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-   -   Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL (http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/230448-pro-football-weekly-pats-intent-bolstering-ol.html)

NE39 04-19-2009 07:51 PM

Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
This note was in Pro Football Weekly's Whispers column:

Quote:

By virtue of their immediate team needs and the prospects with whom they’ve been spending the most pre-draft time meeting, it looks to be a defense-heavy lottery for the Patriots. But the way we hear it, the club is intent on bolstering its offensive line, as well. Only two of their five OL starters are under contract through 2010, and the new offensive brain trust wants the linemen to be well-versed in the system should there need to be a significant changing of the guard (and tackle) following the upcoming season.
Makes sense.

LloydBraun 04-19-2009 08:02 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
I agree with this. I think they find the next LT in this draft. If they re-sign Mankins, it will be big bucks. Light may be a cap casualty after 2009.

There is a lot of O-line talent in this draft and the Pats have a lot of picks. They will take a T to at least replace Kaczur and they will take a G to take over for Neal, or even MAnkins, after this year.

unoriginal 04-19-2009 08:08 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
This must mean late-round draft picks: the last three first-day lineman have just strolled into the starting lineup, two of them penciled in from game one.

And the spot of the other, Kaczur, isn't even considered a first-day pick anymore.

mayoclinic 04-19-2009 08:11 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NE39 (Post 1351503)
This note was in Pro Football Weekly's Whispers column:

Makes sense.

Makes a lot of sense. Much as bolstering the defense is a priority, protecting TB has to be the #1 priority for this team. The OL is solid, but there are some issues with aging, injury, and expiring contracts.

I think the Pats have been fairly low key about the OL in terms of openly scouting players/player visits, etc. But I assume that the interest is there. Andre Smith being brought in for a visit is one such indicator. BB's pro day visit to Connecticut is another.

Here's the way I look at it.

I. The OT's

1. If either of the "big 2" (Jason Smith/Eugene Monroe) slid to within trade-up range (23 + 58 getting us to around 14) they would easily be worth it as a value. But this is extremely unlikely. Monroe is reported to be slipping a bit due to injury concerns, but I can't see him getting by Cincinnati at #6.

2. Michael Oher and Andre Smith are wild cards. They could go top 10, or could slip as low as 20. I favor the former assumption - OT's tend to rise, not slide. There's also an issue as to whether they would fit for the Pats.

3. William Beatty and Ebon Britton are the likely late 1st/early 2nd round guys, with Beatty more of a pure LT and a bit more raw (but greater upside) and Britton more of a RT/swing tackle with a pit more development but lesser growth potential. I still like Beatty at 23 or 34.

4. Jamon Meredith and Philip Loadholt are the solid 2nd round guys. Loadholt is a pure RT or guard and more of a road grader than I would expect for the Pats. Meredith is very versatile but gets pushed around a bit much for an OT.

5. Troy Kropog is a solid 3rd round option with nice feet who could develop into a starting LT. Box's guy Sebastian Vollmer is reportedly rising fast and could be a 3rd rounder as well. Gerald Cadogan from Penn St. has slow feet but nice intangibles. There's lots of others potentially worth a flyer, but with no clear indications that they will succeed.

II. The Interior Lineman

1. This draft is much stronger in OG/C candidates than in pure OG's. I don't think Duke Robinson or Hermann Johnson are good fits for the Pats. Alex Mack, Eric Wood, and Max Unger are all excellent candidates in the 2nd round. They've all been discussed a fair amount on this board. Wood is said to be rising and could go #32 to Pittsburgh.

2. TJ Lang, Andy Levitre and Trevor Canfield are all reasonable 3rd-4th round possibilities. They've all been discussed a fair amount on this board.

3. The sleeper guy I like is Brandon Walker from Oklahoma - my favorite OU lineman by far coming out this year. He's much closer to the Pats mold than either Philip Loadholt or Duke Robinson. He'll probably go 5th round or later, so if we are looking for a possible successor to Stephen Neal around the #170 pick he would be my guy.

Personally, I think that good interior lineman can be had in the mid to late rounds of this draft, so I would rather get a Brandon Walker in the 5th-6th round of Trevor Canfield in the late 3rd/4th than spend a 1st day pick on an OG. Dan Koppen is generally quite adequate at center and is one of the few lineman under long term contract. His troubles with bigger DTs notwithstanding, I don't think it is a priority to upgrade him.

OT is another issue. Although the tackles are adequate, there is definitely long term room to upgrade. The question is how whether the need justifies the usually high cost of getting a potential franchise OT. If Andre Smith or Oher falls and the FO thinks they are the real deal that could be an option. Otherwise it depends on where Beatty and Britton end up going, and how the FO evaluates them.

Feep50 04-19-2009 08:47 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mayoclinic (Post 1351515)
Makes a lot of sense. Much as bolstering the defense is a priority, protecting TB has to be the #1 priority for this team. The OL is solid, but there are some issues with aging, injury, and expiring contracts.

I think the Pats have been fairly low key about the OL in terms of openly scouting players/player visits, etc. But I assume that the interest is there. Andre Smith being brought in for a visit is one such indicator. BB's pro day visit to Connecticut is another.

Here's the way I look at it.

I. The OT's

1. If either of the "big 2" (Jason Smith/Eugene Monroe) slid to within trade-up range (23 + 58 getting us to around 14) they would easily be worth it as a value. But this is extremely unlikely. Monroe is reported to be slipping a bit due to injury concerns, but I can't see him getting by Cincinnati at #6.

