What Kraft Should Have Done Last Year, re: Deflategate

neali said:

Sign me up for that. Without Bob Kraft would have been the St.Louis Stallions.

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This morning, coffee shop, Route 1, 7:21 AM:


Flying Elvis, right?

"Yeah."

...You on the job?

"The usual. Training camp starts today, actually."

You hear about Tom Brady? Won't be playing the first four games of the season. Suspension.

"Yeah, word gets around. Do I know you?"

No, I'm just a fan. As a matter of fact, I've been checking out some things going back to your day, from California. When the NFL sent Orthwein here."

"No kiddin'."

No, you know, I was just looking around and stumbled upon some old news reports. Not for nothing, the past is a funny thing, we all have skeletons in the closet, you just never know when they're gonna pop up and bite you in the ass, huh F.E.?...He sneaked you in just in time, didn't he? Right before Parcells got here. 'Cause if Patriots fans knew what really being ridiculed is, nationally, like today, they would have looked closer. They would've looked at you.

..."What're you lookin' at?"

Stealing your life away. You went down twenty-three years ago, pal. You just don't know it yet.

DarrylS said:

I think Kraft was essentially neutered as an owner as soon as the direction towards Brady was decided upon, and that happened very early on..

What can Kraft do?? We are dealing with the hypothetical, and outside of NE fandom no one gave a rats ass about what happened to Brady and cared even less about equipment issues..

Cannot recall any other time that one owner publicly came to the aid of another owner in any situation.. it is almost as though there are 32 different kingdoms with one superking.

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When they were doing the investigation the patriots asked for the measurements and were told FU.
After months when they finally were given them it was under the condition they keep them secret while false and damning numbers were public.

How can anyone think Kraft should not have stepped in while that was happening?

Read the communication between pats lawyers and NFL lawyers in the wells context.
Krafts own attorneys were treated like crap by the NFL lawyers that Kraft employs as well.
Had he gotten involved at that point perhaps the wells hatchet job could have been affected.
Look think what you want about Kraft but there is no way you can argue he did a good job of protecting his franchise against a league office that turned out to be on a witch hunt.

Actual Pats Fan said:

This morning, coffee shop, Route 1, 7:21 AM:


Flying Elvis, right?

"Yeah."

...You on the job?

"The usual. Training camp starts today, actually."

You hear about Tom Brady? Won't be playing the first four games of the season. Suspension.

"Yeah, word gets around. Do I know you?"

No, I'm just a fan. As a matter of fact, I've been checking out some things going back to your day, from California. When the NFL sent Orthwein here."

"No kiddin'."

No, you know, I was just looking around and stumbled upon some old news reports. Not for nothing, the past is a funny thing, we all have skeletons in the closet, you just never know when they're gonna pop up and bite you in the ass, huh F.E.?...He sneaked you in just in time, didn't he? Right before Parcells got here. 'Cause if Patriots fans knew what really being ridiculed is, nationally, like today, they would have looked closer. They would've looked at you.

..."What're you lookin' at?"

Stealing your life away. You went down twenty-three years ago, pal. You just don't know it yet.

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Wtf???

Actual Pats Fan said:

This morning, coffee shop, Route 1, 7:21 AM:


Flying Elvis, right?

"Yeah."

...You on the job?

"The usual. Training camp starts today, actually."

You hear about Tom Brady? Won't be playing the first four games of the season. Suspension.

"Yeah, word gets around. Do I know you?"

No, I'm just a fan. As a matter of fact, I've been checking out some things going back to your day, from California. When the NFL sent Orthwein here."

"No kiddin'."

No, you know, I was just looking around and stumbled upon some old news reports. Not for nothing, the past is a funny thing, we all have skeletons in the closet, you just never know when they're gonna pop up and bite you in the ass, huh F.E.?...He sneaked you in just in time, didn't he? Right before Parcells got here. 'Cause if Patriots fans knew what really being ridiculed is, nationally, like today, they would have looked closer. They would've looked at you.

..."What're you lookin' at?"

Stealing your life away. You went down twenty-three years ago, pal. You just don't know it yet.

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KontradictioN said:

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Every Actual P F post is somehow related to the demise of Pat the Patriot.

