Vincent Valentine - Glass half full?

DarrylS · May 4, 2016

Wilfork was a very good athlete as well, remember stories how he could dunk a basketball...

All this stuff about 225 reps, is an ok stat, but lets see how he gets better over time with the aid of our training staff and nutritionist..

BTTA · May 4, 2016

So apparently he blew up at the combine, except for the benchpress, which is the least useful activity they perform when there. And, some have come to the conclusion that he is out of shape? Is there something else indicating this? He looked pretty fit for a big DT in the video above.

ausbacker · May 4, 2016

betterthanthealternative said:
So apparently he blew up at the combine, except for the benchpress, which is the least useful activity they perform when there. And, some have come to the conclusion that he is out of shape? Is there something else indicating this? He looked pretty fit for a big DT in the video above.

On the contrary, I can see the importance of the Bench Press in the trenches, especially if you're trying to overpower or direct a linemen (either OL or DL) in a specific direction.

In sport, it's all connected.

Nunchucks · May 4, 2016

I love the pick. The guy is a beast. He needs time in the gym and conditioning, but he has the physical skills to be a true mauler. He is a great risk/reward pick.

PatsWickedPissah · May 4, 2016

Hopefully the Pats have their trainer issues resolved.

AzorianPats · May 4, 2016

ausbacker said:
On the contrary, I can see the importance of the Bench Press in the trenches, especially if you're trying to overpower or direct a linemen (either OL or DL) in a specific direction.

In sport, it's all connected.

Its important, but it goes hand in hand with squatting. These guys explode from the heels up

mgteich · May 4, 2016

We don't "need" Valentine to perform until 2017. One presumes that any conditioning issues will be worked out long before then.

Urgent · May 4, 2016

It's easy to get excited by the highlight videos. If you play three or four years, hopefully there are some highlights.
As fans, we don't really get access to understand the player. There must have been something that really stood out in the interviews. The guy had 10 tackles in 10 games in his last season in college - which led to a lot of media guys ranking him as a 6th-7th candidate. cfbstats.com - Vincent Valentine 2015 Player Statistics - Nebraska Cornhuskers
The article on Patspulpit points to his impressive performance relative to players over 325 pounds at the Combine - and that is pretty much the definition of cherry-picking. Is that more impressive, say, than Maliek Jackson and Chris Jones turning in 3-cones under 7.5 seconds at 310 pounds? (Jackson was 8 seconds) A lot of the in-depth profiles pointed to him being pushed around a lot; the highlights show a few impressive pressures.

It was a puzzling pick. Hopefully the glass turns out more than half full.

Todd Bradley · May 4, 2016

The guy squatted 745 with no hands even on the bar and people are worried about his bench?

LOL come on.........

BradyFTW! · May 4, 2016

I'm fine with the pick. He'll probably never amount to anything special, but these are the kind of guys you roll the dice on when you have a fairly stacked team and you're always picking at the bottom of every round.

If he hits, we have a potential long-term starter for a mid-round pick. If he'd stayed in school, gotten healthy, and played to anything resembling his potential, he'd go into the 2017 draft as an easy first round pick. Instead, they assumed a bunch of extra risk to get him at the bottom of the third.

It's kinda like the Gronk, Tate and Easley picks. Long odds, but when they hit they hit big.

DW Toys · May 4, 2016

Ross12 said:
Seems like NE drafted a few players whose tape doesn't jump out at you or maybe whose stats don't tell a promising tale, but they think have a lot of undiscovered potential. Valentine kind of epitomizes that... He hasn't done much, but that doesn't mean he won't grow to do a whole lot. You may as well roll the dice on high ceilings when you have a stacked roster.

I mean, they unearthed some kid named Malcolm Butler who no one had ever heard of, he became a super bowl hero as a rookie and then the #1 CB as a sophomore. It can certainly happen for Valentine.

Cousin, I have no problem that they Drafted him. It is the Draft Value asset that they wasted. It is a crap shoot on any of these kids but he was maybe a 5th Round value by not just the Mel Kipers of the world, but experienced GMs, Coaches and Scouts. They panicked. They took a kid they obviously wanted way before hand and like Tavon Wilson, Jordan Richards and more. Bill panics and that I do not get. But IMO he is just average in the Draft. Not bad, not good, but always interesting.

