh Fake world? It's alright I realize you don't have anything of value to add.
  17. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Rookie

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    Maybe you should find something else to call RW? I mean...if you're making a play on "real world"...maybe "fake moon" or "fake asteroid" would be better?

    ;)
  18. Wildo7

    Wildo7 Totally Full of It

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    How about "fake douchebag?" does that work?
  19. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    So bringing your opinions to someone's attention is stirring the pot? Hmm...so you're saying your own opinions have no value. Finally we agree! [​IMG]

    I'm just teasing pal. ;)
  20. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Save your breathe. Waldo doesn't like to be given advice. He takes it personally. :(

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