POINT TWO THREE!!!!! 8/30: Curran Sums Up THE Single Most Important Point

All the data and testimony and common sense, even the wells report, supports that the pats did nothing wrong. The only thing that supports it is what the nfl thinks we did.

raduray said:

Neither the field temperature nor the locker room temperature were measured. The Wells report made assumptions about those temperatures. If the actual locker room temp was 2 degrees higher and the field temp 2 degrees lower than the Wells assumptions, that .2 PSI difference would be explained by the IGL.

Additionally, given that the balls were wet, you wouldn't even need a full 2 degree difference from the assumptions - however, the impact of wet balls is harder/impossible to predict analytically and would require controlled experiments.

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Or, just look at when each set of balls were measured. The Pats balls were measured first. The Colts balls were measured at the end of half-time (why else would they have run out of time?) The report treats all the balls as being measured during the first second of half-time.

shmessy said:

"Roger Sucks"? Ooh, Patriots fans don't like Roger? That won't make a ripple.

"Point Two Three" concisely gets out the one cogent point that sinks Deflategate. If the stadium soundtrack is that chant, I guarantee you the NBC Halftime show centers around it - - with contributions from Florio, King and Rodney Harrison.

This is Patriots fans best national opportunity. Don't blow it on a generic "Roger sucks" chant.

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Whatever you guys decide I'm with you. It's time to fight back.

If I decide to make a sign should it be "POINT TWO THREE" or ".23"?

The only balls that were tampered with were the balls that were stolen by one of the NYJFL employees. I understand why that thief was fired, but I'm still trying to figure out why the Pats employees suffered the same fate.

1960Pats said:

The only balls that were tampered with were the balls that were stolen by one of the NYJFL employees. I understand why that thief was fired, but I'm still trying to figure out why the Pats employees suffered the same fate.

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Strange how that scandal - NFL Employee Stealing Game Balls Intended for Charity - got completely swept under the rug. No investigation, who else was "generally aware" of this, who else benefited? WOuld not surprise me if there were folks in the front office making money off of this.

A "Who's Scott Mill-er" chant would be pretty effective also.

So you want us to make signs referencing the length of Goodells penis?


Pretty clever. Count me in, but why did you decide to go metric?

Should the chant be MICRO PHALLUS clap clap clap MICRO PHALLUS clap clap clap..........?


On a side note I took my dad for a drive yesterday and we decided to swing by Rog and Janes little bungalow by the sea for a cup of tea and some polite Patriots talk but alas we weren't allowed to go down to the shack. What an arrogant f.ckwad, does he know who my dad is???????

RunAmok said:

Strange how that scandal - NFL Employee Stealing Game Balls Intended for Charity - got completely swept under the rug. No investigation, who else was "generally aware" of this, who else benefited? WOuld not surprise me if there were folks in the front office making money off of this.

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Actually, Goodell had to be more aware of Scott Miller than Brady could have been about any perhaps deflating. Miller had been previously reprimanded for pulling the same crime and was given a second chance to do it again.

shmessy said:

Actually, Goodell had to be more aware of Scott Miller than Brady could have been about any perhaps deflating. Miller had been previously reprimanded for pulling the same crime and was given a second chance to do it again.

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That's because he was only stealing balls intended for charity, he deserved a second chance.

Palm Beach Pats Fan said:

Those measurements were not taken by the Colts, they were taken by an NFL official, who borrowed the Patriots (JJ's) gauge to make the measurements. The Colts had indeed measured it once, but then the ball was confiscated

Page 70 of Wells Report
The pressure of the Patriots ball that had been intercepted by the Colts was separately tested three times and the measurements—11.45, 11.35 and 11.75 psi, respectively— were written on athletic tape that had been placed on the ball for identification. League personnel retained possession of the intercepted ball and it was not reintroduced to the game after halftime.

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Which also, of course, demonstrates conclusively the level of accuracy of those gauges. Measuring the same ball three times with results .40 psi apart documents a sample of the margin of error. Given this level of variation, three samples is not adequate. Margin of error could well be greater. Forget the actual numbers for a moment, and focus on the variation.

That suggests that a 0.23 difference is less than the anticipated margin of error for a test conducted under these circumstances, with no control, no benchmark, no established process.

That would not be acceptable for the scale at my supermarket's deli.

Ivan said:

That's because he was only stealing balls intended for charity, he deserved a second chance.

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I get the joke, but need to still make the point.

What Scott Miller did was a federal tax crime. And Goodell was complicit.

Roger Goodell, Jeff Pash and the other good folks in the NFL offices were "more probably than not, at least generally aware" of this man's previous crimes - for which they had previously reprimanded him. Yet they STILL placed him on that sideline that fateful evening. THIS is a FAR bigger issue than any football air pressure.

Chant #2:

"Who's Scott Mill - er????" Clap-Clap-ClapClapClap

"Who's Scott Mill - er????" Clap-Clap-ClapClapClap

"Who's Scott Mill - er????" Clap-Clap-ClapClapClap

and guess what...the only thing left in my 9 year tirade against Roger Goodell is his indictment IN FEDERAL COURT...I don't care what the charges are...just get this arrogant pinhead in a REAL court of law...I want to see him grovel like the little rich kid moron punk he is inside.

