What happened to Tunsil proves that Brady was 100% right in destroying his phone

I created this diagram to illustrate the dynamics of the information on TB12's Phone


There are only 3 missing text messages from the pertinent phone. All e-mail messages, which are stored elsewhere, have been screened for the key words supplied by Wells investigators. The only possible recipients are either a party with no involvement in football, or (as the NFL prefers to believe) a 3rd party either directly or indirectly able to intercept the game balls between the referee's inspection and their measurement at half time. There are only two locations for that, the closet toilet or on the field itself.

The NFL have all the incoming and outgoing messages from the equipment team - so they weren't contacted through this avenue.

The referees would have reported any message that involved changing the pressure of the balls.

So the options for the agent of deflation is either:
a) A lying referee
b) The invisible man
c) A superspy

But if you are the NFL let's not bother with checking whether manual deflation ever occurred in the first place.

Buchanty said:

I created this diagram to illustrate the dynamics of the information on TB12's Phone

There are only 3 missing text messages from the pertinent phone. All e-mail messages, which are stored elsewhere, have been screened for the key words supplied by Wells investigators. The only possible recipients are either a party with no involvement in football, or (as the NFL prefers to believe) a 3rd party either directly or indirectly able to intercept the game balls between the referee's inspection and their measurement at half time. There are only two locations for that, the closet toilet or on the field itself.

The NFL have all the incoming and outgoing messages from the equipment team - so they weren't contacted through this avenue.

The referees would have reported any message that involved changing the pressure of the balls.

So the options for the agent of deflation is either:
a) A lying referee
b) The invisible man
c) A superspy

But if you are the NFL let's not bother with checking whether manual deflation ever occurred in the first place.

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Thanks, mostly right. Two problems though. First, they know that the three missing text messages were between Brady and Jaz on February 7, 2015. This came out in the Reisner cross-exam of Brady at the appeal hearing. Second, texts to people other than the equipment guys could have been relevant (although perhaps less likely than texts between Brady and the Dorito Dinks), but were not provided.

letekro said:

Either stupid or there was something incriminating on the phone. We dont know. It is odd that he freely turned over thousands of texts and emails from other phones but none from that one. Probably an innocent explanation, but like you said, it just looks bad.

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He only handed over e-mails and texts after he was suspended, so your argument does not make sense.

You keep saying that he handed over thousands of texts from other "phones". This is incorrect and I suspect you are being disingenuous. He explained that it is his normal practice to hand his old phone to his assistant to dispose of whenever he got a new phone. However, he did still have his previous phone available. It was only one phone, not multiple phones. You and the NFL find this to be suspicious, but the only reason you and the NFL know this is because Brady told them. He could have lied and given a better answer, but he was being honest and was trying provide as much information as he could. He has documented evidence that he contacted the phone carrier to provide his text messages, but they responded saying they were unable to. The NFL act like this was a ruse and you seem to be in agreement. Personaly, I'm surprised the phone carrier was unable to provide the texts.

It's unfortunate that so many people are caught up in this phone nonsense. It is nothing more than misdirection by the NFL. The NFL has never once stated how much air they believe was released from the balls. That's because they would sound foolish. It is, of course, what the whole case is about, but no one questions that as they are too busy discussing Brady's phone and the "deflator" comment. You have been played. The phone was not a big deal at the time, Wells didn't even put up a fight for it. He was told no and he moved on. They only made a big deal of it months later because all they had were out of context, innocent jokes between friends and obviously manipulated science that was easy to debunk.

letekro said:

Thanks, mostly right. Two problems though. First, they know that the three missing text messages were between Brady and Jaz on February 7, 2015. This came out in the Reisner cross-exam of Brady at the appeal hearing. Second, texts to people other than the equipment guys could have been relevant (although perhaps less likely than texts between Brady and the Dorito Dinks), but were not provided.

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However the diagram is accurate for the time of the AFC Championship, and any possible conspiracy to deflate the balls within the season. February 7th is 5 days after the Superbowl and therefore has no bearing on access to the game balls.

Again one has to ask what would the content likely be. There is no proof of intent to deflate before then. So any conjecture on any attempt to remove traces of such an act, lack any evidence of the act in the first place.
I can come up with a number of possible contents, ranging from profanity through bad taste to gossip, but nothing that suggest a conspiracy, which requires careful communication and management (certainly more than 3 text messages would convey).

Buchanty said:

However the diagram is accurate for the time of the AFC Championship, and any possible conspiracy to deflate the balls within the season. February 7th is 5 days after the Superbowl and therefore has no bearing on access to the game balls.

