The 16 PSI thing still bugs me

Dunno about any conspiracy theories but part of me feels like that was no accident. If Brady has a rep around the league for preferring footballs on the softer end of the range... then what's stopping someone from rigging a game against him? Just like the false Mort report was no accident... it feels like someone bet a lot of money on the Seahawks (and Jets?). That is something worthy of a congressional investigation if that is anywhere close to the truth.

And if Tom really did get the dorito dinks to always set the footballs to 12.5 PSI.... what's stopping the NFL from screwing with Pats games by deliberately making them 16 PSI again... knowing Tom probably won't be getting them "fixed" anymore?

I think the Pats need to be wary of that... and Bill order his team not to take the field as necessary until the refs fix the air pressure in the footballs. We all know how low this league will stoop and I put nothing past them.

They didn't do it last season. If they did we would have heard about it. What makes you think they'd pick this year as the year to bone the Pats on this again?

And it would be extremely suspicious that the Pats would get caught up in another scandal like this. Even to people who are Deflategate truthers. If the Pats get railroaded again, it will be because of some other perceived infraction of the rules.

sb1 said:

Dunno about any conspiracy theories but part of me feels like that was no accident. If Brady has a rep around the league for preferring footballs on the softer end of the range... then what's stopping someone from rigging a game against him? Just like the false Mort report was no accident... it feels like someone bet a lot of money on the Seahawks (and Jets?). That is something worthy of a congressional investigation if that is anywhere close to the truth.

And if Tom really did get the dorito dinks to always set the footballs to 12.5 PSI.... what's stopping the NFL from screwing with Pats games by deliberately making them 16 PSI again... knowing Tom probably won't be getting them "fixed" anymore?

I think the Pats need to be wary of that... and Bill order his team not to take the field as necessary until the refs fix the air pressure in the footballs. We all know how low this league will stoop and I put nothing past them.

Click to expand...

The 16lbs psi from the Jets game just shows how very little the refs ever paid to ball inflation or process. I would not be surprised if most refs just gave the balls a squeeze and added/subtracted whatever they wanted.

With all fairness in regards to that Jets game; the ball being inflated to 16 PSI really couldn't have had much to do with Brady having any sort of a reputation for preferring the ball at 12.5 PSI. Why? Because when you read the texts; they specifically point out that the balls were supposed to be at the standard 13 PSI. Why not 12.5? Because, prior to that Jets game, Brady really didn't put much attention on PSI at all. Presumably because -- until that Jets game -- PSI was never a problem. That's why I think the balls being at 16 PSI was just a lazy screw up from the refs; thinking they were K balls, or something.

That's the irony of this whole DeflateGate nonsense. The fact that the rule wasn't enforced is the exact reason why Brady put so much emphasis on making sure it was ok. He's being charged with breaking a rule all because he went out of his way to make sure that very rule was being upheld in the first place. Brady really didn't start talking will the ball boys on making sure the footballs are at 12.5 PSI until after that Jets game. It wasn't an effort to gain a competitive advantage; it was just an effort to prevent a future disadvantage.

the whole saga bugs me.

robert kraft and his useless son bug me.

archstanton543 said:

And it would be extremely suspicious that the Pats would get caught up in another scandal like this. Even to people who are Deflategate truths. WHEN the Pats get railroaded again, it will be because of some other perceived infraction of the rules.

Click to expand...

Fixed your typo

"Hello, NFL HQ... what? You say a team is over inflating footballs?!?! Let's get the lawyers together and head to Foxboro!



Oh, it's the Jets? Never mind."

oldrover said:

"Hello, NFL HQ... what? You say a team is over inflating footballs?!?! Let's get the lawyers together and head to Foxboro!



Oh, it's the Jets? Never mind."

Click to expand...

Oh, it's Green Bay and Aaron Rodgers? Never mind.

The 16 PSI incident is the one thing that sometimes does make me wonder if some scheme was hatched (not necessarily involving Brady) to check balls after the refs were done with them and deflate them down to 12.5 PSI but no lower. Technically illegal (since it happened after the ref check) but functionally not (since the balls remained in the legal range).

