PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Does anyone think Tom is underrated when compared to Peyton Manning?


Status
Not open for further replies.
"The Greatest Offensives of all time were able to produce when it mattered in the SB, and were not denied a ring."

Like the Colts, the Vikings, the Cowboys, the Dolphins, the Broncos, the Bills, the Packers, etc, etc; examples of great offenses that lost in the Super Bowl.

The Colts won a Super Bowl because of defense, not offense; offense wins games, defense wins championships, but thanks for playing slick.

I think the colts won a super bowl because the bears were horrible. I bet any afc team would have won that superbowl.
 
Selective memory...Montana wasn't quite good in both final games of the 1993 and 1994 season either.


In the last game of his career, Montana was pretty good: 314 yards, 2 tds, 1 int. The interception was very costly, as it was on the goal line. Allen's fumble was even more damaging.

It is a bit unfair to judge his other game, as he was concussed right after halftime. I remember watching him on the sideline, holding his helmet, obviously in shock. He hadn't played great up to that point, but it was interrupted.
 
I agree that Manning is one of the best ever. However, I no longer think he owns the "stat war" against Brady, and he clearly does not win the intangibles war.

Looking at their careers, it is impossible to argue that Brady's conditions have been comparable to Manning's. Manning plays in a dome, and plays against the AFC South, where it is warm throughout the year. For half the season Tom plays in the cold, where passing stats wither. I don't know why a myth exists about why Brady having "the greatest line ever" but that is far from the truth. Both of them are great at avoiding pressure, so I don't think you can refute the following stats based on this argument.

Looking at the amount of sacks each QB has taken since 2001.

2001: Manning 29, Brady, 41
2002: Manning 23, Brady, 31
2003: Manning 18, Brady, 32
2004: Manning 13 Brady, 26
2005: Manning 17, Brady, 26
2006: Manning 14, Brady, 26
2007: Manning 21, Brady, 21

Overall Manning 135, Brady 203

Manning career sack %- 3.4
Brady career sack %- 5.3

That's a lot better protection.

Manning is one of the best protected QBs in NFL history; add to this that he plays in a dome, in warm weather year around, and he has had the following first round talent: Harrison, Wayne, Clark, James, Faulk, Addai for two years, Gonzalez for one. Brady has had Moss for one year and Maroney for two. We are looking at one team who drafts exceptionally skilled players for their quarterback, and another that counts on their quarterback to make these players (see: Reche Caldwell, Jabar Gaffney.)

Again, these conditions are far from comparable. The only season in which Brady has had enviable wideouts was 2007; for Manning it's been his whole career.

Now, if you didn't know anything about these players, and knew one player would have much better protection, much better receivers, and much better playing conditions for passing, what do you think the separation would be in their QB rating? Objectively, you should expect that rating to be around 10 points, or maybe higher.

INCLUDING THE PLAYOFFS, here is following quarterback ratings:

Manning- 93.8
Brady- 92.2

INCLUDING THE PLAYOFFS, here is the following TD:INT ratio:

Brady: 2.28
Manning: 1.82

You're telling me that out of all the factors mentioned above- the superior receivers, the ideal conditions year around, the clearly better pass blocking- that this doesn't attribute for more than 1.6 points of passer rating?

Again, Manning does not have better stats than Brady. He may be a more prolific in his passing attempts, and have more cumulative stats, but the numbers are a wash, and the when you factor in each player's conditions, it's easily Brady. No one can objectively deny this fact-finding above; if you claim that these are misleading in any way then you are being biased.

Kudos, nice job and so true..............
 
I know. It just goes to show how stupid people are. Brady is great, not because he is a great QB, but because he has a great WR to throw to.

To me, Brady's greatest year was not throwing to Moss, but when his 1-2-3 receivers were Troy Brown, David "AFL" Patten (no way he should have made the team!) and Fred "XFL" Coleman. His tight ends were Rutledge and Wiggins. Rutledge could block but couldn't catch and Wiggins could catch but not block the opposing defenses know who to cover and who to ignore.

to me his greatest year was 2006 when he took them one defensive stop short of a championship with Reche Caldwell as his top receiver.
 
