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Frontline Report on Football and CTE injuries


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Aargh! I knew it would be bad, just not that bad.
 
This is a serious problem but I think the frontline stats may be on the high side. Of those brains that were donated, those players probably were already suffering from head injuries and the study confirmed it was CTE.
 
Just getting to the end of the Frontline League of Denial episode and see Ted Wells walking about smiling as his firm represents the NFL in the CTE case. At 1:47:35 of the video. What a ****.
 
This is a serious problem but I think the frontline stats may be on the high side. Of those brains that were donated, those players probably were already suffering from head injuries and the study confirmed it was CTE.

There's definitely some selection bias inherent in the process, so it's fair to say that this isn't a representative sample. It's still an incredibly alarming number, though. There's definitely more research needed into what precisely causes CTE, but it's pretty clear that the NFL doesn't want that research to happen. The costs are too high if it reaches the conclusions that I think we all expect it will reach.
 
There's definitely some selection bias inherent in the process, so it's fair to say that this isn't a representative sample. It's still an incredibly alarming number, though. There's definitely more research needed into what precisely causes CTE, but it's pretty clear that the NFL doesn't want that research to happen. The costs are too high if it reaches the conclusions that I think we all expect it will reach.

Actually, they are taking all comers. The numbers are staggering. The thing that is scary is that you won't get this from playing in the NFL, you will get this before you even make it to the NFL.
 
Actually, they are taking all comers. The numbers are staggering. The thing that is scary is that you won't get this from playing in the NFL, you will get this before you even make it to the NFL.

I remember back some 10 years ago when ESPN did a huge story on Concussions in the NFL and how one Dentist was trying to prevent them with a specially developed mouth guard.. I don't remember for certain, but I believe the league prevented the dentist from doing wide spread distribution of said mouthguard.

During that report, they also stated that there was no way to test for CTE while the patient was living. I don't know if that has changed or not..
 
The sad part is how the NFL is promoting this Heads Up Football program to mothers and children. I know this has been posted before but here's Madden's take on it:

“I’m a firm believer that there’s no way that a six-year-old should have a helmet on and learn a tackling drill,” Madden said. “There’s no way. Or a seven-year-old or an eight-year-old. They’re not ready for it. Take the helmets off kids. . . . Start at six years old, seven years old, eight years old, nine years old. They don’t need a helmet. They can play flag football. And with flag football you can get all the techniques. Why do we have to start with a six-year-old who was just potty trained a year ago and put a helmet on him and tackle? . . . We’ll eventually get to tackling.”
It's even better to see Roger squirm while he's saying it

 
Actually, they are taking all comers. The numbers are staggering. The thing that is scary is that you won't get this from playing in the NFL, you will get this before you even make it to the NFL.

Any activity in which you sustain multiple blows to the head can cause CTE. That includes Boxing, Hockey, Rugby, and Soccer..
 
Like I've been saying ever since I saw the Frontline special….enjoy football while it lasts because its days are numbered.
 
Just getting to the end of the Frontline League of Denial episode and see Ted Wells walking about smiling as his firm represents the NFL in the CTE case. At 1:47:35 of the video. What a ****.
That's "Completely Independent Investigator Ted Wells" to you, pal!
 
It's even better to see Roger squirm while he's saying it



God bless John Madden. That was priceless.

Roger Goodell gets paid huge $$$ to do the bidding of the Billionaire Boys Club. The job description is to lie through your teeth whenever the truth threatens to come between the owners and (even more) money. It turns out that Roger is a born liar who will be a first ballot indutee into the Prevarication Hall of Fame, the entrance to which is just before the Gates of Hell.
 
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If you haven't seen the frontline story watch it http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/league-of-denial/

If I were Stork I would retire. I played and have had a few concussions in my life. My last one was a year ago when I hit my head on a low door frame. The more you have the easier you get them. My son did not play even though the coaches begged him to, I never forbade him but I never encouraged him and am glad he did not. I may have stopped him if he wanted to play. One of his friends had concussion problems with hockey and now he is a 20 year old kid with problems.

This will spell the end as we know it at some point. Australian rules football is a good substitute.

Football is like heavyweight boxing in the 80s.
Here is MY problem with the CTE report and your comments. I would accept that in this era when players are so extraordinarily big and fast that the kinds of collisions you'd expect to see, could very well cause CTE, especially for players who play over several years and have lots of these extreme collisions. I think an important question to ask about these brains would be, how many years did they play NFL ball?

Here is my problem with your comments. You used these facts out of context to influence your actions with your son, and I believe robbed him of a very valuable experience. I wonder if they took the brains of men who just played HS AND college football, what the percentage of CTE you'd find. You'd expect that % to be much lower. What about 80 guys who JUST played in HS, You'd think the % would be much lower than that.

