Odds of Patriots getting their 2016 PSI draft picks back?

BradyFTW! said:

He won't say anything, because he doesn't have to. Most people believe that Brady cheated. All he has to do is refer people to his appeal decision. Even though it's been struck down in court, he'll maintain that it's legitimate and that no amount of judicial activism will change that. It's up to Kraft to sue for the picks, and he's not going to.

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Here is where I see the fallacy of your argument. I don't believe "most people believe that Brady cheated." That simply assumes that "most people", are flat out stupid and small minded.

Now I believe "most people" or non-Pats fans, would LIKE to believe he's guilty of something, but at this stage no one really believes there was any conspiracy to "deflate" balls. Hell, Bob Kravitz doesn't even believe it now. At this point, I'm sure that most of our opponents fans would like a jet to crash into Gillette if only to get 65000 Pats off the face of the earth, than to get Pats players . But they know Brady didn't do anything.

I'mean, BFTW, how many of the haters you encounter actually believe deflategate happened, and how many are just trolling for Pats fans so see how many they can get a rise out of......really. So in the end Goodell might be able to babble that legal mumbo jumbo and hope there are enough fans jealous enough of the Pats to hate them enough to keep the lynch mob going, But no one is going to believe it. At worst they'll just close their eyes and pretend his breath doesn't stink.

But you are right on one point. If Kraft doesn't do something proactive to get thos picks back......they we aren't going to get them back. but suing isn't his only option....just one

patfanken said:

Here is where I see the fallacy of your argument. I don't believe "most people believe that Brady cheated." That simply assumes that "most people", are flat out stupid and small minded.

Now I believe "most people" or non-Pats fans, would LIKE to believe he's guilty of something, but at this stage no one really believes there was any conspiracy to "deflate" balls.

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I agree and disagree.

I think most people WANT to believe it SO much that they convince themselves that it DID really happened, because it would give an excuse for loss they most likely had to our team, or rather, many losses.

patfanken said:

Here is where I see the fallacy of your argument. I don't believe "most people believe that Brady cheated." That simply assumes that "most people", are flat out stupid and small minded.

Now I believe "most people" or non-Pats fans, would LIKE to believe he's guilty of something, but at this stage no one really believes there was any conspiracy to "deflate" balls. Hell, Bob Kravitz doesn't even believe it now. At this point, I'm sure that most of our opponents fans would like a jet to crash into Gillette if only to get 65000 Pats off the face of the earth, than to get Pats players . But they know Brady didn't do anything.

I'mean, BFTW, how many of the haters you encounter actually believe deflategate happened, and how many are just trolling for Pats fans so see how many they can get a rise out of......really. So in the end Goodell might be able to babble that legal mumbo jumbo and hope there are enough fans jealous enough of the Pats to hate them enough to keep the lynch mob going, But no one is going to believe it. At worst they'll just close their eyes and pretend his breath doesn't stink.

But you are right on one point. If Kraft doesn't do something proactive to get thos picks back......they we aren't going to get them back. but suing isn't his only option....just one

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Fans I come in contact with who root for other teams (Giants, Bills, Dolphins) seem to believe that Brady cheated. The Giants fan in particular told me emphatically that Spygate was about the Pats taping the Rams walkthrough because he heard it on WFAN.

patfanken said:

Here is where I see the fallacy of your argument. I don't believe "most people believe that Brady cheated." That simply assumes that "most people", are flat out stupid and small minded.

Now I believe "most people" or non-Pats fans, would LIKE to believe he's guilty of something, but at this stage no one really believes there was any conspiracy to "deflate" balls. Hell, Bob Kravitz doesn't even believe it now. At this point, I'm sure that most of our opponents fans would like a jet to crash into Gillette if only to get 65000 Pats off the face of the earth, than to get Pats players . But they know Brady didn't do anything.

I'mean, BFTW, how many of the haters you encounter actually believe deflategate happened, and how many are just trolling for Pats fans so see how many they can get a rise out of......really. So in the end Goodell might be able to babble that legal mumbo jumbo and hope there are enough fans jealous enough of the Pats to hate them enough to keep the lynch mob going, But no one is going to believe it. At worst they'll just close their eyes and pretend his breath doesn't stink.

But you are right on one point. If Kraft doesn't do something proactive to get thos picks back......they we aren't going to get them back. but suing isn't his only option....just one

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Get them back as part of a settlement of the defamation action.

Yeah, some on the board claim that there's something in the owners agreement prohibiting lawsuit by owners against the league but I highly doubt a court would find it applicable to intentional tort claims.

YOUGOTMOSSED said:

Get them back as part of a settlement of the defamation action.

Yeah, some on the board claim that there's something in the owners agreement prohibiting lawsuit by owners against the league but I highly doubt a court would find it applicable to intentional tort claims.

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And unfortunately that would have to be a Brady defamation lawsuit and he would have to have that as part of the settlement. IMO. IANAL. IDGAFF.

This video clip provides the precise information to determine the odds of getting the 2016 first round draft pick back.

patfanken said:

Here is where I see the fallacy of your argument. I don't believe "most people believe that Brady cheated." That simply assumes that "most people", are flat out stupid and small minded.

