Jerry Rice isnt as impressed with Moss' record

wdkantro2 said:

If there's one former player I will always listen to, it's Jerry Rice. He is absolutely right. 22 touchdowns in 12 games is out of this world. Anyone who thinks 22 TDs in 12 games is less impressive than 22 TDs in 16 games is a moron. What do you expect him to say?
He was just bringing up a valid point, and he still said he would congratulate him. As usual, this is just the members of this board getting worked up over another NON STORY because it might seem disrespectful to the Pats.

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exactly right.

sanvara said:

Yeah, Rice is still untouchable in that respect.

22 TD in 12 games would still be much more impressive than 23 in 16 games.

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Wait a sec though, does this mean OJ Simpson still had greatest RB season ever? Since he got 2000 yards in 14 games???

That's crap, football, baseball, have all lengthened their seasons over the years and you don't see anyone else disputing the legitimacy of total season records...well maybe Roger Maris* in 1961, but other than that, a season is a season, sorry.

Satchboogie3 said:

I have to disagree with you. I believe we are watching the greatest football player in history right now. Tom Terrific. Greatest WR, yes; Greatest player, no.

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Hi, you can call me Homer.

Let's wait until Tom's career is over before we start making these claims.

Disco Volante said:

Yup.

Welcome to the list of former bitter players Jerry Rice.

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Jerry Rice is bitter?

What does Jerry Rice have to be bitter about? He has achieved virtually every accomplishment a player could have, he is the greatest receiver ever, and he still holds the season TD record.

lighten up everyone... as if this thread has 5 pages of posts!
ooooh... someone was mean to one of our boys?

rice was clearly joking, and it was funny... dont be such blind homers.

BadMoFo said:

Hi, you can call me Homer.

Let's wait until Tom's career is over before we start making these claims.

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I'll take Elway, Marino, Steve Young, and Montana over Rice. Rice is great, but an amazing QB is more important and impressive than an amazing WR.

Satchboogie3 said:

I'll take Elway, Marino, Steve Young, and Montana over Rice. Rice is great, but an amazing QB is more important and impressive than an amazing WR.

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most valuable player ever and greatest ever are two things... most QB's are more valuable than almost any WR... rice is so much better than the 2nd best WR that it is ridiculous... You will see lots of people pick any of montana, young, marino, brady, favre, manning, unitas, or even elway as the the best QB ever... the best WR discussion ends at Rice.

Satchboogie3 said:

I'll take Elway, Marino, Steve Young, and Montana over Rice. Rice is great, but an amazing QB is more important and impressive than an amazing WR.

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I'll have to disagree with every one but Montana and there can be a case made for Elway but Rice holds every record for career, season, postseason, and Super Bowl. That's not a coincidence Rice did it in every Big Game he played in. can you say the same about Elway, Marino, and Young?

tombonneau said:

Pretty sure he was kind of trying to make a joke with that line. Probably came off better in person.

FYI, looked up his stats for that year. Not one game without a TD. 3 3 TD game and 7 of 12 multiple TD games:

Code:

Regular Season  	Games  	Receiving  	Rushing  	Fumbles
WK 	Game Date 	Opp 	Result 	G 	GS 	Rec 	Yds 	Avg 	Long 	TD 	Att 	Yds 	Avg 	Lng 	TD 	FUM 	Lost
1 	09/13 	@ PIT 	L   17-30 	1 	-- 	8 	106 	13.3 	32 	1 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	--
2 	09/20 	@ CIN 	W   27-26 	1 	-- 	4 	[b]86[/b] 	21.5 	34T 	2 	1 	4 	4.0 	4 	0 	-- 	--
6 	10/25 	@ NO 	W   24-22 	1 	-- 	6 	[b]89[/b] 	14.8 	39 	1 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	--
7 	11/01 	@ RAM 	W   31-10 	1 	-- 	3 	[b]70[/b] 	23.3 	51T 	1 	1 	2 	2.0 	2 	0 	-- 	--
8 	11/08 	HOU 	W   27-20 	1 	-- 	7 	[b]77 [/b]	11.0 	21 	1 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	--
9 	11/15 	NO 	L   24-26 	1 	-- 	4 	108 	27.0 	50T 	2 	2 	22 	11.0 	17 	0 	-- 	--
10 	11/22 	@ TB 	W   24-10 	1 	-- 	7 	103 	14.7 	42T 	3 	1 	10 	10.0 	10 	0 	-- 	--
11 	11/29 	CLE 	W   38-24 	1 	-- 	7 	126 	18.0 	30T 	3 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	--
12 	12/06 	@ GB 	W   23-12 	1 	-- 	4 	[b]90[/b] 	22.5 	57T 	1 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	-- 	--
13 	12/14 	CHI 	W   41-0 	1 	-- 	8 	[b]75[/b] 	9.4 	17 	3 	1 	12 	12.0 	12 	0 	-- 	--
14 	12/20 	ATL 	W   35-7 	1 	-- 	4 	[b]58[/b] 	14.5 	20T 	2 	1 	5 	5.0 	5T 	1 	-- 	--
15 	12/27 	RAM 	W   48-0 	1 	-- 	3 	[b]90[/b] 	30.0 	50T 	2 	1 	-4 	-4.0 	-4 	0 	-- 	--
TOTAL 	12 	0 	65 	1,078 	16.6 	57 	22 	8 	51 	6.4 	17 	1 	0 	0

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I'm really surprised that in 8 of the 12 games he didn't break 100 Yds receiving, In 13 games this year Moss has broken 100 Yds 8times, for comparisons sake. Anyway, I always figured in that season Rice was a monster in all facets..yardage, TD receptions etc..He still accumulated good yardage, just not at the flukey rate he got his TDs.Either way, obviously still a great accomplishement.

No asterisk needed. It's a regular season record, not a "12 game" record. Jerry Rice will still hold the record for the most TDs in 12 games. Moss will simply be the new regular season title holder if he gets that 23rd TD catch.

Oh and another thing about Rice's 22 TDs in 12 games. I think it may have been here, but someone shed some really good insight into that season and how the strike effected the level of play. Basically when the strike ended there were a lot of NFL players who were out of shape and were playing at subpar levels and had to use the season to get back in shape. However, Rice, with his legendary work ethic kept up in tip top shape during the strike and was basically in top form while others were in training camp. When I read that it made perfect sense. Consider that Rice had many of seasons in his prime to match that record over 16 games and the best he did was 17. That cannot be a coincidence. Obviously still an amazing record though, just interesting background info that helps explain those numbers.

Tommysgirl said:

Eh, I have to go with Jerry on this one. The fact that he did do it in 12 games is unreal. As long as the media points out when Moss breaks it that Jerry did it in a short season it is fine, I think. Not a lot of people are aware of that.

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Me too. It sounds tongue in cheek and he's got a right to bring it up, becauseit is outrageous.

Of course Randy will just need about 6 more to leave no doubt.

I can't blame him for wanting the sheer "amazingness" of that season to be remembered. Not a big deal. But...

Anybody who's calling this "out of character" doesn't remember Jerry Rice so well! He was the ultimate WR, which includes the ego that goes with the position. This was a guy who complained to the media about his contract, claiming he "takes over games all by himself." And complained about having to switch from Joe Montana to that scrub Young because Young didn't get him the ball exactly how he liked it the way Joe did.

Don't get me wrong, I loved Rice and feel lucky to have seen so much of him in his prime. But like so many intensely driven, hard-working competitors, he was fueled by the burning fire of ego. It's a good thing, really, but makes it awfully hard to walk away from the game.