No question, the kind of collisions you are exposed to in the NFL ARE a risk. But a risk you are getting very well paid for. Much more in fact than other occupations that carry a similar health risk. But I cry out for the risk rewards ratio of the HS game. Given the relative size and speed differences, HS football doesn't pose nearly the risk that would be worth NOT getting the valuable experience and life lessons the game of football can offer. If you played HS ball, you should know how valuable they were,

I coached high level HS ball for close to 20 years as an assistant and HC. I was also a great teacher as well. But I never could teach the kind of life lessons that live with you forever in the class room that I could on the field. It's the lesson of the value of teamwork. It's the lesson of overcoming adversity. It's the lesson that the sum is always greater than the individual parts. It's the lesson of how to overcome fear, pain, and other people's expectations. It's the lesson of perseverance. It's the lesson of growing and getting better, both physically and emotionally. Its the lesson of getting knocked down and and getting up again Not only that, I got to be with most of those kids 3 or 4 years, not just the one you get as a classroom teacher.

On my best days as a classroom teacher I could impart some information (History) I could get a few to recognize what has happened in the past has a direct impact on the present and future. I could help improve and encourage reading and memorization skills. I could help teach them HOW to learn, and hopefully inspire them to want to know more.....about anything. And do it all without the internet and Google. ;) But that is hard to do in just 40 minutes a day (at best) and less than 10 months to do it.

As a coach I would get them for close to 3 hours a day, for almost 4 months and created a connection that lasted the rest of the year regardless of what other sports or activities they participated in. You had a direct influence on these kids all year round. That's why if a football player screwed up somehow, even if was April, YOU were the one the administration or other teachers would come looking for to straighten it out.

Well, Dr Pain, I've gone one of my long winded rants. Sorry about that., The bottom line is I would suggest that you put that Frontline report in context. I would suggest that you revisit your fears of letting your son play, and put them into the context of the HS arena vs the NFL arena where the risk of CTE are MUCH much higher. Keep this in mind. Very soon you are going to give your son the keys to the car, where he is in MUCH greater risk of head injury than he ever is going to be on the football field. If you were to be completely consistent, you'd never let him drive, or even get into a care with another teen driver, if you are going to discourage him from playing even indirectly. n JMHO

....and I'm done. ;)
 
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Need to get rid of the hard plastic pads and replace them with foam ones and swap out the helmets for rugby style scrum caps or nothing at all.

The current materials used make the "padding" a weapon, as already stated.
 
Quite simply, trashing Wells and Exponent can't be allowed because of the CTE suit/PR alone. It helps explain the NFL position on Brady "must" accept the results of the Wells "report' in any settlement. Brady has leverage if he chooses to use it. Using Wells and Exponent in the Deflategate fiasco is a massive mistake in judgement.

It is also a terrific subject for a real investigative journalist to follow up on (under the heading of CTE).
 
Here is MY problem with the CTE report and your comments. I would accept that in this era when players are so extraordinarily big and fast that the kinds of collisions you'd expect to see, could very well cause CTE, especially for players who play over several years and have lots of these extreme collisions. I think an important question to ask about these brains would be, how many years did they play NFL ball?

Here is my problem with your comments. You used these facts out of context to influence your actions with your son, and I believe robbed him of a very valuable experience. I wonder if they took the brains of men who just played HS AND college football, what the percentage of CTE you'd find. You'd expect that % to be much lower. What about 80 guys who JUST played in HS, You'd think the % would be much lower than that.

No question, the kind of collisions you are exposed to in the NFL ARE a risk. But a risk you are getting very well paid for. Much more in fact than other occupations that carry a similar health risk. But I cry out for the risk rewards ratio of the HS game. Given the relative size and speed differences, HS football doesn't pose nearly the risk that would be worth NOT getting the valuable experience and life lessons the game of football can offer. If you played HS ball, you should know how valuable they were,

I coached high level HS ball for close to 20 years as an assistant and HC. I was also a great teacher as well. But I never could teach the kind of life lessons that live with you forever in the class room that I could on the field. It's the lesson of the value of teamwork. It's the lesson of overcoming adversity. It's the lesson that the sum is always greater than the individual parts. It's the lesson of how to overcome fear, pain, and other people's expectations. It's the lesson of perseverance. It's the lesson of growing and getting better, both physically and emotionally. Its the lesson of getting knocked down and and getting up again Not only that, I got to be with most of those kids 3 or 4 years, not just the one you get as a classroom teacher.

On my best days as a classroom teacher I could impart some information (History) I could get a few to recognize what has happened in the past has a direct impact on the present and future. I could help improve and encourage reading and memorization skills. I could help teach them HOW to learn, and hopefully inspire them to want to know more.....about anything. And do it all without the internet and Google. ;) But that is hard to do in just 40 minutes a day (at best) and less than 10 months to do it.

As a coach I would get them for close to 3 hours a day, for almost 4 months and created a connection that lasted the rest of the year regardless of what other sports or activities they participated in. You had a direct influence on these kids all year round. That's why if a football player screwed up somehow, even if was April, YOU were the one the administration or other teachers would come looking for to straighten it out.