Raymond said:

Every Actual P F post is somehow related to the demise of Pat the Patriot.

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That quote was derived from the movie "Frequency". I just figured that out. I was confused when I first read it. And I still have no clue what the hell he was talking about. But at least I know where he got the quote from now.

AndyJohnson said:

Wtf???

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Gertrude Stein's been dug up...

AndyJohnson said:

Wtf???

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...my thoughts exactly, in 1993 when I saw, or rather didn't see, our team out there on the field

Raymond said:

Every Actual P F post is somehow related to the demise of Pat the Patriot.

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I thought my strategy was pretty obvious: Drive everyone nuts until Robert and Jonathan are literally forced to restore Pat Patriot and our real uniforms on the field...to spare everybody.

Jackson 2 said:

Gertrude Stein's been dug up...

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Hey, maybe Orthwein was right after all. There's nothing wrong with embracing something new and different...Starting fresh. Lots of times, that's called progress. And obviously, the Krafts are married to the flying elvis, and likely consider it to be emblematic of their ownership, and success. So, aside from taste and aesthetics and tradition and class and respect, why would anyone, specifically Pats fans, want to return to Pat Patriot?

In fact, I am reminded of another entity of humble origins, which with the help of some allies struggled even to exist, fighting a war against a malevolent empire, and despite the work and sacrifices by many for justice and freedom, still has a crappy record with respect to treatment of non-whites, and therefore clearly can use a change for change's sake. Never mind the heroic deeds of past generations of veterans; our clearly obsolete, dated and antiquated emblem symbolizes only the humiliation of a broken and ridiculed franchise:



SO - A British P.R. company is ready to commission a graphic design firm in Hong Kong to hastily come up with a new, fresh replacement, just in time for the November elections. It'll be eagerly embraced by Millennials and represent winning.

The last straw:




So the late James Busch Orthwein's beloved Bud keeps its label and now is America's beer. The only image I would NOT find offensive would be the label with "Ferguson" along with video of another unarmed black guy getting shot by a cop.

The fact is that James Orthwein and his friends and associates had total disdain for the Patriots franchise, its history and the people and fans of New England; and was singly interested in getting a team to St. Louis. Orthwein and his cronies are PRECISELY the same people who state that the Patriots are cheaters who deserve asterisks, forfeitures, lifetime bans etc. Thus, anyone in New England who persists in embracing the flying elvis cannot take exception to, or complain about, anything Roger Goodell or the NYJFL has done. Ever.

You can't overstate how other teams that won were such losers...the Dolphins, Cowboys, Steelers, Redskins and worst of all, the Giants (sorry, Bill)...ugh...Meanwhile in New England we had a team and an identity out there on the field, never mind the owner, and Orthwein's destruction of our logo and uniforms was based solely on ignorant, stupid and biased views of morons and is one huge "F*** You" to the people and football fans of New England. Those who accept the flying elvis say, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" Go ahead. Kraft and the league will continue to make money, either way.

But with Tom Brady and Bill Belichick leading us, men of courage and character and leadership on and off the field, the Patriots, far and away, should be America's Team. With Pat Patriot on our helmets, front and center.

You swallow the flying elvis, you swallow the league and all its corruption.

Actual Pats Fan said:

The last straw:

So the late James Busch Orthwein's beloved Bud keeps its label and now is America's beer. The only image I would NOT find offensive would be the label with "Ferguson" along with video of another unarmed black guy getting shot by a cop.

The fact is that James Orthwein and his friends and associates had total disdain for the Patriots franchise, its history and the people and fans of New England; and was singly interested in getting a team to St. Louis. Orthwein and his cronies are PRECISELY the same people who state that the Patriots are cheaters who deserve asterisks, forfeitures, lifetime bans etc. Thus, anyone in New England who persists in embracing the flying elvis cannot take exception to, or complain about, anything Roger Goodell or the NYJFL has done. Ever.