Not saying it did happen, but it is something that has occurred to me from time to time.

QuantumMechanic said:

The 16 PSI incident is the one thing that sometimes does make me wonder if some scheme was hatched (not necessarily involving Brady) to check balls after the refs were done with them and deflate them down to 12.5 PSI but no lower. Technically illegal (since it happened after the ref check) but functionally not (since the balls remained in the legal range).

Not saying it did happen, but it is something that has occurred to me from time to time.

Click to expand...

I don't see any reason for that to have happened, and there's certainly no evidence of it. Sounds like they just showed the refs the rulebook and told them 12.5.

QuantumMechanic said:

The 16 PSI incident is the one thing that sometimes does make me wonder if some scheme was hatched (not necessarily involving Brady) to check balls after the refs were done with them and deflate them down to 12.5 PSI but no lower. Technically illegal (since it happened after the ref check) but functionally not (since the balls remained in the legal range).

Not saying it did happen, but it is something that has occurred to me from time to time.

Click to expand...

If true, then the plan would have been hatched after all the text messages that Wells used to imply guilt. There's really no evidence of that.

RunAmok said:

The 16lbs psi from the Jets game just shows how very little the refs ever paid to ball inflation or process. I would not be surprised if most refs just gave the balls a squeeze and added/subtracted whatever they wanted.

Click to expand...

In the entire history of the NFL, nobody EVER cared about the inflation level of the football. Even the NFL, on two separate occasions - once when the Jets were tampering with K balls, and again when the Panthers were actually tampering with footballs on the sidelines during a game, just a month or so before the Pats-Colts AFCCG no less, and in neither case did the NFL investigate or fine anyone or do....anything, besides send a note reminding people not to do that.

Never, ever an issue. Until the Patriots got involved. Then it became the most egregious crime in league history, at least judged by the penalty they received for it.

ivanvamp said:

In the entire history of the NFL, nobody EVER cared about the inflation level of the football. Even the NFL, on two separate occasions - once when the Jets were tampering with K balls, and again when the Panthers were actually tampering with footballs on the sidelines during a game, just a month or so before the Pats-Colts AFCCG no less, and in neither case did the NFL investigate or fine anyone or do....anything, besides send a note reminding people not to do that.

Never, ever an issue. Until the Patriots got involved. Then it became the most egregious crime in league history, at least judged by the penalty they received for it.

Click to expand...

In the entire history of FOOTBALL no one has ever cared about inflation levels. When I played football growing up, I couldn't imagine some dweeby loser being like "You guys won because your balls had less PSI in them!!!" I reckon you'd get your ass kicked in half saying something like that.

This is how I picture everyone who *****es about Deflategate (Colts fans especially)

sb1 said:

Dunno about any conspiracy theories but part of me feels like that was no accident. If Brady has a rep around the league for preferring footballs on the softer end of the range... then what's stopping someone from rigging a game against him? Just like the false Mort report was no accident... it feels like someone bet a lot of money on the Seahawks (and Jets?). That is something worthy of a congressional investigation if that is anywhere close to the truth.

And if Tom really did get the dorito dinks to always set the footballs to 12.5 PSI.... what's stopping the NFL from screwing with Pats games by deliberately making them 16 PSI again... knowing Tom probably won't be getting them "fixed" anymore?

I think the Pats need to be wary of that... and Bill order his team not to take the field as necessary until the refs fix the air pressure in the footballs. We all know how low this league will stoop and I put nothing past them.

Click to expand...

Agreed.

Money is not about a conspiracy, nor is ego and power. I always asked these 2 questions:

1. Was Mike Kensil at the game on 10.16.14?

2. How did ref Bill Leavy allow the balls to be that far over the 13.5 limit, if the weather that day was in the low 60s and the balls returned to a slightly higher temp at, say 70 degrees, inside the stadium?

Lastly, why was Bill Leavy demoted in 2013, only to be PROMOTED after the 2014 season and why were both he and Kensil's offices moved on Park Ave?