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Sadly, I think this is true. A solid 70% of people are small minded idiots.

patfanken said:

I know its fashionable to think that they are gone.

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It's not "fashionable". It's fact. And Kraft gave them away without a fight.

The picks aren't coming back. They're gone.

YOUGOTMOSSED said:

Get them back as part of a settlement of the defamation action.

Yeah, some on the board claim that there's something in the owners agreement prohibiting lawsuit by owners against the league but I highly doubt a court would find it applicable to intentional tort claims.

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No one's filing a defamation suit either.

Zero

I'd say -0.22 %

kennyb said:

I think he sues and wins.

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Kenny, don't change your number! 867-5309

In the bowels of Madison Ave. this is all part of a nefarious plot to try to slow this franchise down, as it makes no sense for them to discuss parity as long as the Patriots continue to be as successful as they are.. they spread the rumor that the Pats were cheating and their little "follow alongs".. followed along.

There is no chance that the Patriots get these picks back, it does however set a standard for how discipline is handled for other teams..

patfanken said:

Here is where I see the fallacy of your argument. I don't believe "most people believe that Brady cheated." That simply assumes that "most people", are flat out stupid and small minded

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The high majority of the other 31 fanbases certainly believe that something occurred. The amount in which they care may not be at the same level as this summer, or even 2 weeks ago, but it doesn't change the fact that most outside of N. England believe that they cheated in some form. There have been plenty of polls around the country showing this as proof.

What changed everyone's mind in your opinion? The fact that a judge didn't agree with the legalese of the collective bargaining agreement in terms of the process that Goodell used on ONE player? While it may have changed some opinions, it certainly didn't go from just about everyone to zero overnight.

patfanken said:

at this stage no one really believes there was any conspiracy to "deflate" balls.

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Again, this is not true, and is simply wishful thinking on your part. There's nothing even close to correct about your statement that "no one believes that there was any conspiracy to deflate balls."

patfanken said:

But you are right on one point. If Kraft doesn't do something proactive to get thos picks back......they we aren't going to get them back. but suing isn't his only option....just one

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What are these other options that you speak of? The deadline to appeal has long passed, and the NFL found what they deem as proof that Jestremski and McNally were involved in a deflation scheme, hence the punishments to the organization. The only thing that they failed to prove was Tom Brady's knowledge of the scheme.

There is no gray area here. Goodell is not "giving up" this case, nor is he giving back the team punishments. As a matter of fact, they didn't even allow McNally and Jastremski to resume their old roles when they returned. They are banned from handling the balls or participating in many of their former duties.

I would be very interested in hearing your opinion on how you think they may go about getting these picks back.

DarrylS said:

There is no chance that the Patriots get these picks back, it does however set a standard for how discipline is handled for other teams..

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There's no way that Goodell is giving the picks back, and we already know that Kraft missed the window to appeal way back in May, so there's really nothing left. He's obviously not getting fired anytime soon, and even if he somehow did, what new commissioner would want to touch this situation with a ten foot pole? No one. Those picks are long gone.

As far as it setting a standard for how discipline is handled with other teams, we'll have to see. We've already seen the Bills choice to pump in noise swept under the rug, as well as Pittsburgh's "repeat offense" for illegal sideline communications. The NY Jets were given a love tap for the most obvious tampering case in league history, and both the Falcons and Browns were mere afterthoughts which no one thought twice about.

If it's N.England it's a huge deal. If not, no one else gives a damn. There's a definite double standard that's used.

Kraft donated them to the NFL parity and integrity fund. Now what kind of a person asks for their donation back?

I'm going to play the contrarian & say that it is possible, but that the fan base of the Patriots would need to drive the effort, with little help from the Krafts, who have shamelessly sacrificed their own team at the alter of league parity.

The Ray Rice debacle proved that Goodell is completely incompetent and that he is overly concerned with public perception. He seems to be particularly concerned about how he is perceived by the national media based in & around New York (Mike & Mike, Peter King, etc). To this day, I believe Spygate blew up because Mike Greenberg is a Jets homer and did everything possible to keep the issue in the news, but I digress.

Funny thing is that most of the national media, Greenberg included, is sympathetic to the Patriots on Framegate & is skeptical that the Patriots did anything nefarious. Once the NFL begins publishing PSI data from cold weather games, we (the fans) need to push the national media into shaming Goodell into giving the picks back. This is the only way.

By the way, I would not be surprised if the the NFL attempts to put out inaccurate PSI information. This would be a huge mistake by the league, as the truth will eventually come out & Goodell and his cronies will pay a huge price. I would gladly sacrifice the picks to get rid of the red headed stepchild.

Ice_Ice_Brady said:

Odds of Jessica Alba returning my phone calls?

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Wait you have her number??? Please share!

Odds of the Jets winning a Super Bowl?

Jackson 2 said:

Since I believe the picks are gone forever, what I would really love to see happen is this: Pats win the SB and trade for the first pick in the second round which would have been our first round pick if DG had never occurred.

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I am expecting Belichick to somehow end up with at least a top 10 pick in the 2nd round ... which is close.