Revisiting Wes Welker (Bye Week Edition)

supafly said:

If by "lost his gamble" you mean ultimately--in the big picture, by having his career shortened, than I'd agree; otherwise, he simply played out the franchise tag here (9.5m), then went to DEN for another 12m dollars.

In other words, he got something either right in line with Belichick's original 3 year offer (give or take 1-2m, depending upon which report you believe), or even ended up getting more money in the long run seeing as how he was paid about 3/22.

As we've noted, he ultimately lost by shortening his career, so--who knows how he feels right now? If he's unhappy, he's at least unhappy and rich

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Short term I agree. He made more money in the two year span. However Sup, his earning power is now so reduced -- where I don't think it would have been here -- that he lost money. But this also leaves out an important factor, popularity and celebrity status. Here he was probably only behind Brady. He got mentions nationally repeatedly and he (proverbially) didn't have to buy a drink in Patriot Nation. To be beloved is a hell of a thing. Now he is all but a JAG who gets mentions only because he played successfully with Brady/Patriot glory he walked away from. ((side note: he walked away in a way that makes his return to where I think he could find success doubtful))

When you factor that in (including how a lofty status could translate into money) IMHO he lost pretty big.

While I don't know the particulars so I could be wrong on how it went down, why WW would depart from the Patriots like he did is a mystery to me. Why not just tell BB 'Thanks Bill but I think this is best for me and my family' -- then go on TV say the same thing while saying he loved playing for BB, the Patriots and the whole NEP shooting match. How he chose to approach the breakup is just bad business....

Joker said:

That being said, he is one of the toughest football players I have ever seen play the game and someone who truly left everything on the field, and for that, I respect him and wish him nothing but the best.

Yes, I agree 100%...yet, I still wish he'd caught that ball in the 4th quarter of the Giant super bowl. That singular play sticks in my craw to this day. I admit, I'm a gigantic hypocrite when it comes to NFL football players. I expect near perfection from them when I. myself , am far, far from perfect.

I wouldn't mind it one bit if Wes retired and then joined the media HERE in the southern New England area. His wisecracking style would be a welcome addition to the ranks of the former player/celebs we already have.

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Well look at the positive Joke -- if WW catches that ball then the NFL Slug-dom comes to harm the Patriots sooner. By losing the SB the Patriots got a few years reprieve to rebuild to a team that may be Slug-dom proof for a few years.

dannydyn said:

He can thank horseface for practically finishing his career and turning his brain into marshmallow stryfoam...

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Damn I am embarrassed that I overlooked horse face's involvement in this fall from grace

robertweathers said:

To say that WW is behind Moss and JE11 in the Pats HoF receiving line is off base.

Keep in mind, the DEN offer had more guarantees.

What is he supposed to do?

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Talk with the Patriots about his last offer then leave with some grace and respect for our organization?

TheBostonStraggler said:

Talk with the Patriots about his last offer then leave with some grace and respect for our organization?

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Depending on who you believe, there wasn't room for grace.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...agents-dispute-robert-krafts-version-of-talks

I thought that Welker went out to test the FA waters and when he came back the Pats had signed Amendola.

I also felt that the year before WW left the team the Pats were trying to get away from him.

Am I wrong?

Once Welker had an offer in Denver he was never going back to NE, no matter what anyone says. His wife stated that in the news here, she wanted to be in Colorado and said she hated the NE area. The sports news here made a big joke of it. Bridges.......burned.

1. This is the New England Patriots, where any time a player farts there's a national storm advisory. I don't think the separation between Welker and the team was bad. So many players - almost every one who leaves a team - has compatibility issues and events that are way worse than this. Contract negotiations by nature, especially when they fail, are going to cause resentment. The media obviously REALLY wanteed a story here considering it involves Belichick and one of Belichick's key players for many years, and Welker went from Brady to Manning, plus Brady and Welker's tabloid friendly friendship. Bottom line is, the Patriots and Welker had a long time to work out an extension and didn't. Neither felt strongly enough to take that last step and get the deal done. No need to blame or point fingers; this is what free agency is.

2. I don't think going to Denver had much to do with his decline. Age was everything here, and I made a comprehensive thread soon after he arrived that even despite his cherry picking TDs in 2013, the eye test and other indicators like YAC indicated he was already entering an extremely steep decline as all WRs do. I believe the crux of Welker's contract issue and market value was that he felt he was worth his production, whereas most other teams projected his inevitable and rapid decline. It's not like Denver gave him a huge contract. I'm sure Welker felt bitter that he never really got a big pay day, but that's his agent's fault. Never should have signed a team friendly extension that runs out when he turns 32/33. His agent was in fact an idiot throughout his career in misreading Welker's market value and considering his age. How he could play at an elite level for so many years and never get a mega deal is mind boggling.

3. All that said, if there is one player who I would give a ring to who didn't get one in NE, I think Welker is the easy answer. It is unfortunate a lot of his legacy will be thst missed connection/drop in the SB and a reputation of making some untimely drops. In two SBs, he had 163 yards receiving. He was an absolute warrior on the field who played through injuries and took some huge shots. His production and consistency are through the roof impressive. It is tragic that Wes never got a ring with the Patriots. He helped win a LOT of games, including playoff games. I hate seeing people bash him because of some tabloid drama when he left. Big whoop. Players go to new cities, sometimes rivals, and they want to fit in. Sometimes they say things...and I think it was quite mild anyway.

robertweathers said:

Depending on who you believe, there wasn't room for grace.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...agents-dispute-robert-krafts-version-of-talks

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RW, there might have been some heat behind the scenes. In no way do I believe that the Patriots business side is all cake and ice cream. Players and teams can really go at each other behind closed doors. Further, I don't begrudge a player for taking the best deal for himself. I may not like his departure but I respect taking the best choice to earn money in a sport that you traumatize your body and mind.