Who promotes a recently demoted ref, for special consulting services if the ref was so poor at his job?

Could it be Bill Leavy knows that Kensil took some of those balls at the Jets request to try to cheat Brady and the Pats>?

You'd have to be ****faced to not see the gauge at around 16 PSI.

Lastly, how arrogant and sloppy is it that Wells put that in the report, apparently to show some kind of seed of intent AFETR 10.16.14 for Brady to order Jastremski to deflate balls for god knows what reason, but in the Wells Report itself from the game that day, ,Brady is quoted as speciyuing the PSI range of 12.5 - 13.5 because he was so annoyed?

Why would he ask to doublecheck the game manual and thre rule, if he wanted it below 12.5 for whatever the reason may be?

The whole discussion of PSI has never come up in the history of brady's career at any time and he had to doublecheck what it was because 4 balls were so egregiously over-inflated, giving the Jets an advantage.

It's just amazing to me.

Was Mike Kensil at the 10.16.14 Jets vs Pats game? Was he? The only way to find out, apparrently, is to drop a defamation suit and ask him on a federal stand.

The last obvious dead giveaway that nothing happened to the footballs vs the Colts is the idea McNally would have HAD to have been present to see if the refs added air to the balls at all, because it wouldn't make sense for McNally to tamper with the balls after Brady blessed them, mere hours earlier. So, if there is no security footage of McNally standing there looking over the refs shoulders as they check the PSIs, then why would he take it upon himself, in awe of Brady, to tamper with the QBs preferences? FOr ****s and giggles?

I mean, does Goodell really think intelligent people who aren't even Pats fans, are all going to believe this?

Thee are so many tells in the Wells Report, its not even funny. They erred in the fact they used the 10.14.16 game to show intent that brady is uptight about the PSI and then cherrypicked old texts, strung that together with the 10.16 game, which somehow meant between 10.16 and January, but only at home games, all of a sudden, Brady orchestrated this scheme?

Really? Brady has to have the ball at 11.5 or 11 to start a game to be a HOF QB? We're supposed to believe this? Not to mention, anyone who has ever thrown a football would rather have it harder, not softer. A slower rotating ball gets to its target slower. Duh.

It's just so preposterous.

If you wanted to soften the balls, just have Vince roll on the bag during the national anthem for chrissakes.

Also, why would a part time guy like that lie to BB, Kraft and Brady? He wouldn't.

Was Kensil at the game on 10.16.14?

I just wonder.

Brady must sue to get Kensil on a stand.

Sorry, this needed to be said twice becuase the media has completely glossed over Kensil's role in this including him being quoted as saying "We weighed (what a moron) the balls, you're in big trouble" and the fact Kensil is Mortensen's source.

Yeah lots of the text messages that were incriminating were because of that 16 PSI game.

"They were at 16. The refs screwed us".

It makes it sound like the refs foiled their plot to deflate the footballs by pumping them up to 16, when in reality the refs didn't pay attention to the PSI, loaded it up to 16 ('screwing' them), and Brady had a bad game because of it.

So the equipment guys were told not to let that happen again and to work with the refs to ensure it. Hence more incriminating text messages when they were annoyed at Brady:

"I'll make them watermelons"

If you read it the wrong way, it sounds like they aren't going along with Brady's request to deflate below 12.5. In reality, he's just joking that they'll put it back up to 16 because he's mad at Brady for whatever reason.

Those guys are the equipment guys. It's their JOB to make sure the football is at a certain air pressure (at least, it started being their job after the Jets game). There's nothing in any text message that says they are deflating the footballs below 12.5 PSI -- even the famous 'deflater' message (that doesn't really apply since it happened before the Jets game.).

But you have a few text messages that sound remotely incriminating and you lose a draft pick and 4 games because people are going to twist them to suit their agenda.

d%#*!@t, now my blood is boiling again. As someone said, none of this would have ever happened if the Refs didn't mess up against the Jets and bring Brady's attention to football air pressure in the first place.