2. Michael Oher and Andre Smith are wild cards. They could go top 10, or could slip as low as 20. I favor the former assumption - OT's tend to rise, not slide. There's also an issue as to whether they would fit for the Pats.

3. William Beatty and Ebon Britton are the likely late 1st/early 2nd round guys, with Beatty more of a pure LT and a bit more raw (but greater upside) and Britton more of a RT/swing tackle with a pit more development but lesser growth potential. I still like Beatty at 23 or 34.

4. Jamon Meredith and Philip Loadholt are the solid 2nd round guys. Loadholt is a pure RT or guard and more of a road grader than I would expect for the Pats. Meredith is very versatile but gets pushed around a bit much for an OT.

5. Troy Kropog is a solid 3rd round option with nice feet who could develop into a starting LT. Box's guy Sebastian Vollmer is reportedly rising fast and could be a 3rd rounder as well. Gerald Cadogan from Penn St. has slow feet but nice intangibles. There's lots of others potentially worth a flyer, but with no clear indications that they will succeed.

II. The Interior Lineman

1. This draft is much stronger in OG/C candidates than in pure OG's. I don't think Duke Robinson or Hermann Johnson are good fits for the Pats. Alex Mack, Eric Wood, and Max Unger are all excellent candidates in the 2nd round. They've all been discussed a fair amount on this board. Wood is said to be rising and could go #32 to Pittsburgh.

2. TJ Lang, Andy Levitre and Trevor Canfield are all reasonable 3rd-4th round possibilities. They've all been discussed a fair amount on this board.

3. The sleeper guy I like is Brandon Walker from Oklahoma - my favorite OU lineman by far coming out this year. He's much closer to the Pats mold than either Philip Loadholt or Duke Robinson. He'll probably go 5th round or later, so if we are looking for a possible successor to Stephen Neal around the #170 pick he would be my guy.

Personally, I think that good interior lineman can be had in the mid to late rounds of this draft, so I would rather get a Brandon Walker in the 5th-6th round of Trevor Canfield in the late 3rd/4th than spend a 1st day pick on an OG. Dan Koppen is generally quite adequate at center and is one of the few lineman under long term contract. His troubles with bigger DTs notwithstanding, I don't think it is a priority to upgrade him.

OT is another issue. Although the tackles are adequate, there is definitely long term room to upgrade. The question is how whether the need justifies the usually high cost of getting a potential franchise OT. If Andre Smith or Oher falls and the FO thinks they are the real deal that could be an option. Otherwise it depends on where Beatty and Britton end up going, and how the FO evaluates them.

mayoclinic, you never cease to amaze me......Wow! You should be paid for analysis like this! It's a privilege and a pleasure to read your posts.....

mgteich 04-19-2009 08:53 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
Yes, the patriots will draft 2-4 OL's. That isn't exactly a scoop. We almost always do. The question is when in the draft this is done. Many think it is reasonable to expect starters in Round 4 or 5. Yes, this does indeed happen on the interior line as well as at other positions. Koppen was such a player. Neal was a wrestler and not even drafted, so it seems reasonable to wait. Or does it?

How much better is the early talent than the late talent? THIS YEAR, I would argue that the difference is large. This is a great year to be looking for offensive linemen.

There are eight OT's that will likely be drafted in the first two rounds of this draft. For interior linemen, we have OG/C 's Mack, Wood and Unger who should also be drafted in that range in addition to the pure road grading top OG Duke Robinson.

tatepatsfan 04-19-2009 09:06 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Feep50 (Post 1351535)
mayoclinic, you never cease to amaze me......Wow! You should be paid for analysis like this! It's a privilege and a pleasure to read your posts.....

Seriously. How does Mel Kiper qualify as a draft guru when people this knowledgeable post on our messageboard?

Rob0729 04-19-2009 09:30 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by LloydBraun (Post 1351511)
I agree with this. I think they find the next LT in this draft. If they re-sign Mankins, it will be big bucks. Light may be a cap casualty after 2009.

There is a lot of O-line talent in this draft and the Pats have a lot of picks. They will take a T to at least replace Kaczur and they will take a G to take over for Neal, or even MAnkins, after this year.

Predicting Light's demise is a yearly game on this board. At some point people will be right. Doubtful it will be after this season though. I am willing to bet he finishes out his current contract at least and possibly his career with the Pats. His cap hit is $4.7 million next year and assuming there is actually a cap next year isn't all that high for a starting tackle.

Rob0729 04-19-2009 09:34 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
As for drafting an o-lineman, I can see them drafting one in the first three rounds if they keep at least 5 of their first six picks.

Four or less and I don't know if they will in the first three rounds. I think the Pats will target LB and safety early with at least two to three picks. If they use three, it is crap shoot that they use the fourth on an o-lineman, d-lineman, TE, or even RB or WR.

IcyPatriot 04-19-2009 09:43 PM

Re: Pro Football Weekly: Pats intent on bolstering OL
 
I'm no expert in this area however why is Alex Mack just looked upon as a center? Some smart team will draft him and also use him as a guard ... perhaps Belichick will have a chance at him in the 40's area ... I hope so. It's not so much that he's an elite athlete as it is he is above average in the physical department and outstanding in the intelligence department ... like a Vrabel of the O-Line in terms of mistakes.


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