"Independent Medical Consultant" game time power scares me.

TB_Helmet · Nov 17, 2015

For me, more worrying than a spotter acting on league orders to remove a player to promote an agenda is a spotter who just has a personal favorite team and acts in the benefit of that team.

I know a lot of doctors who are huge NFL fans. I imagine they are not as carefully vetted for bias as a ref is, for instance (wasn't there a replacement ref a couple years back that turned out to be a huge Saints fan?). I could easily see one of those doctors looking at a judgement call on a concussion and either leaving the QB in if he plays for the doctor's favorite team or taking the QB on the other team out.

It's hard to remove that bias. Could any of you take Brady out in the Superbowl if that were your charge and you saw him hit his head on the ground? Would you have to think longer about taking Russell Wilson out? The spotters are only human.

(Wilson is probably a bad example since the magic water he drinks prevents him from getting concussions, but you get the idea).

pherein · Nov 17, 2015

TB_Helmet said:
bias as a ref is, for instance (wasn't there a replacement ref a couple years back that turned out to be a huge Saints fan?).

yes there was, but I fail to see the problem with that. Specifically we need bias Refs to cover Browner, and thanks for that Tojan horse btw, lol, Im sure BB still giggles about that.

neuronet · Nov 17, 2015

vuudu said:
He took a huge shot to the side of the head. He took himself out actually. I did not like the power they gave to these guys especially after citing the patriots as the reason for them in the first place. However, on the biggest stage, they will be stupid to make this the talking point to pull someone who is not concussed off.

Anyone have video link to the play? I think I saw a different video b/c what I saw wasn't bad, but it was well after he was taken out so I now think perhaps it was just a different play I saw.

HawaiianPatsfan · Nov 18, 2015

I personally think in the Super Bowl, Concussion protocol should be the players decision. You have to look at it this way. For 95% of the players in the NFL, playing in a Super Bowl is a life long dream. Years of hard work have gone into making it to this very very very very difficult place to be in sports. This is the pinnacle of this chosen career. Many players never get the chance to play, let alone return for another one. If I worked my entire life to make it to a game, you can damn sure guarantee that id be okay with taking the slight risk that I may take on by continuing to play with a concussion. Yes, if its visible that a player is out of it and can't make rational decisions, they someone should be able to make that call, but only if its extremely visible. You have to remember, some players are Tuffer then other (think Edelman in the SB). You can't have a same baseline for all players, you just can't. When you think of a sport like MMA, where fighters basically risk, or fight extended periods (rounds) with concussion, its just idiotic.

TheFlyingWedge · Nov 18, 2015

The

dales804 said:
The concussion protocol has been in place for years. These spotters have been in place since 2012. They just were given the authority to stop a game and have a player removed now if a player tries to stay on the field or a training staff misses an injury.

Did this increase in authority have anything to do with Cam Chancellor's hit on Julian Edrlman in the Super Bowl? The response from a lot of Seahawks fans was that Edelman should have been taken off the field after that hit. Luckily for us there was no "independent" council.

HawaiianPatsfan · Nov 18, 2015

TheFlyingWedge said:
The

Did this increase in authority have anything to do with Cam Chancellor's hit on Julian Edrlman in the Super Bowl? The response from a lot of Seahawks fans was that Edelman should have been taken off the field after that hit. Luckily for us there was no "independent" council.

Yes it did.

dales804 · Nov 18, 2015

TheFlyingWedge said:
The

Did this increase in authority have anything to do with Cam Chancellor's hit on Julian Edrlman in the Super Bowl? The response from a lot of Seahawks fans was that Edelman should have been taken off the field after that hit. Luckily for us there was no "independent" council.

As @HawaiianPatsfan said, it sure did:

Competition committee Chairman Rich McKay said the Edelman play was part of the impetus for the proposed rule.

“The Edelman situation was a play we looked at, and it was part of the issue. There were a couple other plays that go back a couple years that we looked at,” McKay said during the first day of the owners meetings Monday.

Source

IcyPatriot · Nov 23, 2015

ATC spotter failed to call medical timeout to remove Case Keenum

Late in Sunday’s game between the Rams and Ravens, the back of St. Louis quarterback Case Keenum’s head slammed against the ground during a late drive in a tie game. Keen immediately was in clear distress, struggling to get up.

But the game continued with Keenum at quarterback, without the Rams or the officials or the ATC spotter doing anything to get him off the field.

