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Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by ice, Mar 6, 2007.

  1. ice

    ice Rookie

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    according to miguel's Page , before Evans, Morris, and Izzo. Do you think that is enough for two more major signings? Possably Stallworth and our own Asante, and then leave enough for Draft signing and injury reserve.
  2. Return of the Nizz

    Return of the Nizz Rookie

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    Any long-term deal for Samuel would lower his cap number not increase it, so yes.
  3. solman

    solman Rookie

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    The Patriot's long term cap situation remains very strong.

    BB/SP are not realistically going to be constrained by cap space.

    They are going to be constrained by the availability of players who, over the long haul, can improve the team by more than it costs to acquire them.
  4. skaIownsIyou

    skaIownsIyou Rookie

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    he is correct if he signs a long term deal he'll get around 3-4 million pending the contract....instead of the 7 mill? for the franchise for cbs? idk...
  5. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Miguel has added everyone and he shows us $11.88 mil under.

    He didn't add Stallworth who may or may not have signed or could be taking a pen out of his pocket and putting it back. He also didn't add a Randy Moss thread to his pages.
  6. solman

    solman Rookie

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    He is also still listing Welker at the 2nd round tender level. I would expect this to increase by $1M+.
  7. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Since, thank God, his franchise tag salary is already accounted for. :)
  8. Fumblerooski

    Fumblerooski Rookie

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    As an offset, he also has Dillon on there are taking all of his cap hit this year. It can be split between this cap year and next cap year if they want more room this cap year.
  9. Patriot Missile

    Patriot Missile Rookie

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    #75 Jersey

    I'd like to see us lock down Warren long term.
  10. SamBamsFan

    SamBamsFan Rookie

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    Does that factor in the $6.2m or so that we need to sign our draft picks?
  11. Miguel

    Miguel Patriots Salary Cap Guru PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No. My numbers are of today.

    BTW, there is no way that it wil take $6.2 million to sign the draft picksl
  12. patriotspride

    patriotspride Banned

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    wilfork also.i want to see them keep more of there core players .
  13. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    The Pats aren't going to negotiate with Warren until the end of this year, when he has 1 year left on his contract.

    Wilfork won't have his contract extension until the end of 2009.

    That is their modus operendi.
  14. smg93

    smg93 Rookie

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    How much do you think it would take to sign the draft picks? Is it a lot less than the 6.2 million?
  15. SeanBruschi54

    SeanBruschi54 Rookie

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    #24 Jersey

    Not a ton less but wasnt last years rookie cap needed to be 5 million?
  16. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Way less.

    Maroney went 21st, his cap hit was $1.2M last year. Worst case, multiply that by two for two first rounders, that's $2.5M. Rookie inflation is easily evened out by 21st vs. 24th and 28th.

    Dave Thomas, 3rd round is our next pick, had a cap hit of $435 - about $150K over the minimum. So every player 3rd round and on you're looking at $100K - $200 over the player he replaces on the roster.

    Say 7 of those for another million, that's $3.5M, there's still a few million left and I believe the scenario for the two #1s was worse than it'll really be.
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2007
  17. Miguel

    Miguel Patriots Salary Cap Guru PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Last year only the prorated portion of the signing bonus for those picked in the 3rd round or later hit the cap when they signed. Last year's draft pick class had a net cap cost of $1.5 million because of the rule of 51.
  18. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    So really, we're looking at 12-12.5M or so, taking into account for rookie signings, but also taking into account for booting the people replaced by our picks. Sounds like even with the rainy day fund for in-season pickups, we can have a ways to go before being done.
  19. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    Except for Thomas, I don't see anybody there whose cap hits are terrifically understated or back-end loaded.

    This is a good thing.
  20. Fumblerooski

    Fumblerooski Rookie

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    The top 51 players count toward the cap at this time of year

    Right now the 51st player is Childress at a $366K cap hit
    the 50th is Andrews at $378K
    the 49th is Smith at $384K

    These players are equivalent to what a 4th round pick hits the cap for. As more vets are added (Stallworth, Seau, Brown, etc) the bottom #51 salary goes up.

    There are 4 players already counted toward the cap that probably won't make the final 53 - Mruckowski - $856K, Baker $856K, Jonathan Smith $518K and Kranchick $441K. Those 4 total $2.6 mil in cap hits. If they were replaced by rookies at $285K, that saves @ $1.5 Mil on the cap. That is enough to pay a top rookie so it is a wash. The other first round pick would also for conversation purposes make $1.3 mil (cap hit $1.3 - $384 = $1 mil) and the third rounder come in at @ $150K additional cap hit.

    So, assuming 7 rookies make the 53 (this is too high IMHO, more like 5) the cap hit to sign the rookies is in the $1.5 mil range. Take it to $2 mil to be conservative, which is a far cry from the $6 mil numbers I am seing floating around here for the "rookie pool". The cap hits are different than the "pool" numbers.
  21. SamBamsFan

    SamBamsFan Rookie

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    But before the draft, the numbers come out for the "Rookie Pool". I thought all of that money in the pool (whether it was used, or otherwise), had to be set aside to participate in the draft. I thought our numbers last year were $5.5M (which would have increased w/ the extra !st rounder). According to redzone.com they were:
    New England 10(picks) $4,617,429

    This year we'll probably have 9-10 picks when you include the compensation picks, what do you see as our projected cost entering the draft?
  22. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Just a noodge from a fellow poster to everybody -- man up on the soup kitchen. We get good info from Miguel, he has 1 request in return.

    Just sayin.

    PFnV
  23. solman

    solman Rookie

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    No.

    The rookie pool is a MAXIMUM, not a minimum.

    The Pats don't have to sign any of their rookies, and can spend all of their cap space on veterans.
  24. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    This is true. But then they are not allowed to participate in the draft.
  25. Miguel

    Miguel Patriots Salary Cap Guru PatsFans.com Supporter

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    That's not true. The rookie pool for each team is announced AFTER the draft.

    The rookie pool is, essentially, a cap within a salary cap. It represents the maximum in aggregate salary cap value that a team is permitted to invest in its draft choices and also the undrafted free agents it signs. It is included in, not exclusive of, the team's overall spending limit of $71.101 million for the 2002 campaign." .."Because of the so-called "rule of 51" -- which stipulates that only the 51 highest-paid players on a team's roster count against its salary cap during the offseason -- clubs will not have to carve out the entire difference between their available cap space and rookie pool allocation. For the most part, teams' middle- and low-round draft choices don't rate among the 51 highest-paid players on the roster and make no dent in the salary cap.
  26. Miguel

    Miguel Patriots Salary Cap Guru PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I hate to guess but I would say that the net cost will be around the same as last year - $1.5 million.
  27. SamBamsFan

    SamBamsFan Rookie

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    Thanks for the clarification.
  28. solman

    solman Rookie

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    The formula is determined before the draft. Teams already know how much rookie pool space is going to be assigned to their picks.

    The announcement is delayed because (non-compensatory) picks can be traded right up until the moment they are used.

    Whichever team uses the pick gets the rookie pool space associated with that pick.

    This is why when San Diego traded Eli Manning to the Giants, they kept the rookie pool space associated with the number one pick.
  29. Miguel

    Miguel Patriots Salary Cap Guru PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How???

    Page 33 of the CBA says "The list of each Formula Allotment attributed to each draft selection shall be agreed to by the NFL and the NFLPA, and shall not be disclosed to Clubs, Players, Player Agents or the public
  30. PatsFanSince74

    PatsFanSince74 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Why doesn't this thread have a Star or two? It's one of the best and most informative in a while?

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