You can't overstate how other teams that won were such losers...the Dolphins, Cowboys, Steelers, Redskins and worst of all, the Giants (sorry, Bill)...ugh...Meanwhile in New England we had a team and an identity out there on the field, never mind the owner, and Orthwein's destruction of our logo and uniforms was based solely on ignorant, stupid and biased views of morons and is one huge "F*** You" to the people and football fans of New England. Those who accept the flying elvis say, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" Go ahead. Kraft and the league will continue to make money, either way.

But with Tom Brady and Bill Belichick leading us, men of courage and character and leadership on and off the field, the Patriots, far and away, should be America's Team. With Pat Patriot on our helmets, front and center.

You swallow the flying elvis, you swallow the league and all its corruption.

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Oooohhhh, a pro-Pat Patriot post! There's a first! Oops, I mean a 56th, or 57th, or...why don't you just get it tatooed on your forehead, your ass, your back and your left nut. Then have Bissell, if he's still alive, autograph them all for you. Then, perhaps, Blessed Jesus, you'll quit this BS...I'm officially now begging...

Jackson 2 said:

Oooohhhh, a pro-Pat Patriot post! There's a first! Oops, I mean a 56th, or 57th, or...why don't you just get it tatooed on your forehead, your ass, your back and your left nut. Then have Bissell, if he's still alive, autograph them all for you. Then, perhaps, Blessed Jesus, you'll quit this BS...I'm officially now begging...

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You need to go to Robert and Jonathan. Apparently, they're the only ones who can fix this.

Actual Pats Fan said:

The last straw:

So the late James Busch Orthwein's beloved Bud keeps its label and now is America's beer. The only image I would NOT find offensive would be the label with "Ferguson" along with video of another unarmed black guy getting shot by a cop.

The fact is that James Orthwein and his friends and associates had total disdain for the Patriots franchise, its history and the people and fans of New England; and was singly interested in getting a team to St. Louis. Orthwein and his cronies are PRECISELY the same people who state that the Patriots are cheaters who deserve asterisks, forfeitures, lifetime bans etc. Thus, anyone in New England who persists in embracing the flying elvis cannot take exception to, or complain about, anything Roger Goodell or the NYJFL has done. Ever.

You can't overstate how other teams that won were such losers...the Dolphins, Cowboys, Steelers, Redskins and worst of all, the Giants (sorry, Bill)...ugh...Meanwhile in New England we had a team and an identity out there on the field, never mind the owner, and Orthwein's destruction of our logo and uniforms was based solely on ignorant, stupid and biased views of morons and is one huge "F*** You" to the people and football fans of New England. Those who accept the flying elvis say, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" Go ahead. Kraft and the league will continue to make money, either way.

But with Tom Brady and Bill Belichick leading us, men of courage and character and leadership on and off the field, the Patriots, far and away, should be America's Team. With Pat Patriot on our helmets, front and center.

You swallow the flying elvis, you swallow the league and all its corruption.

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This is one of the most bizarre posts I've ever seen in this forum. I can't decide whether to give you an award for dubious achievement or alert those helpful gentlemen in the white coats.

Actual Pats Fan said:

The last straw:

So the late James Busch Orthwein's beloved Bud keeps its label and now is America's beer. The only image I would NOT find offensive would be the label with "Ferguson" along with video of another unarmed black guy getting shot by a cop.

The fact is that James Orthwein and his friends and associates had total disdain for the Patriots franchise, its history and the people and fans of New England; and was singly interested in getting a team to St. Louis. Orthwein and his cronies are PRECISELY the same people who state that the Patriots are cheaters who deserve asterisks, forfeitures, lifetime bans etc. Thus, anyone in New England who persists in embracing the flying elvis cannot take exception to, or complain about, anything Roger Goodell or the NYJFL has done. Ever.

You can't overstate how other teams that won were such losers...the Dolphins, Cowboys, Steelers, Redskins and worst of all, the Giants (sorry, Bill)...ugh...Meanwhile in New England we had a team and an identity out there on the field, never mind the owner, and Orthwein's destruction of our logo and uniforms was based solely on ignorant, stupid and biased views of morons and is one huge "F*** You" to the people and football fans of New England. Those who accept the flying elvis say, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" Go ahead. Kraft and the league will continue to make money, either way.

