We May Only Need 8 Offensive Linemen

ATippett56 · May 2, 2016

supafly said:
I definitely agree with your second paragraph. Those ST only players are staying, and if we include a guy like Bolden, we're up to at least seven.

I think Michael Williams has proven his value as a blocking, physical TE though. It will be interesting to see if Belichick keeps him around or not. He also provides some versatility as a backup emergency tackle.

I don't want a backup emergency tackle, I want a real offensive tackle instead.

Fencer · May 2, 2016

They need to do about 4 roster slots' worth of skimping. I don't think the following shortchanges any position groups -- but the numbers in it add up to 57, not 53.

K/P/LS -- 3

QB -- 3
OL -- 9
WR -- 5+1, where the 1 is Slater
TE -- 4
RB -- 5, e.g. Lewis, White, Brown, Blount, Bolden
FB -- 1

CB -- 5
S -- 4+2, i.e. McCourty, Harmon, Chung, Richards plus Ebner, King
True LB -- 5, counting ST-mainly guys
Edge rusher -- 5
DT -- 5

mgteich · May 2, 2016

ATippett56 said:
I don't want a backup emergency tackle, I want a real offensive tackle instead.

We'll have 4 REAL OT's this year: Solder, Vollmer, Thuney, and Waddle or Cannon.

This may be the best four we've had in awhile.
=======================
However, I also believe that if TE's are a critical part of our offense, then we'll carry a 3rd TE, most likely Harbor.

varjao · May 2, 2016

Andrews is a lock.

Stork
Andrews
Solder
Thuney
Cooper
Mason
Kline

These are my locks right now. Vollmer is not on the list because I'm not ruling out BB trading him just like he did with Mankins. In this case, Cannon gets the job. If not, Vollmer is a lock. Wendell may be a wild card because he can play center and was a decent right guard and locker room leader. If he is healthy Andrews becomes expendable.

ATippett56 · May 2, 2016

mgteich said:
We'll have 4 REAL OT's this year: Solder, Vollmer, Thuney, and Waddle or Cannon.

This may be the best four we've had in awhile.
=======================
However, I also believe that if TE's are a critical part of our offense, then we'll carry a 3rd TE, most likely Harbor.

What has Waddle done for the New England Patriots?

50-yard-line · May 2, 2016

C: Stork, Andrews
G: Mason, Jackson, Cooper, Thuney
T: Vollmer, Solder, Waddle

That's my guess and I'd add Cannon on a restructure, perhaps.

Karras to the PS. I don't see how you cut bait with Mason, Jackson, Stork (unless injury) or Andrews at this time. Cooper, I hope, is going to wow them at camp - he's got all the tools to succeed and was succeeding before he got hurt.

Thuney is a lock at his draft position.

Tackles are hard to find - since they didn't get anyone new, I think these three are staying, and expect Scar to want Cannon (who was playing hurt last year) around as well.

Fleming is going to have to come in as a new man, ready to rumble, to make it. Kline did some good work last year, but it looks like his ceiling is established, and I just don't see room there. If Jackson's knee is gimpy, move him into that slot.

One thing I see for certain: a lot of guys are getting cut form the Pats this year who are going to have ZERO trouble latching on with another team.

Brady6 · May 2, 2016

mgteich said:
If Thuney isn't a starting OG, he can be considered the 8th OL, including the role as the 4th OT, and 5th interior lineman.

OT (3) Solder, Vollmer, Waddle or Cannon
C (1) Stork or Andrews
G (3) choose three, one of whom needs to be able to be the backup center
G/T (1) Thuney

For some reason I have a bad feeling about Stork making the team.

captain stone · May 8, 2016

mgteich said:
We'll have 4 REAL OT's this year: Solder, Vollmer, Thuney, and Waddle or Cannon.

This may be the best four we've had in awhile...

Thuney is NOT a REAL OT; he's not any kind of OT. I just hope he can play an acceptable REAL LG.
What is real is that Bill really, really fecked-up not drafting LeRaven Clark instead of Thuney.

And this group certainly isn't better than the 2011 OTs.

mgteich · May 8, 2016

captain stone said:
Thuney is NOT a REAL OT; he's not any kind of OT. I just hope he can play an acceptable REAL LG.
What is real is that Bill really, really fecked-up not drafting LeRaven Clark instead of Thuney.

And this group certainly isn't better than the 2011 OTs.

Belichick and Scar have been clear. Thuney was drafted to play inside. He is an "emergency" OT. Often, we carry only 3 OT's, as long as we have a player or two who can play there in an emergency.

Consider this from YOUR perspective. Belichick AGREED with you that we needed guards. So, he brought in Cooper and Thuney.

Were you satisfied with our guards?

mgteich · May 8, 2016

captain stone said:
Thuney is NOT a REAL OT; he's not any kind of OT. I just hope he can play an acceptable REAL LG.
What is real is that Bill really, really fecked-up not drafting LeRaven Clark instead of Thuney.

And this group certainly isn't better than the 2011 OTs.

With regard to OT's, obviously Belichick saw a greater need at guard. YOU don't like our backups, but Scar does. Both Cannon and Waddle are coming back from injuries. One will be the swing OT. And yes, many top teams have no better than a Fleming or Williams as their #4 OT.

One-If-By-Sea · May 8, 2016

Fencer said:
They need to do about 4 roster slots' worth of skimping. I don't think the following shortchanges any position groups -- but the numbers in it add up to 57, not 53.