Again one has to ask what would the content likely be. There is no proof of intent to deflate before then. So any conjecture on any attempt to remove traces of such an act, lack any evidence of the act in the first place.
I can come up with a number of possible contents, ranging from profanity through bad taste to gossip, but nothing that suggest a conspiracy, which requires careful communication and management (certainly more than 3 text messages would convey).

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I think it is unlikely that Brady would have said something incriminating in a text. If at all, one would presume it would have been to the equipment guys prior to the AFCCG. That said, texts from the phone he used from Sept 2014 to March 2015 responsive to the search term request would have been potentially relevant, even if to recipients other than the equipment guys.

letekro said:

Thanks, mostly right. Two problems though. First, they know that the three missing text messages were between Brady and Jaz on February 7, 2015. This came out in the Reisner cross-exam of Brady at the appeal hearing. Second, texts to people other than the equipment guys could have been relevant (although perhaps less likely than texts between Brady and the Dorito Dinks), but were not provided.

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The second problem is the other Brady texts that did not go to the Equipment Team (ET), especially to other individuals within the Patriots organization, also known as the 3rd party route. While this is conjectural, let me play with this a while. I'll start with the knowledge that any written communication (email or text message) from the 3rd party would have been captured on the ET phones in custody of Wells' investigating team. So this was either oral communication or something transient like a post-it note. No testimony has been given that indicates that this happened, so once again we are staring at an absence of evidence.

Conjecture is fine for testing hypotheses, and has been used from time to time to create doubt, however it has never been used as a substitute for hard evidence, yet that is what the NFL is using to suggest complete and overwhelming proof of Brady's guilt, not just of obstruction but also leading the conspiracy to deflate the game balls.

Buchanty said:

The second problem is the other Brady texts that did not go to the Equipment Team (ET), especially to other individuals within the Patriots organization, also known as the 3rd party route. While this is conjectural, let me play with this a while. I'll start with the knowledge that any written communication (email or text message) from the 3rd party would have been captured on the ET phones in custody of Wells' investigating team. So this was either oral communication or something transient like a post-it note. No testimony has been given that indicates that this happened, so once again we are staring at an absence of evidence.

Conjecture is fine for testing hypotheses, and has been used from time to time to create doubt, however it has never been used as a substitute for hard evidence, yet that is what the NFL is using to suggest complete and overwhelming proof of Brady's guilt, not just of obstruction but also leading the conspiracy to deflate the game balls.

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There was no basis to punish Brady. Let me be very clear about that. Just 2 or 3 out of context text messages over the course of many months is not compelling to me. As I have said, and as even Wells admitted, the "science", such that it is, is even less compelling. I just think he would be in a better spot in court if not for the unfortunate issue of the missing phone.

letekro said:

Thanks, mostly right. Two problems though. First, they know that the three missing text messages were between Brady and Jaz on February 7, 2015. This came out in the Reisner cross-exam of Brady at the appeal hearing. Second, texts to people other than the equipment guys could have been relevant (although perhaps less likely than texts between Brady and the Dorito Dinks), but were not provided.

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JAZ: Congrats again buddy, incredible season
BRADY: Thanks, u too, SB baby!
JAZ: Hell yea, see you soon

There, happy?

What I find curious/suspect/hypocritical is that the NFL has castigated Brady for not turning over his cell phone and/or fully cooperating with the investigation. Meanwhile, can you tell me who Wells/the NFL was requesting texts and e-mails from, and what the pertinent search terms were? No? Oh that's right, the NFL refused to provide Brady/Kessler/NFLPA with the thousands of pages of transcripts and research material that Wells, Pash and co used in their 'independent' investigation.

Pot meet kettle. Not like it matters, only one side has the power, and that side happens to be drunk on said power and corrupt as all hell.

hambone1818 said:

JAZ: Congrats again buddy, incredible season
BRADY: Thanks, u too, SB baby!
JAZ: Hell yea, see you soon

There, happy?

What I find curious/suspect/hypocritical is that the NFL has castigated Brady for not turning over his cell phone and/or fully cooperating with the investigation. Meanwhile, can you tell me who Wells/the NFL was requesting texts and e-mails from, and what the pertinent search terms were? No? Oh that's right, the NFL refused to provide Brady/Kessler/NFLPA with the thousands of pages of transcripts and research material that Wells, Pash and co used in their 'independent' investigation.

Pot meet kettle. Not like it matters, only one side has the power, and that side happens to be drunk on said power and corrupt as all hell.