But with Tom Brady and Bill Belichick leading us, men of courage and character and leadership on and off the field, the Patriots, far and away, should be America's Team. With Pat Patriot on our helmets, front and center.

You swallow the flying elvis, you swallow the league and all its corruption.

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Orthwein should have renamed the team, and started from scratch. Like the Ravens.

You know, even though I've been a Patriots fan longer than most everybody else on this site, I'm grateful to have learned so much here, such as: Instead of wasting our time year after year watching football and rooting for the Patriots, us real fans should have devoted all our time and energy toward stewing over the Sullivans...

As has been pointed out in this forum, most other NFL franchises had better winning percentages and/or more playoff wins than the Patriots from the 60's to the early 90's, not to mention several dynastic teams that won multiple Super Bowls. You could not pay me money to root for any of them. The degree to which I despise the Cowboys, Steelers, Giants, Broncos and Redskins, for example, has not increased one iota in this century. Kraft's complicity has not only denied us the chance to see our Patriots win on the field when they finally, mercifully got Bledsoe out of there, it created a cult of fair-weather, bandwagon, flying elvis-worshipping, Canadiens-style dumbfans blubbering about rings. Yep. Just like Pittsburgh, Dallas, San Francisco, etc. Over the last ten years, up till today, the Patriots have been nationally ridiculed beyond measurement and light years worse than they ever were up till 1993. Fans who take exception to the the NFL's corruption and malevolence and propaganda machine should look in the mirror. Who exactly is the flying elvis? Orthwein, Tagliabue, Roger Goodell? Perhaps even Kraft? It is definitely NOT the people, fans, players or coaches of New England. The players are heroically going out there doing their jobs and will never complain no matter how stupid the uniforms are.

The Celtics had a string of clown owners and poor records after Walter Brown passed away, but they did not destroy their logo and uniforms; thus Larry Bird and Paul Pierce got to play here looking like Celtics instead of stiffs.

I did not write the following:

While the Patriots won four Super Bowls with the Flying Elvis logo, Pat Patriot remains very popular even after being replaced 23 years ago.

It wasn’t until 1993, at the behest of James Busch Orthwein, a man from St. Louis assigned by the league to manage the Patriots, who never was a New Englander or Patriots fan, that the NFL commissioned a Californian designer to hastily create a new logo, giving birth was to the Flying Elvis, just in time for the 1993 season.

Four Super Bowls have done little to diminish Pat Patriot’s popularity. Most Patriots fans prefer the minuteman in a three-point stance over the insipid, bland, vapid, inscrutable, nondescript, unattractive, inappropriate, stoic, lifeless profile that has represented them during New England’s dynasty. The same goes for the red jerseys juxtaposed against the current navy blue jersey.

fnordcircle said:

************, the constant Kraft whining is making this board next to unreadable.

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I concur wholeheartedly. These *****ers ought to adopt a team and owner more suitable to their intellects and beliefs. I've had my fill of Billy Sullivan, Victor Kiam and even Orthwein. No thank you.

Thankfully there is exactly such a team in the vacinity. Please go and become fervant paper-bag-over-the-head, Fans of the J_E_T_S and their precious, ignorant, dwarf of an owner, born with a silver spoon up his ass, Woody Johnson.

AzPatsFan said:

I concur wholeheartedly. These *****ers ought to adopt a team and owner more suitable to their intellects and beliefs. I've had my fill of Billy Sullivan, Victor Kiam and even Orthwein. No thank you.

Thankfully there is exactly such a team in the vacinity. Please go and become fervant paper-bag-over-the-head, Fans of the J_E_T_S and their precious, ignorant, dwarf of an owner, born with a silver spoon up his ass, Woody Johnson.

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I'm not a Kraft-basher, and we agree on Orthwein! So, may we finally flush his flying elvis down the toilet?

I like both logos. Unlike other newcomers,and non New Englanders, the so-called " Flying Elvis" profile reminds me not of Elvis, but of another hallowed New Englander and our tradition. Ever since before the Mayflower set sail that profile proudly stood as "The Man in the Mountain". Alas no more, due to a rock slide. But I thank the Pats for keeping that stoic and determined Minuteman profile fresh in our memory, even now.