K/P/LS -- 3

QB -- 3
OL -- 9
WR -- 5+1, where the 1 is Slater
TE -- 4
RB -- 5, e.g. Lewis, White, Brown, Blount, Bolden
FB -- 1

CB -- 5
S -- 4+2, i.e. McCourty, Harmon, Chung, Richards plus Ebner, King
True LB -- 5, counting ST-mainly guys
Edge rusher -- 5
DT -- 5

There are always injuries so +4 is not surprising.

jah · May 8, 2016

mgteich said:
Belichick and Scar have been clear. Thuney was drafted to play inside. He is an "emergency" OT. Often, we carry only 3 OT's, as long as we have a player or two who can play there in an emergency.

Consider this from YOUR perspective. Belichick AGREED with you that we needed guards. So, he brought in Cooper and Thuney.

Were you satisfied with our guards?

Somebody, not sure who, scoffed at Michael Williams' ability to play emergency tackle in this thread. What I don't understand is what makes Thuney any more viable. Neither of them play tackle primarily, both have played tackle before, and both are about the right size if not a little small. Let's not forget that Williams isn't just some 6'2-250lb TE, he was converted from tackle and is about the size of one.

Perhaps Thuney's versatility makes Williams expendable since we have a bigger need at G than TE. But as far as apples-to-apples "which can play emergency tackle better?" comparison go, I'd probably even give the edge to Williams right now because of his pro experience.

mgteich · May 8, 2016

Elijah said:
Somebody, not sure who, scoffed at Michael Williams' ability to play emergency tackle in this thread. What I don't understand is what makes Thuney any more viable. Neither of them play tackle primarily, both have played tackle before, and both are about the right size if not a little small. Let's not forget that Williams isn't just some 6'2-250lb TE, he was converted from tackle and is about the size of one.

Perhaps Thuney's versatility makes Williams expendable since we have a bigger need at G than TE. But as far as apples-to-apples "which can play emergency tackle better?" comparison go, I'd probably even give the edge to Williams right now because of his pro experience.

Scar thinks that we NEED the talent at OG. Sure, Williams may be a better emergency OT. perhaps, it might be better simply to consider Thuney an OG/C. I would not be at all surprised to see Thuney start at OG this year or next.

With regard to the 4th OT, we carry one, or not. Waddle or Cannon are obviously much stronger 4th OT's than Thuney or Williams.

The competition for Williams is Harbor.

zydecochris · May 8, 2016

Elijah said:
Somebody, not sure who, scoffed at Michael Williams' ability to play emergency tackle in this thread. What I don't understand is what makes Thuney any more viable. Neither of them play tackle primarily, both have played tackle before, and both are about the right size if not a little small. Let's not forget that Williams isn't just some 6'2-250lb TE, he was converted from tackle and is about the size of one.

Perhaps Thuney's versatility makes Williams expendable since we have a bigger need at G than TE. But as far as apples-to-apples "which can play emergency tackle better?" comparison go, I'd probably even give the edge to Williams right now because of his pro experience.

Williams was a blocking TE at Alabama. After being drafted by Detroit (who already had a good blocking TE, Pettigrew) they had him bulk way up and tried to convert him to a OT. As I can best recall, I think he was injured one year and he ended up being beat out by our own LaAdrian Waddle at RT the next, and then he came to NE where they turned him back into a (bulked up) blocking TE.

You are right that Thuney has not demonstrated the ability to play RT at the NFL level. As for Williams, I thought he played very effectively as a blocking TE last year. Maybe Scar can work his magic on him and make him into an effective RT, but the "Williams to RT" experiment didn't really work that well in Detroit.

zydecochris · May 8, 2016

mgteich said:
Scar thinks that we NEED the talent at OG. Sure, Williams may be a better emergency OT. perhaps, it might be better simply to consider Thuney an OG/C. I would not be at all surprised to see Thuney start at OG this year or next.

With regard to the 4th OT, we carry one, or not. Waddle or Cannon are obviously much stronger 4th OT's than Thuney or Williams.

The competition for Williams is Harbor.

Agreed, and Waddle in fact proved that in Detroit, where he beat out Williams at RT.

long distance · May 8, 2016

Canuck said:
They started with 10 last year and ended with 8. I can't imagine what it would have been like, if they started last year off with 8. Yikes!

we have 6 eligible for PS
and they can clear waivers safely than WRs

long distance · May 8, 2016

captain stone said:
Thuney is NOT a REAL OT; he's not any kind of OT. I just hope he can play an acceptable REAL LG.
What is real is that Bill really, really fecked-up not drafting LeRaven Clark instead of Thuney.

And this group certainly isn't better than the 2011 OTs.

I watched Clarks highlights and I am happy they didnt go for him.
(he would be on your ***** list sooner than Cannon)
I watched Thuneys and I am happy that they went for him.
That doesnt solve the 'real' OT question at hand, but does make me feel better as NE fan.

mgteich · May 8, 2016

long distance said:
we have 6 eligible for PS
and they can clear waivers safely than WRs

We have often has guys like Kline, Barker and Karras on the Practice Squad. 2-3 OL's is the likely norm.

supafly · May 8, 2016

varjao said:
Andrews is a lock.

Stork
Andrews
Solder
Thuney
Cooper
Mason
Kline

These are my locks right now. Vollmer is not on the list because I'm not ruling out BB trading him just like he did with Mankins. In this case, Cannon gets the job. If not, Vollmer is a lock. Wendell may be a wild card because he can play center and was a decent right guard and locker room leader. If he is healthy Andrews becomes expendable.

Wendell is a free agent who hasn't received any interest. He's fine to bring back sometime this summer if the youngsters aren't showing progress. Then again, it's also possible that his concussion and injury history have forced the team to move on.

Hard for me to imagine Vollmer not being a lock, particularly during a year where OT wasn't addressed, and we have a lack of depth behind him.

TheFlyingWedge · May 9, 2016

Mack Herron said:
With 3 QBs they have to trim someplace. Not sure OL is the best place though.

Amazing to think Belichick carried 4 Qb's in 2000.

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