Ivan · Nov 23, 2015

dales804 said:
Did some research and this is the rule:

There's more, too.

And lastly, their criteria for being a "spotter:"

Source

You mean like Ryan Fitzpatrick yesterday?

Ivan · Nov 23, 2015

Chancellor should have been flagged for a personal foul for that. He was trying to knock Edelman out of the game and the Hawks where pissed when he kept going and then scored a TD.

varjao · Nov 23, 2015

Ivan said:
Chancellor should have been flagged for a personal foul for that. He was trying to knock Edelman out of the game and the Hawks where pissed when he kept going and then scored a TD.

and made another tough catch in the same drive, he is a tough SOB

RobertWeathers · Nov 23, 2015

IcyPatriot said:
ATC spotter failed to call medical timeout to remove Case Keenum

NFL Gameday Operations is a calamity.

RobertWeathers · Nov 23, 2015

HawaiianPatsfan said:
I personally think in the Super Bowl, Concussion protocol should be the players decision. You have to look at it this way. For 95% of the players in the NFL, playing in a Super Bowl is a life long dream. Years of hard work have gone into making it to this very very very very difficult place to be in sports. This is the pinnacle of this chosen career. Many players never get the chance to play, let alone return for another one. If I worked my entire life to make it to a game, you can damn sure guarantee that id be okay with taking the slight risk that I may take on by continuing to play with a concussion. Yes, if its visible that a player is out of it and can't make rational decisions, they someone should be able to make that call, but only if its extremely visible. You have to remember, some players are Tuffer then other (think Edelman in the SB). You can't have a same baseline for all players, you just can't. When you think of a sport like MMA, where fighters basically risk, or fight extended periods (rounds) with concussion, its just idiotic.

I hear you but that would be impossible to enforce. What do they do sign a medical waiver or indemnification agreement absolving the league and team of all responsibility if the player becomes disabled via a concussion incurred during the game?

varjao · Nov 23, 2015

I have the impression the refs are not calling helmet to helmet hits like they used to until last year. I'm seeing a lot of defenseless receivers getting smashed and nothing, and some blatant helmet to helmet hits on RB's. Yesterday SNF again it happened right in the middle of the field.

I don't know if there's something extra going on, because a helmet to helmet hit should automatically send the player to examination, and then there would be like 3 cases per game, not counting the cases that are already taking the players out of the game. So it could be the NFL asking the refs to "take it easy" or the refs washing their hands and saying to the NFL "it's your business now you deal with it".

NYPatsFan · Nov 23, 2015

Ivan said:
You mean like Ryan Fitzpatrick yesterday?

Fitzpatrick looked dazed after that hit. His helmet popped off and he stumbled to his feet and his lineman held him up so he wouldn't fall over. I couldn't believe they let him come back into the game.

People who don't know Fitzpatrick well will point to the two INTs he threw after that as proof of a concussion, but the fact is, that's just Fitz being Fitz.

Bobsyouruncle · Nov 23, 2015

IcyPatriot said:
ATC spotter failed to call medical timeout to remove Case Keenum

That's misleading, Keenum's normal state is confused and crawling around. It's impossible to tell if he has had new brain damage or just the usual brain damage.

JarOfMayo51 · Nov 24, 2015

Tuck said:
True, but the OP's point is that a League employee can take a player out of the game if he thinks the he player may be concussed and there is no way to know if the league official is acting fairly and independently since it is a judgement call made by one individual.

Helmet to helmet hits occur on every play that, in theory could give the IMC reason to pull players from the game for testing and since we all know the leagues use of the word independent is meaningless I tend to agree with The OP's point that there is cause for concern.

An independent former Jets executive will make the call on whether to pull a player from the game for concussion protocol... nothing to worry about!

borg · Nov 24, 2015

I must be getting old because I'm going to wait for such an episode to actually occur before ramping up outrage. Mentally, I'm still stuck on PSI.
Any PSI measurements released post game?
LMFAO

JarOfMayo51 · Nov 24, 2015

Concussion Protocol said:
FWIW, Hoyer wasn't pulled out of the game by the "independent" dudes. He left on his own.

Texans QB Brian Hoyer leaves with possible concussion

I find your user name relevant to this topic lol

memento · Nov 24, 2015

There was a shot where Brady went down clutching his helmet last night against the Bills. I'm looking around for a clip of it.

"Independent Medical Consultant" game time power scares me.

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