I think the colts won a super bowl because the bears were horrible. I bet any afc team would have won that superbowl.

Poor Rex was just Awful...if there's any such thing as a Gimme SB, that had to be it.

Brady's been ice ever since he first stepped out onto the field, and he's won with a lot less than Manning has. The playoff records speak for themselves,plus Brady's attitude and personality makes him a better leader. I remember when the Colts were all going to a funeral a few years ago; they all traveled together except for Peytie, who went alone, and even arrived at the funeral alone.

When BB sat Rodney for a few minutes last year,Brady immediately went and stood next to Rodney for the rest of the drive, saying a few words to him, hand on the shoulder thing- and stood with him until the drive was over.
 
to me his greatest year was 2006 when he took them one defensive stop short of a championship with Reche Caldwell as his top receiver.

I completely agree. Any comparison between TB and PM should begin with the question, "Do you honestly think that Peyton would have taken a team that far with those resources?" Remember also that it was Maroney's rookie year and Dillon was not the Clock-killin' Dillon of old.
 
It'll be interesting down the line to hear what Belichick has to say about this topic.
 
Tom has obviously done much more with less other then last year, yet all the "experts" always say it's very close between them. I don't think Manning is even close, he's certainly a very good player, but he can't compared to Tom. Last November, ESPN did a comparison between them, they compared their "leadership". Some idiot said they are tie, because it's too close. WTF??? Tom never throw his temmate under the bus like Manning did. I t's just one of the thing Brady is underrated when compared to him. I think every thing Brady did is underrated when compared to Manning.
IMO, he is overrated when compared to PM. Manning would never diss another team by laughing off their point prediction. "17 points? Thta's all he thinks we're going to score?" How smug can you be? There's leadership for ya.
 
IMO, he is overrated when compared to PM. Manning would never diss another team by laughing off their point prediction. "17 points? Thta's all he thinks we're going to score?" How smug can you be? There's leadership for ya.

Oh, please. Anyone who watched the interview saw he was joking, the same way he jokes about how unathletic he is all the time. Now we could go on for days about how Manning throws blame around to everyone but himself...publicly.

How can Brady possibly be overrated? He now holds the single-season TD record. He won his first (overdue) MVP. He's engineered the longest winning streak in NFL history, and will probably break that in the 2008 season. He was two minutes away from a 19-game perfect season. Then there's the inconsequential matter of his 3 Superbowl rings...by the way, he would have had two more if the defense could have made a stop at the end of two games. All of this, and he's played his entire career outdoors in the Northeast and (before last season) without an elite receiver.

Lastly, he's in his prime.

Saying he's "overrated" is stupid. If, all of this notwithstanding, he's overrated, what the Hell does that make Peyton Manning?
 
Oh, please. Anyone who watched the interview saw he was joking, the same way he jokes about how unathletic he is all the time. Now we could go on for days about how Manning throws blame around to everyone but himself...publicly.

How can Brady possibly be overrated? He now holds the single-season TD record. He won his first (overdue) MVP. He's engineered the longest winning streak in NFL history, and will probably break that in the 2008 season. He was two minutes away from a 19-game perfect season. Then there's the inconsequential matter of his 3 Superbowl rings...by the way, he would have had two more if the defense could have made a stop at the end of two games. All of this, and he's played his entire career outdoors in the Northeast and (before last season) without an elite receiver.

Lastly, he's in his prime.

Saying he's "overrated" is stupid. If, all of this notwithstanding, he's overrated, what the Hell does that make Peyton Manning?

Oh, pretty please. I didn't say he was overrated when compared to all other QB's, just when compared to PM.
 
IMO, he is overrated when compared to PM. Manning would never diss another team by laughing off their point prediction. "17 points? Thta's all he thinks we're going to score?" How smug can you be? There's leadership for ya.

Seriously, you're in the wrong place. Your comment is so misguided and an obvious ploy to start an arguement.
 
Oh, pretty please. I didn't say he was overrated when compared to all other QB's, just when compared to PM.

