23 hits on Brady...most on any QB since 2006

KontradictioN said:

The question is what do they do? They will get Solder back next season but what about the interior OL? Do you trust Mason and Jackson to grow in the system? What about Stork? Do you try to make another move there or trust him to get healthy? Kline has to go. He's terrible. At best he's a back-up. That is one thing I know for certain. Outside of that, it will be interesting to see what they do with that unit. They've been downright horrible since letting Mankins go and were exposed through the second half of the season. If Brady gets hit like that again next year at age 39, he won't make it through the season.

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I posted about this elsewhere, but I heard that the Pats had something like 23 (or was it 33?) different offensive line combinations play this season because of injuries. No way can chemistry -- consistency and communication -- be built on that. The injuries this year were flukey to the extreme. Losing Solder had a devastating d0mino effect at tackle, and there were no answers on the bench. I had hopes for Waddle but he got hurt too. Fleming and Cannon are bad, Kline is almost as bad -- I'd like to see them all replaced. Mason, Jackson, Andrews and Stork have shown enough to hopefully grow with. I don't know about how Wendell fits in. So, building OL depth via the draft and FA looks to be a priority this off season.

tmajr3 said:

He should've been cut after letting Von Miller run a circle around him and not even touching him. He and Cannon were pathetic

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Where was Scott Chandler (TE) to help out on the OL? This guy is a bust signing.

Tunescribe said:

I posted about this elsewhere, but I heard that the Pats had something like 23 (or was it 33?) different offensive line combinations play this season because of injuries. No way can chemistry -- consistency and communication -- be built on that. The injuries this year were flukey to the extreme. Losing Solder had a devastating d0mino effect at tackle, and there were no answers on the bench. I had hopes for Waddle but he got hurt too. Fleming and Cannon are bad, Kline is almost as bad -- I'd like to see them all replaced. Mason, Jackson, Andrews and Stork have shown enough to hopefully grow with. I don't know about how Wendell fits in. So, building OL depth via the draft and FA looks to be a priority this off season.

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I would think alot of this can be the coaches fault as well.

Snake Eyes said:

The roster size isn't the issue, if we have more bodies so does the opposition, the problem is we have several O-lineman that shouldn't even be on the roster. BB does NOT sufficiently invest in the Oline.

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Does this mean you think the O line issues were a result of the O line depth being inadequate?

Serious question because I don't know.

TomPatriot said:

What was more frustrating to watch was the lack of technique on most plays that Ware, Miller and Williams used. Other than the standard spin move and a few rip moves here and there, most of the time they just blew by or through the OL. As an OL coach, how to you stop that? The Broncos' Dline seemed to play on adrenaline for 4 quarters. Were they stealing some of Ashley's HGH? Were they just faster and stronger? Did they know the snap counts? Was it the crowd noise (not really buying that one)?

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Kind of the point I've tried to hit on here: they were pinning their ears back and getting a jump because Brady couldn't throw them off the snap with all the noise in the stadium. When that happens, it seems the thing to do is throw over the pressure. Why not have White or Bolden get a chip on Miller then release to the flat and give Brady an outlet? Have Cannon release to the second level and the WR's run outs to clear some space.

It seemed like no matter what protection they called on the D-line was getting on top of Brady in a HURRY. When that happens you have to switch up; per the snap counts it does look like they tried to give Cannon as much help as they could but I think some more reactive play calling was much needed. Receivers weren't getting open because Denver was only rushing 3 or 4 and getting pressure, so why not run more plays over the pressure to the flat and see what happens?

zipster9 said:

Where was Scott Chandler (TE) to help out on the OL? This guy is a bust signing.

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So true. I, like many others, was so excited for his signing.

Would've rather had Hooman

zipster9 said:

I would think alot of this can be the coaches fault as well.

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How are injuries the coaches' fault?

sevengables_2207 said:

I am with you on this. I would like to see them upgrade the #3 and #4 OT spot via the draft.

The IOL should improve with another year of experience and work in the weight room/training. But just in case, the team should try and find a solid veteran interior offensive lineman.

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Our first pick is number 50 or 51. Lotsa luck with that.

zipster9 said:

Where was Scott Chandler (TE) to help out on the OL? This guy is a bust signing.

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That seems like a non sequitur. It doesn't matter how unsuccessful Chandler was this year, Michael Williams is the guy that you expect if they need an extra blocker. He didn't have the strongest finish to the season either, after his own knee injury.

50-yard-line said:

Our first pick is number 50 or 51. Lotsa luck with that.