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Probably, which is why it is so frustrating that phone was not made available.

Here is a list of the search terms for the emails, I'm not sure whether a different set was used for the texts:

k-ball, kball, gage, air-pump, airpump, needle, pin, PSI, pounds per square inch, 12.5, bladder, McNally, Bird, 1 pound, 1 lb, one pound, one lb, 2 pound, 2 lb, two pound, two lb, gaug* [the * means that all variations of “gaug” were included, such as gauge, gauging, gauged etc.], pump*, inflat*, deflat*, (game OR kick*) ball ~2 [this means Brady’s emails were searched to see whether the words “game” or “kick*” were found within two words of “ball”], (prep* OR rub*) AND (ball OR football) ~10, (investigat* OR meet* OR discuss* OR question) AND (championship OR Jan* 18 OR 1/18), investigat* AND (ball OR football OR Ind* OR Colts) ~10, (equilib* OR atmosphere* OR climat* OR environment* OR test* OR experiment) AND (ball OR football) ~10

letekro said:

There was no basis to punish Brady. Let me be very clear about that. Just 2 or 3 out of context text messages over the course of many months is not compelling to me. As I have said, and as even Wells admitted, the "science", such that it is, is even less compelling. I just think he would be in a better spot in court if not for the unfortunate issue of the missing phone.

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I agree - it was a most unfortunate mistake, but not one that should have culminated in such a draconian punishment. Many thanks for straightening a few of the loose ends, which has allowed me to update my diagram:

Which still leaves the unknown 3rd party agency who verbally communicated with either the Equipment Team (no testimonial proof of this from Patriots Organization), the referees (similarly) or our old friends the Invisible Man and/or James Bond.

letekro said:

Either stupid or there was something incriminating on the phone. We dont know. It is odd that he freely turned over thousands of texts and emails from other phones but none from that one. Probably an innocent explanation, but like you said, it just looks bad.

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Wells and Co found nothing on Jastremski and McNally's texts directly connecting Brady to the deflating of footballs. Any chats Brady had with them did not implicate him and Brady provided copies of his end of those texts to show that.
My own theory on why Brady destroyed his phone is that he panicked and wanted to protect his texts with OTHER NFL QB'S/PLAYERS/FORMER PLAYERS (Peyton Manning, Matt Cassel, Matt Light etc) and chats he was having with them. Think Mr. Goodell would love the opinions expressed about him and his thuggery from those guys??
I think Tom Brady does a lot of communicating with NFL friends via text and got spooked about what was on his phone (highly inflammatory opinions) and dumped it.

RhodyPatriot said:

Wells and Co found nothing on Jastremski and McNally's texts directly connecting Brady to the deflating of footballs. Any chats Brady had with them did not implicate him and Brady provided copies of his end of those texts to show that.
My own theory on why Brady destroyed his phone is that he panicked and wanted to protect his texts with OTHER NFL QB'S/PLAYERS/FORMER PLAYERS (Peyton Manning, Matt Cassel, Matt Light etc) and chats he was having with them. Think Mr. Goodell would love the opinions expressed about him and his thuggery from those guys??
I think Tom Brady does a lot of communicating with NFL friends via text and got spooked about what was on his phone (highly inflammatory opinions) and dumped it.

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Very possible. But, he provided this information from the other phones. Not clear why this one was different. We will never know.

letekro said:

The NFL was out to get him. For sure. We know that from the Mortensen leak and other evidence.

But, even though the courts say they are only looking at process, their perception of the facts weighs on their decision. Needless to say, such texts wouldve been extremely powerful for Brady in court and the court of public opinion.

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I don't know about this last point, because it is public record that came out in the texts and in Brady's public statements and testimony that he prefers the footballs at 12.5. Never, ever, ever has there ever been any indication that he wanted footballs lower than that.

Yet public opinion was pretty powerfully against him.

While the NFL never said actually said it (I don't think), reading between the lines in the Wells report and Goodell's subsequent spewage, it is clear to me that the NFL accused and punished Brady for an allegedly season(s)-long deflation scheme and not just on the events of the AFCCG. Which is probably why Wells and Goodell were so cavalier about the fact that balls did what physics said they would -- even if nothing happened that night they believe it was going on all season long.

QuantumMechanic said:

While the NFL never said actually said it (I don't think), reading between the lines in the Wells report and Goodell's subsequent spewage, it is clear to me that the NFL accused and punished Brady for an allegedly season(s)-long deflation scheme and not just on the events of the AFCCG. Which is probably why Wells and Goodell were so cavalier about the fact that balls did what physics said they would -- even if nothing happened that night they believe it was going on all season long.