Yeah, I know. I read it. Now explain what it means for Manning if Brady's overrated:

Playing indoors and in warm weather since he was born
Hall of Fame receiver for his entire career
1 ring
History of collapsing in the playoffs
Accomplished teammate blamer
 
Last edited:
Yeah, I know. I read it. Now explain what it means for Manning if Brady's overrated:

Playing indoors and in warm weather since he was born
Hall of Fame receiver for his entire career
1 ring
History of collapsing in the playoffs
Accomplished teammate blamer
Hey, I just happen to think that Manning is a better QB than Brady, that's all.
 
Hey, I just happen to think that Manning is a better QB than Brady, that's all.

Of course you do. He's got you a Super Bowl.

Of course, he's lost you a chance at a few too. But that's ok.
 
Hey, I just happen to think that Manning is a better QB than Brady, that's all.

And you have every right to be wrong by believing such nonsense.;)
 
Hey, I just happen to think that Manning is a better QB than Brady, that's all.

That's cool. You should take that to coltsfans.com.
 
Hey, I just happen to think that Manning is a better QB than Brady, that's all.

Hey, you go ahead and think that. It's your right to think that, even though every shred of evidence points to the contrary. The next time that someone gives me a solid, logical argument why Manning's a better QB than Brady will be the first time.

Saying that Brady is overrated is, as I said in the first place, stupid.
 
Peyton is the better QB without a doubt.

Tom has had more complete teams around him, and one hell of a kicker who carried him to atleast 2 of those championships. Peyton has more yards, more yardsper attempt, is way ahead in overall touchdowns, overall yards, 3,000 yard passing seasons (Tom just had his first, maybe second, Manning has more than 5)

He has more control of his offense than Tom, and he is from a football dynasty, even though they are close Peyton is still number one until Brady has more than one Peyton-like season. It took Brady to have the most productive offenses of all time, a offense that ran up the score and attempted 4th downs regularly, and had more than 50 more attempts, and he only beat Peytons TD record by 1, oh and Peyton sat out the last game

Peyton has also played 3 more seasons than Brady. Peyton has played in 10 seasons, Brady has played in 7 (his rookie season he did not play).

So of course Peyton has more yards, TDs, etc now, hes played 3 more years. But if you go back and see how their stats match up through 7 seasons they are pretty close. And now that Brady has Moss and a insane offense he will pass Manning shortly in just about every statistical catagory if you project things out. Look here are their stats through the first 7 seasons of their careers:

Peyton 29,152 yards, 216 TDs, 120 INT
Brady 26,370 yards, 197 TDs, 86 INT

Now if you project Brady's numbers through the next three seasons you will see he will blow by Manning in TDs, but not yards. I project Brady will average 4,500 yards, 45 TDs, and 10 INTs with this offense for the next few years of his career. Mannings numbers are already in the books cause he played 3 more seasons, so if you compare his stats with Brady's projected stats you will see how easily Brady will pass him.

After 08 season:
Peyton 32,899 yards, 244 TDs, 130 INT
Brady 30,870 yards, 242 TDs, 96 INT

After 09 season:
Peyton 37,296 yards, 275 TDs, 139 INT
Brady 35,370 yards, 287 TDs, 106 INT

After 2010 season:
Peyton 41,336 yards, 306 TDs, 153 INT
Brady 39,870 yards, 332 TDs, 116 INT

So you see Brady is on pace to put up great numbers with Moss and this offense for the rest of his career. With our schedule being so easy this year i could even say they may put up better stats than last year.

Manning has to win more superbowls to even be in the same sentence as Brady the way things are playing out, and hes running out of time.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.


MORSE: Final 7 Round Patriots Mock Draft, Matthew Slater News
Bruschi’s Proudest Moment: Former LB Speaks to MusketFire’s Marshall in Recent Interview
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/22: News and Notes
Patriots News 4-21, Kraft-Belichick, A.J. Brown Trade?
MORSE: Patriots Draft Needs and Draft Related Info
Friday Patriots Notebook 4/19: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Eliot Wolf’s Pre-Draft Press Conference 4/18/24
Thursday Patriots Notebook 4/18: News and Notes
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 4/17: News and Notes
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/16: News and Notes
Back
Top