Well, Dr Pain, I've gone one of my long winded rants. Sorry about that., The bottom line is I would suggest that you put that Frontline report in context. I would suggest that you revisit your fears of letting your son play, and put them into the context of the HS arena vs the NFL arena where the risk of CTE are MUCH much higher. Keep this in mind. Very soon you are going to give your son the keys to the car, where he is in MUCH greater risk of head injury than he ever is going to be on the football field. If you were to be completely consistent, you'd never let him drive, or even get into a care with another teen driver, if you are going to discourage him from playing even indirectly. n JMHO

....and I'm done. ;)
The problem with testing college and high school brains is you have to wait until they're dead to do so. Seeing the 18 year old high school football player who had CTE in the Frontline episode was jarring. I don't know if they'll ever come up with a way to test for CTE while someone is alive but I hope they do. You're not getting the answers to those questions, as the nfl hopes, until that is done. Until then, the sample size is going to remain quite small.
 
Here is MY problem with the CTE report and your comments. I would accept that in this era when players are so extraordinarily big and fast that the kinds of collisions you'd expect to see, could very well cause CTE, especially for players who play over several years and have lots of these extreme collisions. I think an important question to ask about these brains would be, how many years did they play NFL ball?

Here is my problem with your comments. You used these facts out of context to influence your actions with your son, and I believe robbed him of a very valuable experience. I wonder if they took the brains of men who just played HS AND college football, what the percentage of CTE you'd find. You'd expect that % to be much lower. What about 80 guys who JUST played in HS, You'd think the % would be much lower than that.

No question, the kind of collisions you are exposed to in the NFL ARE a risk. But a risk you are getting very well paid for. Much more in fact than other occupations that carry a similar health risk. But I cry out for the risk rewards ratio of the HS game. Given the relative size and speed differences, HS football doesn't pose nearly the risk that would be worth NOT getting the valuable experience and life lessons the game of football can offer. If you played HS ball, you should know how valuable they were,

I coached high level HS ball for close to 20 years as an assistant and HC. I was also a great teacher as well. But I never could teach the kind of life lessons that live with you forever in the class room that I could on the field. It's the lesson of the value of teamwork. It's the lesson of overcoming adversity. It's the lesson that the sum is always greater than the individual parts. It's the lesson of how to overcome fear, pain, and other people's expectations. It's the lesson of perseverance. It's the lesson of growing and getting better, both physically and emotionally. Its the lesson of getting knocked down and and getting up again Not only that, I got to be with most of those kids 3 or 4 years, not just the one you get as a classroom teacher.

On my best days as a classroom teacher I could impart some information (History) I could get a few to recognize what has happened in the past has a direct impact on the present and future. I could help improve and encourage reading and memorization skills. I could help teach them HOW to learn, and hopefully inspire them to want to know more.....about anything. And do it all without the internet and Google. ;) But that is hard to do in just 40 minutes a day (at best) and less than 10 months to do it.

As a coach I would get them for close to 3 hours a day, for almost 4 months and created a connection that lasted the rest of the year regardless of what other sports or activities they participated in. You had a direct influence on these kids all year round. That's why if a football player screwed up somehow, even if was April, YOU were the one the administration or other teachers would come looking for to straighten it out.

Well, Dr Pain, I've gone one of my long winded rants. Sorry about that., The bottom line is I would suggest that you put that Frontline report in context. I would suggest that you revisit your fears of letting your son play, and put them into the context of the HS arena vs the NFL arena where the risk of CTE are MUCH much higher. Keep this in mind. Very soon you are going to give your son the keys to the car, where he is in MUCH greater risk of head injury than he ever is going to be on the football field. If you were to be completely consistent, you'd never let him drive, or even get into a care with another teen driver, if you are going to discourage him from playing even indirectly. n JMHO

....and I'm done. ;)
I don't doubt the social growth resulting from participating on a well coached team in any sport. However, consider the impact of head trauma on youths whose growth is not yet complete coupled with medical resources significantly inferior to what is available to the pros. Granted, we have no hard numbers, but now that we know of the risk, who wants their kid to be the guinea pig? There are other sports and activities that yield the social benefits of team sports participation.
 
The sad part is how the NFL is promoting this Heads Up Football program to mothers and children. I know this has been posted before but here's Madden's take on it:

“I’m a firm believer that there’s no way that a six-year-old should have a helmet on and learn a tackling drill,” Madden said. “There’s no way. Or a seven-year-old or an eight-year-old. They’re not ready for it. Take the helmets off kids. . . . Start at six years old, seven years old, eight years old, nine years old. They don’t need a helmet. They can play flag football. And with flag football you can get all the techniques. Why do we have to start with a six-year-old who was just potty trained a year ago and put a helmet on him and tackle? . . . We’ll eventually get to tackling.”
I think the heads up football program is needed even in the older groups. There's so many ****ty tacklers that go head first into tackles, and then sit there 30 years later with CTE problems. When people learn to tackle, they should learn to do it properly. And children shouldn't start tackling at age 6 or something like that. Give them a helmet after 10, or whatever age is good. Then really focus on proper tackling and not going in head first. Even at that age I think it's important for parents that their kids learn to tackle in a way that reduces concussions by a lot, or so I hope.
 
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