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Yeah, I am anticipating that spot already reserved for the next under the radar safety.

neuronet said:

Bring him back

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He's retired. And don't forget, the Patriots won a Super Bowl without him. Not even Scar's coaching "magic" could have transcended the OL's injury plague this season.

Tony2046 said:

Does this mean you think the O line issues were a result of the O line depth being inadequate?

Serious question because I don't know.

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If all teams have more bodies we don't gain a relative advantage. The main issue is that the players we have aren't that good, having more of them probably won't make much of a difference.

Snake Eyes said:

If all teams have more bodies we don't gain a relative advantage. The main issue is that the players we have aren't that good, having more of them probably won't make much of a difference.

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Then that suggests that they have to redistribute their salary cap. Where would cut depth to improve the O line?

Tunescribe said:

He's retired. And don't forget, the Patriots won a Super Bowl without him. Not even Scar's coaching "magic" could have transcended the OL's injury plague this season.

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Let me dream, Tunescribe, let me dream...

KontradictioN said:

That OL still sucked last year. The Pats just never ran into a defense that could do what Denver did to Edelman and Amendola yesterday.

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When 3 rushers can maul your QB leaving 8 to blanket the only 3 pass catchers Brady will throw to.....
It's all about the OL......a total overhaul is in order....players and coaches. I agree Kontra, the OL was subpar in 2015 despite the team success and the grouping collapsed this year...regardless of injuries. Even when healthy, they abandoned the run because they weren't capable of push.....just being pushed backwards. And the quick strike passing attack glossed over the sucktitude of the lot....Solder and Vollmer included. The personnel is lead footed, confused, overmatched.

Tunescribe said:

He's retired. And don't forget, the Patriots won a Super Bowl without him. Not even Scar's coaching "magic" could have transcended the OL's injury plague this season.

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People are grasping at straws. Its the same crap we heard for the first four weeks of the season last year.

Another crappy OL performance kills this teams SB dreams. Very frustrating to watch the futility shown by the OL yesterday.

Something has to improve on the OL. Not sure if said improvement needs to come from an injection of new talent, a new coach, getting healthier and/or more experienced, or some combo of the above .... but it must happen.

hambone1818 said:

Kind of the point I've tried to hit on here: they were pinning their ears back and getting a jump because Brady couldn't throw them off the snap with all the noise in the stadium. When that happens, it seems the thing to do is throw over the pressure. Why not have White or Bolden get a chip on Miller then release to the flat and give Brady an outlet? Have Cannon release to the second level and the WR's run outs to clear some space.

It seemed like no matter what protection they called on the D-line was getting on top of Brady in a HURRY. When that happens you have to switch up; per the snap counts it does look like they tried to give Cannon as much help as they could but I think some more reactive play calling was much needed. Receivers weren't getting open because Denver was only rushing 3 or 4 and getting pressure, so why not run more plays over the pressure to the flat and see what happens?

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My bad. I didn't read your post.

With their 3-4 man rushes being effective, Denver 's SS or Mike was able to rotate to the flat on both sides of the field most of those plays. They were giving Brady over the top by playing tight man but Brady never had time to execute those throws. Still, it's not a bad suggestion and with someone like Lewis it might have worked.

In the game thread, I clamored for the hurry-up offense, something they completely abandoned this year once the injuries piled up. I wouldn't have run it to prevent sub-packages, but to change the tempo of the game to put maximum pressure on Denver's D. In fact, when they opened the game by electing to receive, I thought the plan was to go uptempo on the first series and catch Denver by surprise.

neuronet said:

Let me dream, Tunescribe, let me dream...

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Cutting your dream short, Scar was the coach of the 2007 Super Bowl team.


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borg said:

When 3 rushers can maul your QB leaving 8 to blanket the only 3 pass catchers Brady will throw to.....
It's all about the OL......a total overhaul is in order....players and coaches. I agree Kontra, the OL was subpar in 2015 despite the team success and the grouping collapsed this year...regardless of injuries. Even when healthy, they abandoned the run because they weren't capable of push.....just being pushed backwards. And the quick strike passing attack glossed over the sucktitude of the lot....Solder and Vollmer included. The personnel is lead footed, confused, overmatched.

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This seems a little reactionary. Every team in the league struggled with that Denver D-line, the Patriots missing a very good LT doesn't help, other linemen were banged up, no Lewis/Blount. It was a nightmare watching Miller abuse Cannon and the entire O-line imploding but I disagree that this is a 'blow it up and start over' scenario.

Get healthy, get better O-line depth, another year for the rookie linemen to grow, get some RB's, get a good blocking TE...none of these are unrealistic and any one of those components in play yesterday might have turned the game in the Pats favor.