This chart shows graphically the results of the gauge the referee testified he used.
It notes the actual result, and the margin of error based on the three tests of one ball. The box shows the Wells report Ideal Gas Law estimate of the expected range.
Six balls fall within the expected range. Two are below; three are above.

Just a thought that might expand the discussion a bit. We've exhausted the topic of whether Brady or the Pats did anything at the AFCCG. We've pretty much conclusively showed that nothing did happen and the NFL's prosecution of Brady and the Pats is a flat out fraud. So rather than continue to express outrage (and I've had more than my share ); now is the time to explore the bigger question which is soon to be asked more often (and its started already to some degree).

What has been the motivation.for the NFL to continue to press on SO strongly with a losing case, knowing full well that Brady was innocent very early on in the process???? I've seen a few answers offered, among them being:

1. Owners pressuring Goodell to take the Pats down to ensure parity,

2. A botched sting by Pats haters close to Goodell, that they tried to cover up, and were forced into an entrenched position to protect themselves

3. Goodell trying to reinforce his position as unassailable judge, jury, and executioner in all thing punishment related.

4. Goodell's attempt to evade the negative glare of the Ray Rice fiasco, by turning the spotlight on something most of the country would rally around......the taking down of the Patriots.

It's only a matter of time now before the enormity of the league office's fraud is known. A Tom Brady defamation case will ensure it, but even without it, the tide has turned.at least on the issue of whether Brady was railroaded by the NFL. So I have to ask again. WHY? Some of the possibilities have been mentioned, but few have been really explored. It all seems so self destructive to me. It's like a junkie knowing that if he doesn't stop it will kill him, and can't help himself.

Just a thought.

Joker said:

and guess what...the only thing left in my 9 year tirade against Roger Goodell is his indictment IN FEDERAL COURT...I don't care what the charges are...just get this arrogant pinhead in a REAL court of law...I want to see him grovel like the little rich kid moron punk he is inside.

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It doesn't have to be that extreme. As much as I'd love to see this descend into actual criminality, it isn't going to happen. HOWEVER, if Tom takes the next step and files the defamation suit, you WILL get to see Roger have to take the stand and explain his actions in open court. You WILL get to see the transcript of his deposition, and you WILL get to see a long line of despicable characters have to take the stand and explain what they've done and be crossed by lawyers with all the evidence they need to prove their case.

1; Brady's image has been damaged and it's cost him a lot of money

2. the Defendants knew in advance their accusations were fallacious and pursued them anyway.

3. The defendants used lies, misinformation, and innuendo, to further damage Brady over the course of several months

4. Despite many opportunities to mitigate the damage, the defendants recklessly carried on their malicious attack.

5. (hopefully after today) The defendants had a federal court Judge excoriate them for their actions.

Now be honest. Wouldn't you want to be the lawyer for Tom Brady looking at getting up to a third of the 9 figure settlement that would have to be made, if you had THAT case on your side. Defamation suits usually are very tough to win, but not when you are going against the clown college over at 354 Park ave.

A re-arbitration is more likely to clear Brady's name than a defamation suit. I don't know how Brady could prove financial damages; his jersey sales have doubled, he hasn't lost his job, and I don't know of any lost endorsement deals. Perhaps another poster with more legal knowledge could talk about suing for non-financial damages and slander.

Any chance a re-arbitration hearing could be public if it goes that route?

memento said:

Any chance a re-arbitration hearing could be public if it goes that route?

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I suppose there's always a change of anything, but I really doubt it.

Any re-arb needs to be something done according to the CBA -- and done right this time. While the judge may constrain who Goodell can choose as arbitrator, I can't imagine he'd take something contracted by both sides to be private and order it to be public.

Angelpats said:

All the data and testimony and common sense, even the wells report, supports that the pats did nothing wrong. The only thing that supports it is what the nfl thinks we did.

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And that is what makes this so stupid and painful. To think that someone would drop 0.2 psi out of a ball is just stupid. This whole thing is stupid and you know that it is a farce but you can't stop it. It is like we are fricken living in Iran.

memento said:

A re-arbitration is more likely to clear Brady's name than a defamation suit. I don't know how Brady could prove financial damages; his jersey sales have doubled, he hasn't lost his job, and I don't know of any lost endorsement deals. Perhaps another poster with more legal knowledge could talk about suing for non-financial damages and slander.

Any chance a re-arbitration hearing could be public if it goes that route?

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I read somewhere that Brady did lose endorsement deals over this. I'm not sure what the MA idiosyncrasies of legal defamation are but with the emails establishing that the Patriots did ask for a retraction of the false statement of the psi measurement (which was ignored), I'd say they have a pretty solid case that it was done with malice.

Ivan said:

That's because he was only stealing balls intended for charity, he deserved a second chance.

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Seems like he stole the Ravens K Ball, the Ravens blamed the Pats, told the Colts and then this all started. All cover up of NFL folks tampering at 2 playoff games.