Florio: Judge Berman put a poison pill in his ruling

Bobsyouruncle said:

Too bad he didn't put a poison pill in Goodell's drink also.

Click to expand...

BradyFTW! said:

I don't think they can, to be honest. Stakes are too high. Losing god-emperor commissioner powers in the court that they claim should preside over all arbitration issues is too big a loss for the NFL. Even if they know they're 95% likely to lose, they have to see the appeal process through, because losing is tantamoun to a major CBA concession without getting anything back in exchange.

Click to expand...

In addition to a lawyer who actually knows what law is, the NFL needs an Economist to explain to them the concept of "Sunk Costs".

Hoodie said:

Maybe they'll force Benjamin Brady to sit out 4 games.

Click to expand...

We laugh, but this is something that Goodell would seriously consider.

He made Terrelle Pryor sit out NFL games because of an NCAA penalty he would have faced if he returned to college. He didn't break any NFL rules, but Goodell thought he should punish him anyway. Jim Tressel had to do the same thing when he got a job with the Colts.

FrodoBagginz said:

Click to expand...

I have a new respect for the law... Words cannot describe how awesome this is

Koma said:

We laugh, but this is something that Goodell would seriously consider.

He made Terrelle Pryor sit out NFL games because of an NCAA penalty he would have faced if he returned to college. He didn't break any NFL rules, but Goodell thought he should punish him anyway. Jim Tressel had to do the same thing when he got a job with the Colts.

Click to expand...

If Goodell tries to do this to Brady after today's ruling, Brady will get an immediate injunction and the league will get destroyed in court so hard that it will be entertaining to see. I honestly hope Goodell tries, because the fallout would be so hilarious.

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 2h2 hours ago
NFLPA lawyer Jeffrey Kessler is scheduled to join PFT Live tomorrow at 12:35 p.m. ET.

SVN said:

ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk 2h2 hours ago
NFLPA lawyer Jeffrey Kessler is scheduled to join PFT Live tomorrow at 12:35 p.m. ET.

Click to expand...

Well that just became must-DVR TV.

In the main thread on the ruling earlier today, some poster noted the same thing about the unresolved issues that Berman could and would consider if the case returned to him.....

I hope the owners remember the DECADES of calm under commissioners Bert Bell, Pete Rozelle, Paul Taglibue. Then compare it to now and think: "Wasn't this what other sports did?" At that point, Goodell should be done.

Rob0729 said:

According to Florio, Judge Berman didn't rule on several of Brady's arguments just in case the NFL wins the appeal. Then it woud go back to Berman and he could rule on those issues and then send the NFL back in the appeals process. This could tie this up in court for years.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...ans-ruling-may-contain-a-warning-for-the-nfl/

Click to expand...

Here's to hoping Bob Kraft swallows that poison pill in his sleep soon.

If a case is remanded by an appellate court, does that mean that hearings will be retried by the same judge who made the initial ruling ?

BradyFTW! said:

I don't think they can, to be honest. Stakes are too high. Losing god-emperor commissioner powers in the court that they claim should preside over all arbitration issues is too big a loss for the NFL. Even if they know they're 95% likely to lose, they have to see the appeal process through, because losing is tantamoun to a major CBA concession without getting anything back in exchange.

Click to expand...

Spot on BFTW. IMHO Goodell could not politically afford to falter in his stance. He invested so much political capital that it would be risky to even be seen meeting Brady half way with a settlement offer. Consider the absurd 'Brady has to admit guilt and accept all but full punishment' requirement. It's such a stupid and counterproductive stipulation given the uncertainty and negativity circling the whole delfategate fiasco that the motivation can be for one reason only: Goodell believes even the hint of him being seen as backing down would be damaging to him. He perceives this to be about stature and/or occupation stability and/or money&power ...... and sees some level of softening of those things if he displays weakness/falters.

Credit this to Goodell and his band of crumbs. They tried to adapt to their past losses with new tactics (I assume they did not think this new tactic up overnight -- this has been in discussion since their last loss). Goodell gave appearance that his underlings "performed" the discipline tasks/decisions, then he himself arbitrates any appeal. Simple, neat, CBA allows it to be done, and it rids the league of those pesky neutral arbitrators/third parties that have been resulting in embarrassment and/or losses. They also called out the media lapdogs in a much much more coordinated and effective way. Additionally they went on the offensive on the legal side by filing a preemptive case in their court of choice (and simply asking for their new tactic to be validated).
Bottom line: I think this was Goodell's new master strategy to rid himself as much as possible of embarrassment and losses at the hands of outsiders. Wouldn't surprise me at all if these dolts started considering how to apply/test the new plans to 'deflategate' before Slimy Wells had done his sham job. Yet consider what faulty plan creation and execution means for a leader who predicates himself on all powerful? For a leader like that it is one tough pill to swallow by itself. But it also gets underlings to begin having doubts, peers to have doubts, and embolden adversaries to think you are beatable.