I'm surpised he said it...But I'm not suprised he believed it.
If/when Moss breaks Rice's record; the truth is, it doesn't necessarily surpass what Rice did.
It would absolutely stun me to see someone match 22 in 12 games.
It would not stun me to see someone match Moss's current season accomplishments.

jetophile said:

Tell you what I can't stand about Randy Moss. He'll probably never CARE enough that he she shot himself in the foot over the course of his career. If he had a decent work ethic and wasn't a malcontent, who knows what his career would have been like when all was said and done. You should play hard no matter how your team is doing. Meanwhile, he'll go to the HOF for essentially being a quitter when the sky would have been the limit if he'd applied himself the way he should have all along. He would have blown Jerry Rice out of the water, and I'm certainly not taking anything away from Jerry Rice. Moss is a turd.

EDIT: And that whole crying act of his when he got picked up by NE. Again, a turd, and I'm sticking by it.

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Even if your screen name didn't reveal who you are, we could have guessed it easily.

Rice is just extending his career as a crybaby. I've heard Joe Montana say he couldn't approach Tom Brady, the way Tom is playing now. Joe didn't have to say that. If I had to pick one QB in his prime to start a big game, I might still pick Montana. Rice should go away.

I see this as Jerry whining a little. Yes, he did it in 12 games, but like others pointed out, the players are responsible for that.

There are a lot of single season records -- the league has not always had a 16 game season. I would say it's hard to compare anything from different times.

I think Moss' achievement is so impressive because it's his first year with Brady. While Brady is the best QB of all time, Moss breaking the record with a brand new QB is crazy. I would agree that Rice's record is more impressive because it was a shortened season, but he had already been with Montana a few years and had developed a chemistry.

Either way, as others have pointed out, Moss is getting ready to do what no one has ever doen (Rice included). If people want to remember Rice for who has caught the most TDs in 12 games that's fine. But I think it means more to be the WR who caught the most TD in a season -- ever.:rocker:

BTW -- What WR has the most TDs ever in Week 1 of the season??

Tommysgirl said:

Eh, I have to go with Jerry on this one. The fact that he did do it in 12 games is unreal. As long as the media points out when Moss breaks it that Jerry did it in a short season it is fine, I think. Not a lot of people are aware of that.

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If you read the previous posts, you'd have seen that other members said there is ONLY a most regular season TD receptions record.

As Patsman wrote, If Rice had his way, there'd be records for most TD reception for 5 games, 6 games, 7 games...and so on. Patsman also went on to say if Rice was so good, why couldn't he even break his own "12 game" season record.

If a running back breaks the record for rushing yards and he's injured 4 games that year, there will be no mention of that in the record. Or what if LT comes within 5 yards of breaking the record next year, but he's out injured for 2 games? It comes down to "Too bad LT...too bad"

Just as it will for Jerry Rice if Moss breaks his record..."too bad Jerry...too bad" And might I add "Tough Sh*t Jerry, tough sh*t!"

If Moss breaks the record, it won't be necessary to qualify it with the mention that Rice did it in 12 games...but I'm sure it will be mentioned by the media anyway.

But in the record books (the only place that counts), it will say RANDY MOSS holds the record for most TD receptions in a year.

Rice shouldn't feel the need to say this stuff, but it's sort of made inevitable by the press' (and us fans' I guess) obsession with "records."

It's gotten to the point where we see a "record" as the equivalent of an "accomplishment." They're often the same thing, but not always.

If Moss gets 4 TDs in the next 3 games, he'll have the record, for what it's worth. Whether he'll have accomplished more is for fans to discuss. But they aren't necessarily the same thing.

What Rice didn't isn't diminished by the fact that someone else holds the "record," but I guess good luck having anyone see that.

The idea that after he scored 22 TDs in 12 he couldn't do it in 16 makes the record less valid is absolutely ridiculous. Rice's record is unreal. He's earned the right to point out that he did it in 12 instead of 16. If Brady can't re-break QB TD record does that make it invalid. Maybe Rice should have let someone else make this point, but whatever, I actually agree 100% with Rice and his unbelievable record and I don't think that takes anything away from Moss who, if he breaks or ties it, will still be doing something that no one else has.