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Possible. But, don't forget that the Mortensen leak was immediate. They had made up their minds before Wells even started investigating.

letekro said:

Possible. But, don't forget that the Mortensen leak was immediate. They had made up their minds before Wells even started investigating.

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Yep. Gardi sent the PSI readings to the team on the 18th and announced it's intent to investigate on the 19th.

QuantumMechanic said:

1)
2) Because all employers are entitled to them unless the employee has a contract saying the employer is not entitled or there's a law saying the employer isn't entitled.

If at work something hinky went down (say info about some upcoming product got leaked, especially if leaked to a competitor) your employer certainly could demand that everyone turn over all their texts under pain of punishment or termination (again, assuming no contractual or statutory provision to the contrary, and I'm willing to bet any such statutory provision is rare, especially in a situation like that).

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You have that backwards. You would need to have written contractual agreement with your employer to give up personal freedoms. You might have read a supreme court case ruling a number of years ago, but it ONLY pertains to company phones/computers/equipment. An employer has NO RIGHT what so ever to demand any personal property, whether that be a physical phone or the data on that phone. Now certain companies may have sensitive work/data and require employees to waive certain rights as part of security clearances, etc, but that doesn't exist in the NFL. The NFL has the right to team/NFL phones, but not private phones.

The whole "But the phone!" is just the most ridiculous thing ever. Everyone I know who gets a new computer/phone either destroys the previous one or turns it in to their phone company, etc. I have friends that will even take out their hard-drives and physically destroy them. These are normal people.

The fact is that there still is no evidence that anything happened and Brady has nothing to hide. He gave them more than enough data and information. They have no right to the phone, period. It doesn't matter if he destroyed it, it's common practice, and the NFL wasn't going to get their hands on it even if it still existed. It's a red herring.

What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty? Right out of the gate Brady was deemed guilty and had to prove his innocence, which, when asked to materialize things that don't exist, is impossible. You are supposed to start with innocence and prove guilt, not the other way around. Anyone who still doesn't get it, just imagine everyone accused you of cheating on a final and you were going to be expelled if you can't prove your innocence. You'd be demanding the proof. Their response "we don't need proof, but you need to prove us wrong." How the hell could you prove that? I bet you would change your tune with Brady real quick...

QuantumMechanic said:

While the NFL never said actually said it (I don't think), reading between the lines in the Wells report and Goodell's subsequent spewage, it is clear to me that the NFL accused and punished Brady for an allegedly season(s)-long deflation scheme and not just on the events of the AFCCG. Which is probably why Wells and Goodell were so cavalier about the fact that balls did what physics said they would -- even if nothing happened that night they believe it was going on all season long.

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That would be consistent with the subsequent unsubstantiated claims from ESPN after the appeal that many in the NFL (not just the offices in Park Avenue) were aware of the Patriots cheating over the years since Spygate. The phone records are from Oct 6th through to March 5th, which includes the infamous Jets game on October 25th and the 16 PSI balls. The overinflated balls would suggest a scheme to deflate them was not in operation until after that date, and so the phone should have had any electronic evidence of such a conspiracy if one ever existed.

All this really proves is how difficult it is to prove that you didn't do something. If only this could be covered by the Law of the Shop as it will always be an exercise in futility to require such proof, no matter who the accused offender.

Satchboogie3 said:

What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty? Right out of the gate Brady was deemed guilty and had to prove his innocence, which, when asked to materialize things that don't exist, is impossible. You are supposed to start with innocence and prove guilt, not the other way around.

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That's only true in a criminal case before a court.

In civil cases there is no presumption of innocence. And you can be forced to testify against yourself. And refusing to answer questions can be used against you. And so on.

And this (before going into court) wasn't even a civil case. It was an internal corporate disciplinary action (albeit one subject to the CBA). And the employer is free to presume guilt and require the employee to prove he isn't guilty (unless a contract says otherwise).

Satchboogie3 said:

You have that backwards. You would need to have written contractual agreement with your employer to give up personal freedoms.

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I doubt that. Even without any contract your employer can fire you for any reason (or no reason), so long as it's not because of your race, religion, gender, national origin, etc. Your employer can tell you how to dress when you're on the job. Your employer can drastically curtail your speech when you're on the job. Your employer can even curtail your speech off the clock (try badmouthing your employer outside of work and see how well that goes if it is found out). Your employer can demand you hand over your personal Facebook, etc. credentials (though some states have/are considering passing laws against that). And so on and so on.