TheBostonStraggler said:

Spot on BFTW. IMHO Goodell could not politically afford to falter in his stance. He invested so much political capital that it would be risky to even be seen meeting Brady half way with a settlement offer. Consider the absurd 'Brady has to admit guilt and accept all but full punishment' requirement. It's such a stupid and counterproductive stipulation given the uncertainty and negativity circling the whole delfategate fiasco that the motivation can be for one reason only: Goodell believes even the hint of him being seen as backing down would be damaging to him. He perceives this to be about stature and/or occupation stability and/or money&power ...... and sees some level of softening of those things if he displays weakness/falters.

Credit this to Goodell and his band of crumbs. They tried to adapt to their past losses with new tactics (I assume they did not think this new tactic up overnight -- this has been in discussion since their last loss). Goodell gave appearance that his underlings "performed" the discipline tasks/decisions, then he himself arbitrates any appeal. Simple, neat, CBA allows it to be done, and it rids the league of those pesky neutral arbitrators/third parties that have been resulting in embarrassment and/or losses. They also called out the media lapdogs in a much much more coordinated and effective way. Additionally they went on the offensive on the legal side by filing a preemptive case in their court of choice (and simply asking for their new tactic to be validated).
Bottom line: I think this was Goodell's new master strategy to rid himself as much as possible of embarrassment and losses at the hands of outsiders. Wouldn't surprise me at all if these dolts started considering how to apply/test the new plans to 'deflategate' before Slimy Wells had done his sham job. Yet consider what faulty plan creation and execution means for a leader who predicates himself on all powerful? For a leader like that it is one tough pill to swallow by itself. But it also gets underlings to begin having doubts, peers to have doubts, and embolden adversaries to think you are beatable.

Click to expand...

And yet it never occurred to them that Goodell alone has the authority to punish players for conduct detrimental. Once Kessler pointed that out, within a day or so of the punishment being handed down, the entire "my underlings are ruling so that I can be arbitrator" sham fell apart.

BradyFTW! said:

I wasn't sold on 46, but since he actually quote the contents of Article 46 against the NFL... now I kinda am. Will probably wait until I'm more sober than I am now to pull the trigger, but this is the biggest no-brainer since I bought my last Brady jersey.

Click to expand...

Or have the name be "Article" and the #46....

BradyFTW! said:

And yet it never occurred to them that Goodell alone has the authority to punish players for conduct detrimental. Once Kessler pointed that out, within a day or so of the punishment being handed down, the entire "my underlings are ruling so that I can be arbitrator" sham fell apart.

Click to expand...

HA! Great point (can't believe I missed it in my own post). They trotted out the new battle plan then on that particular tangent said "oh ****, what were we thinking?" and changed right back to the old plan.
When you consider it from that angle it is pretty unbelievable. The commissioner of the mighty NFL doesn't have enough sense/advising to see where their own plan is unquestionably wrong and not unusable. A mistake that glaring makes me think the corporate culture in the NFL office is 'yes men' with a dose of paranoia. It would certainly help explain their seeming and almost inexplicable lack of introspection on this point and the whole fiasco.

Ummmm where can i order the Berman jersey?

TheBostonStraggler said:

HA! Great point (can't believe I missed it in my own post). They trotted out the new battle plan then on that particular tangent said "oh ****, what were we thinking?" and changed right back to the old plan.
When you consider it from that angle it is pretty unbelievable. The commissioner of the mighty NFL doesn't have enough sense/advising to see where their own plan is unquestionably wrong and not unusable. A mistake that glaring makes me think the corporate culture in the NFL office is 'yes men' with a dose of paranoia. It would certainly help explain their seeming and almost inexplicable lack of introspection on this point and the whole fiasco.

Click to expand...

It's the Peter principle in action. Goodell himself is a fantastic example of it. The man was born to be middle management. Just some random stooge wielding arbitrary authority with no real vision or skill in order to keep his department in line. It's the role he was born to play, yet he got that one more promotion that herded him directly to his level of incompetence.

And if there's one rule of management, it's that A people hire A/B people, B people hire C people, C people hire D people, etc. right on down the line. Goodell is the poster example of a D person. He's so bad at his job that if you filled a hat with the names of people who had the base, minimum qualifications for the job, the name you picked out would probably do it better. And as a D person, nobody should be surprised that he hired a bunch of Fs. People like Goodell are too insecure and paranoid to hire genuinely talented people around them.

You know? I think I'm starting to come around with this view. If what Florio says is true, then even in the worst case scenario, Berman will still have grounds to nullify the suspension.

That said, assuming the appellate judge do not overturn the ruling, and if the case is remanded, will it be given to Berman a second time or assigned to a different judge?

I hesitate to post this because it's going to burst the bubble of this thread, but those three points that Berman threw out at the end are not a poison pill. The last thing Berman wants is for this case to be remanded to him. Trust me on that. He threw out those three points because they were the weakest parts of the case for Brady, and in particular, the first point deals with factual findings which he is not allowed to make and would have been reversed perhaps if he had.