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-   -   Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy (http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/12/314167-obama-unions-you-exempted-cadillac-tax-im-your-boy.html)

NEPatriot 01-15-2010 12:33 PM
Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
Democrats, Unions Reach Deal on Health Tax - WSJ.com

Quote:
Democratic negotiators acceded to union demands for a scaled-back tax on high-end health-insurance plans, exempting union contracts from the tax until 2018, five years beyond the start date for other workers
While everybody else is paying cadillac tax for ObamaCARE, unions are exempted from it. Obama is a good Union's boy.

patsfan13 01-15-2010 01:13 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
This is a disgrace, people who work in non union shops non governmental employees are being discriminated against. Chicago crony politics.


My neighbor and I make the same money, we have the same medical plan, he works in a union shop, I don't. His medical plan isn't taxed, my plan is taxed at 40%.


Amy Obama supporters care to try and defend this?

JackBauer 01-15-2010 01:23 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by patsfan13 (Post 1693557)
This is a disgrace, people who work in non union shops non governmental employees are being discriminated against. Chicago crony politics.


My neighbor and I make the same money, we have the same medical plan, he works in a union shop, I don't. His medical plan isn't taxed, my plan is taxed at 40%.


Amy Obama supporters care to try and defend this?
This is the rationale I've read behind it:

Quote:
Critics will interpret the temporary exemption as a special interest carve out for a vital political constituency, but it makes perfect policy sense. Unlike non-union labor negotiations which can be re-negotiated annually, collective bargaining agreements tie unions down for multiple years. The temporary exemption allows them to get out of the way of a moving train. After all, collective bargaining agreements are not the same as raise negotiations for non-union employees. While the latter operates under the implicit assumption that a certain percentage of compensation is dedicated for health benefits and is exempt from taxation, a union collective bargaining agreement enters into an explicit trade off between taxable and nontaxable compensation.

Typically, a union negotiates a certain dollar agreement from the employer for total compensation as well as how that will be divided between wages and benefits. The employer could agree to compensate its workers $30 per hour and the union would decide to allocate $20 to wages and $10 to health care. Or, it may choose to spend $15 on wages and $15 on health care. Whatever the case, the unions weighs the benefits of receiving tax deductible health benefits with the immediacy of higher wages and agrees to abide by the agreement for several years.

Without an exemption period, the excise tax would change the rules midstream. Non-union workers with expensive health care benefits could change their compensation package in anticipation of the new tax, but unions with health policies of above $24,000 would pay higher taxes until their contract expires. The temporary exemption still accomplishes the goals of the excise tax — pushing people into lower cost health care plans — but gives unions more time to change their behavior and switch to cheaper policies.

FreeTedWilliams 01-15-2010 01:27 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
I am more and more convinced that this bill will not get past the Supreme Court. I can't see how you can tell people that they must buy something or pay a penalty (an unlike car insurance, you can not choose, not to live).

How can it be legal for the federal government ot subzidize Louisiana and Nebraska and not the other states?

How can you tax a non-union worker, and not tax a union worker? What about Right to work states?

Hopefully the good people of Massachusetts will put an end to this travesty next week, but I have a strange feeling that the voter fraud machine that is Obama will be coming to town soon!

Real World 01-15-2010 01:41 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
A new kind of politics my arse. :rolleyes:

Patsfanin Philly 01-15-2010 02:31 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackBauer (Post 1693576)
This is the rationale I've read behind it:
Can I ask where you got the quote for the rationale? It might help to put it in context.

patsfan13 01-15-2010 03:00 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackBauer (Post 1693576)
This is the rationale I've read behind it:

So someone might take a $12/ hr job rather than a job that pays $15/hr due to the health ins benefit, now they will be screwed by Obama.

Holy Diver 01-15-2010 03:10 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by patsfan13 (Post 1693768)
So someone might take a $12/ hr job rather than a job that pays $15/hr due to the health ins benefit, now they will be screwed by Obama.
First of all.....Who is hiring ANYONE?

The conservative experiment not only failed, it has taken us back a generation or two. We no longer manufacture anything but weapons, we have successfully shipped all our jobs overseas, we have dropped the tax rate for the wealthiest americans.

Now the few reamaining unions, who negotiated lower pay, to recieve a better nebefit package, and you people still B!TCHHH!!!

Its amazing!

Unions are the last voice of the worker against elite corporate greed. Imagine for a second if they did thge same thing to your VOTES as they are doing to the unions in this country?

Unions and their members should not be punished for this.

THis is a fair deal.

BelichickFan 01-15-2010 03:19 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holy Diver (Post 1693779)
THis is a fair deal.
Of course it's not "fair". If two identical earners have to pay a different tax then it's not fair.

What's the end result, though ? The bill gets less revenue which means it has to be made up somewhere which means taxing the "rich" many of whom are small business owners and there will be more layoffs or less hiring.

If it's fair to tax a non union person making $X then it's fair to tax a union person making $X.

Regarding the contract, contracts can be re-opened, obama is just bending over for his friends as usual.

JackBauer 01-15-2010 03:21 PM
Re: Obama to UNIONS: You are exempted from cadillac tax. I'm your boy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BelichickFan (Post 1693794)
Regarding the contract, contracts can be re-opened,
They can? How sure are you of this?


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