He is better at FA and Trades. So I am not surprised at the game he plays. He went into FA and Trades this year with a vengeance which should have been our tip that this years Draft Class was poopy according to him.

Notable picks they could have had between Valentine and Mitchell include ILB Joe Shubert (perfect BB guy),Tapper a pass rush DE, DT Sheldon Day with solid tape NOT iffy like Valentine.Miles Killebrew SS/OLB a much respected hybrid that someone in the Pats Draft room who used to be a used car salesman for sure, talked BB into Grugler-Hill instead......yikes.

DW Toys

This was the Pats Drafting for Special Teams. They already got their talent in FA and Trades for 2016.

DW Toys · May 4, 2016

DW Toys said:
Cousin, I have no problem that they Drafted him. It is the Draft Value asset that they wasted. It is a crap shoot on any of these kids but he was maybe a 5th Round value by not just the Mel Kipers of the world, but experienced GMs, Coaches and Scouts. They panicked. They took a kid they obviously wanted way before talent value and like Tavon Wilson, Jordan Richards and more, it will bite them. Bill panics and that I do not get. But IMO he is just average in the Draft. Not bad, not good, but always interesting.

He is better at FA and Trades. So I am not surprised at the game he plays. He went into FA and Trades this year with a vengeance which should have been our tip that this years Draft Class was poopy according to him.

Notable picks they could have had between Valentine and Mitchell include ILB Joe Shubert (perfect BB guy),Tapper a pass rush DE, DT Sheldon Day with solid tape NOT iffy like Valentine.Miles Killebrew SS/OLB a much respected hybrid that someone in the Pats Draft room who used to be a used car salesman for sure, talked BB into Grugler-Hill instead......yikes.

DW Toys

This was the Pats Drafting for Special Teams. They already got their talent in FA and Trades for 2016.

PatsWickedPissah · May 4, 2016

Is this the new IN thing?
Write a post and then quote your same post?

dtbrks · May 4, 2016

it must be like the old days when people would "bump" a thread back up to the top of the list.

PatsFan2 · May 4, 2016

VV is the kind of D-lineman that fits well in this system unlike former Patriot Damien Easley.

Urgent · May 4, 2016

I was not a fan of the Easley pick at the time either.
However, the blanket statement that he did not fit in the system is not easy to support.
According to the stats, he had the highest ratio of QB pressures per snap, or something like that.
Apparently he was a turd. If your own dog hates you, you've got to be pretty turdy. Seriously.
He couldn't stay on the field, and he was a jerk. But when he was on the field, apparently he was productive within the system.

And the Patriots had been looking for players like Easley for years. They paid a lot to get Fanene, who also did not work due to injury. Mike Wright fit the system really well - under 300 pounds, quick, penetrating.

I don't know how we can say that VV is the kind of D-lineman that does fit well yet.

JMC00 · May 4, 2016

Urgent said:
I don't know how we can say that VV is the kind of D-lineman that does fit well yet.

Fits well if Belichick is going to a style of defense were his DL take up space and let the LBs clean up.

dtbrks · May 4, 2016

IcyPatriot said:
745 pound squat ... for comparison Vince Wilfork 505 Lb squat.
Joe andruzzi has(d) the previous record at 725lbs ...
Ethan Kelley had the DL record 685lbs.

Could be the strongest Patriot lineman ever.
He's better suited to a 2-gap team and was not utilized to his strengths in college.

2016 NFL Draft: Rookie DT Vincent Valentine Might Be the Strongest Player in Patriots History

Now that's what I'm talking about. Strong lower body. While form is not perfect just walking with that kind of weight on your shoulders is amazing.

Also remember he has some of his own body weight that he has to move along with the weight.

letekro · May 4, 2016

Big, talented, athletic guy. No problem with taking a guy like this in the 90s. A calculated risk. For some reason, I think it pans out.

BelichickFan · May 4, 2016

JMC00 said:
Fits well if Belichick is going to a style of defense were his DL take up space and let the LBs clean up.

I think it's more to do with having bigger, stouter guys in the middle in nickel.

Vincent Valentine - Glass half full?

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