What does that have to do with after he left, though? The Patriots and Patriot Nation were damn good to WW. Acting like a jerk after leaving left me thinking Eff Yew......but that's just me.

TheBostonStraggler said:

RW, there might have been some heat behind the scenes. In no way do I believe that the Patriots business side is all cake and ice cream. Players and teams can really go at each other behind closed doors. Further, I don't begrudge a player for taking the best deal for himself. I may not like his departure but I respect taking the best choice to earn money in a sport that you traumatize your body and mind.

What does that have to do with after he left, though? The Patriots and Patriot Nation were damn good to WW. Acting like a jerk after leaving left me thinking Eff Yew......but that's just me.

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No question after he left WW said some things toward BB that seemed a little chided and caddy. They weren't horrific though. Ty Law and Sey also left on somewhat bad terms but yet they seemed to have mended fences with the team.

I really think WW was cut deeply when the Pats moved on. It was his own fault IMO.

Time can heal all wounds. Let's hope that happens here.

Would I take a look at Wes Welker, 2015?

nO (thank you)

robertweathers said:

No question after he left WW said some things toward BB that seemed a little chided and caddy. They weren't horrific though. Ty Law and Sey also left on somewhat bad terms but yet they seemed to have mended fences with the team.

I really think WW was cut deeply when the Pats moved on. It was his own fault IMO.

Time can heal all wounds. Let's hope that happens here.

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I think that is a fair point. I'd reemphasize that we don't know everything that went down behind closed doors so WW's state of mind is an unknown. Maybe he was really hurt and people can lash out because of it.

But I tell ya the breakups of the others and with WW seemed different. Those other guys comments, while some were definitely harsh, seemed all business rancor to me. With WW it seemed more personal... directed at BB. And ultimately what WW failed to remember is an attack on BB is an attack on Patriot Nation (well to a majority of us) just as if he was attacking Brady. Just really really bad thinking, or not thinking at all, on Wes' part after leaving IMHO. Side note: While attacking BB may get you a few splashes on the front page, I suspect most of the NFL GMs and coaches would look at harsh comments at BB as a negative on the player (another thing I don't think WW realized). Not that it would keep it from getting a job per se but something that would raise a red flag that he would trash the guy who believed in him and the guy who has been more successful than almost any other coach.

Lots of drama ... in the end it's mostly business most of the time.
We have had exceptions here ... we should not always expect them.
If Belichick is free to dump them then they should be free to dump us.
In the end we ended up fine without Welker and hopefully he ends up in our HOF.

On a side note I notice that as a group ...
The TE's that leave us have done well for themselves and we have not missed them.
The QB's that have left us have made a decent living for themselves (well done) ... little field success.
Not so much for the other positions (as a group) in terms of done well.

robertweathers said:

OK. WW sucked here.

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Ummm, I never said that he sucked, just that he's not in the same league as Wilfork, either as a player or a Patriot.

I did not want him here before he left, I felt he should have retired before his last year with the Patriots. Too many head hits.

Also, this just in:

Where would he play? What sort of production is he actually going to give you, and is that worthy of a roster spot?

3rd-string punt returner and 3rd-string Slot Receiver. This is what Wes Welker would be, best-case, at this moment.

Guy is burnt toast, I hope that they find a way to treat the long term effects of concussions so he doesn't have dementia at 45

robertweathers said:

No question after he left WW said some things toward BB that seemed a little chided and caddy. They weren't horrific though. Ty Law and Sey also left on somewhat bad terms but yet they seemed to have mended fences with the team.

I really think WW was cut deeply when the Pats moved on. It was his own fault IMO.

Time can heal all wounds. Let's hope that happens here.

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Brandon Spikes also did a magnificent bridge burning job. And he was signed here again in the off season. Sure. He was released again. But that's because he is an absolute idiot when it comes to driving, and should demand free Uber or taxi rides in his next contract. What's important is that he spoke out about how he basically hated it here, and we brought him back anyway.

Not saying that we should sign WW. No one should. He should retire. But hopefully the bridges between WW and the Pats can be repaired, and he, like Moss, can return to the Pats family.

TheBostonStraggler said:

I think that is a fair point. I'd reemphasize that we don't know everything that went down behind closed doors so WW's state of mind is an unknown. Maybe he was really hurt and people can lash out because of it.

But I tell ya the breakups of the others and with WW seemed different. Those other guys comments, while some were definitely harsh, seemed all business rancor to me. With WW it seemed more personal... directed at BB. And ultimately what WW failed to remember is an attack on BB is an attack on Patriot Nation (well to a majority of us) just as if he was attacking Brady. Just really really bad thinking, or not thinking at all, on Wes' part after leaving IMHO. Side note: While attacking BB may get you a few splashes on the front page, I suspect most of the NFL GMs and coaches would look at harsh comments at BB as a negative on the player (another thing I don't think WW realized). Not that it would keep it from getting a job per se but something that would raise a red flag that he would trash the guy who believed in him and the guy who has been more successful than almost any other coach.

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I agree. His comments did have an edge to them. Ty's were a little similar.

Wes did say that he was available and would love to come back to the team. With that said over the past 6 months the team has brought in 235 WRs and Wes has not been called. Personally, I think the team thinks he's done as opposed to harboring some ill will.