RunAmok said:

The 16lbs psi from the Jets game just shows how very little the refs ever paid to ball inflation or process. I would not be surprised if most refs just gave the balls a squeeze and added/subtracted whatever they wanted.

Click to expand...

Very soon after this ****show began, I saw a story about a guy who was/still is the person in charge of the footballs for the Chicago Bears for about 25 years. He said he never once saw a referee use a gauge to measure the PSI before a game. He said it was always the "squeeze test" or nothing at all. 25 f###### years...

TB_Helmet said:

Yeah lots of the text messages that were incriminating were because of that 16 PSI game.

"They were at 16. The refs screwed us".

It makes it sound like the refs foiled their plot to deflate the footballs by pumping them up to 16, when in reality the refs didn't pay attention to the PSI, loaded it up to 16 ('screwing' them), and Brady had a bad game because of it.

So the equipment guys were told not to let that happen again and to work with the refs to ensure it. Hence more incriminating text messages when they were annoyed at Brady:

"I'll make them watermelons"

If you read it the wrong way, it sounds like they aren't going along with Brady's request to deflate below 12.5. In reality, he's just joking that they'll put it back up to 16 because he's mad at Brady for whatever reason.

Those guys are the equipment guys. It's their JOB to make sure the football is at a certain air pressure (at least, it started being their job after the Jets game). There's nothing in any text message that says they are deflating the footballs below 12.5 PSI -- even the famous 'deflater' message (that doesn't really apply since it happened before the Jets game.).

But you have a few text messages that sound remotely incriminating and you lose a draft pick and 4 games because people are going to twist them to suit their agenda.

d%#*!@t, now my blood is boiling again. As someone said, none of this would have ever happened if the Refs didn't mess up against the Jets and bring Brady's attention to football air pressure in the first place.

Click to expand...

Right, so why isn't there an investigation into the refs? Anyone who saw that MIT guy's presentation on You Tube, saw a pregame process of refs dressed in suits, yakking it up, barely paying attention to the balls as they got undressed simultaneously to barely squeezing the balls or even checking the final PSI.

If a protocol is that loose via the NFL, how can anyone from the NFL pretend this is an exact science, especially hours later and with the balls exposed to the elements?

The best thing Goodell had was some trigger words like "deflate" scattered through many months prior, so they could frame the situation, but as Indy's Equip Manager said "everyone knows NE deflates footballs", why did it take up until the AFC title game for Sean Sullivan to alert ANYONE of this well known cheating?

Could it be Grigson told Sullivan to send him that email to remove any suspicion that this was a framejob via Harbaugh-->Pagano--Grigson? Oh, I think so!

Why did Jastremski say "the refs screwed us", pointing to somewhat of a common occurrence with inconsistent PSI levels, almost like they've dealt with this before (NFL is likley cheating Brady and the Pats), if McNally's scheme was in place?

Wouldn't have Jastremski said something to the effect of: "Dude, why didn't you get the balls done down to where Tom wants them?! He's pissed!"..?

That never happened.

Jackson 2 said:

Very soon after this ****show began, I saw a story about a guy who was/still is the person in charge of the footballs for the Chicago Bears for about 25 years. He said he never once saw a referee use a gauge to measure the PSI before a game. He said it was always the "squeeze test" or nothing at all. 25 f###### years...

Click to expand...

In the interest of accuracy, after my above post I did some Googling in an attempt to find the piece. All I could find was a story about the person who was the Bears ball guy in 2003 saying he never saw a ref measure a ball before a game. That's a far cry from 25 years, f###### or otherwise. My apologies for posting an apparent inaccuracy.

Jackson 2 said:

Very soon after this ****show began, I saw a story about a guy who was/still is the person in charge of the footballs for the Chicago Bears for about 25 years. He said he never once saw a referee use a gauge to measure the PSI before a game. He said it was always the "squeeze test" or nothing at all. 25 f###### years...

Click to expand...

That is correct. I forget his name, but it was listed in that piece. If I am Brady, I ask my attorneys to call him to the stand to testify in the defamation suit.