BB ascending to the top of the ladder among all time coaching greats..

BB may not have the longevity of Halas, Shula or Landry.. but his accomplishments are incredible..

Most playoff wins 22

Highest playoff win percentage 71%(there are a couple of outliers with a couple of wins higher than this)

His winning percentage is .659, right behind Shula, Halas and Paul Brown..

All time number of combined wins(reg season and playoffs) is 233... Shula is at 347, Halas is 324 and Landry is at 270... last year he passed Paul Brown(231) and Curly Lambeau(222)..

BB has been a HC for 20 years compare to Shula 33 years, Halas 40 years and Landry 29 years...

All of this is difficult to compare because of the "era" issue, but it is quite impressive, particularly as no current coach behind him is on a similar trajectory..

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/

Tom Landry wouldn't have survived in today's NFL. He went 0-11-1 in his first season, and didn't produce a winning record until his 7th year. Chuck Noll went 1-13 in his first season, and didn't have a winning season until his 4th year before overseeing an incredible dynasty run of 4 Super Bowls in 6 years. It's an important lesson that coaches also sometimes take time and need time to develop, just as much as players do.

Shula is a ****, and I don't think he would have been as successful in the modern era, but I have to tip my hat to the guy. 33 years as a coach and only 2 of those seasons were losing records. That's incredible no matter what metric you use.

But there's no coach I'd rather have than BB.

DarrylS said:

BB may not have the longevity of Halas, Shula or Landry.. but his accomplishments are incredible..

Most playoff wins 22
Highest playoff win percentage 71%(there are a couple of outliers with a couple of wins higher than this)
His winning percentage is .659, right behind Shula, Halas and Paul Brown..
All time number of combined wins(reg season and playoffs) is 233... Shula is at 347, Halas is 324 and Landry is at 270... last year he passed Paul Brown(231) and Curly Lambeau(222)..
BB has been a HC for 20 years compare to Shula 33 years, Halas 40 years and Landry 29 years...

All of this is difficult to compare because of the "era" issue, but it is quite impressive, particularly as no current coach behind him is on a similar trajectory..

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/

Click to expand...

It's Lombardi, Paul Brown and BB. You can argue that BB is more successful that they are but imo you are splitting hairs at that point.

I'd put Bill Walsh there too but he didn't coach long enough. What an innovator.

Chuck Noll deserves some consideration as well.

All the other coaches you mention are all-timers but are a tick below the top 3.

Ascending? He's already at the top as far as I'm concerned. lol

robertweathers said:

It's Lombardi, Paul Brown and BB. You can argue that BB is more successful that they are but imo you are splitting hairs at that point.

I'd put Bill Walsh there too but he didn't coach long enough. What an innovator.

Chuck Noll deserves some consideration as well.

All the other coaches you mention are all-timers but are a tick below the top 3.

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Do not disagree, but the info that was presented was quantifiable.. at the end of the day for most viewers, the numbers are what they rely on.. subjective stuff can be argued.

My first NFL Favorite team were the Browns in the 50's, and Paul Brown was one of my all time favorites until BB came along..BB modeled a lot of what he does after Brown.

DarrylS said:

Do not disagree, but the info that was presented was quantifiable.. at the end of the day for most viewers, the numbers are what they rely on.. subjective stuff can be argued.

My first NFL Favorite team were the Browns in the 50's, and Paul Brown was one of my all time favorites until BB came along..BB modeled a lot of what he does after Brown.

Click to expand...

I agree. Im being highly subjective.

I think with coaches longevity sometimes doesn't tell the whole story. Lombardi got cancer. Brown left to start his own franchise.

If, if, if....

the math says that in roughly 4 years he in only behing Halas and Shula
In 10-11 years, he would be at the top of the list.
Interesting to contemplate when considering when he might want to retire or not....
And I would guess he's done the math himself among other considerations....

--> Fritz



All time number of combined wins(reg season and playoffs) is 233... Shula is at 347, Halas is 324 and Landry is at 270... last year he passed Paul Brown(231) and Curly Lambeau(222)..

BB is already at the top and still going up even as the NYJFL hobbles him at every opportunity. And he's pulling up the ladder behind him. No one in the modern parity regime will ever match him.

This is sports, so winning should trump everything. No one has won like BB, so that should put him at the start of any conversation for greatness.

Allow me to play devil's advocate, though. I don't think BB quite has the reputation for innovation that guys like Walsh and Brown do. Those guys changed the game in very obvious, tangible ways, and they have coaching trees that were very fruitful.

Maybe more than anyone else, BB's legacy is also defined by a single player: Tom Brady. How much credit does BB, a defensive coach who had shown little previous talent for offensive game planning, get for making Brady what he is? Most of the greats have piles of HOFers that they drafted, developed, seasoned. As a HC, who but Brady does BB have to hang his hat on? Richard Seymour? Gronk, another offensive player? I guess that could maybe be to his credit. Doing more with less and all that.

People forget that BB has coached 7 whole seasons without Brady. He has a sub .500 record and a single playoff appearance to show for it.

You can't argue with 4 SBs, a winning percentage over .700, and 22 postseason wins, though.

DarrylS said:

BB may not have the longevity of Halas, Shula or Landry.. but his accomplishments are incredible..

Most playoff wins 22

Highest playoff win percentage 71%(there are a couple of outliers with a couple of wins higher than this)

His winning percentage is .659, right behind Shula, Halas and Paul Brown..

All time number of combined wins(reg season and playoffs) is 233... Shula is at 347, Halas is 324 and Landry is at 270... last year he passed Paul Brown(231) and Curly Lambeau(222)..

BB has been a HC for 20 years compare to Shula 33 years, Halas 40 years and Landry 29 years...

All of this is difficult to compare because of the "era" issue, but it is quite impressive, particularly as no current coach behind him is on a similar trajectory..

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/

Click to expand...

It's hard to compare eras except that if anything this era is harder to coach in with free agency, the amount of money these prima donas make, practice rules and restrictions, and the TV and media being as ridiculous as it is.

robertweathers said:

It's Lombardi, Paul Brown and BB.

You can argue that BB is more successful that they are but imo you are splitting hairs at that point.

I'd put Bill Walsh there too but he didn't coach long enough. What an innovator.

Chuck Noll deserves some consideration as well.

All the other coaches you mention are all-timers but are a tick below the top 3.

Click to expand...

Absolutely. If my Fellow Patriots fans want to savor Mad Bill's statistical awesomeness ~ all those Victories, I mean ~ then I applaud your Enjoyment. We all savor this Glory in our own ways.

But for me, yeah:

#1 ~ Paul Brown
#1 ~ Vince Lombardi
#1 ~ Bill Walsh
#1 ~ Bill Belichick

I agree also that there's no need to use Quantitative Analysis to argue one or the other above the others.

To me, they are the Big Four ~ the 4 Greatest Of The Modern Era, as I include Coach Walsh.

It'd get even trickier to start comparing those guys to the likes of Amos Stagg and Knute Rockne.

If we're talking about context, then there is no other coach who's comes close to approaching what Belichick has accomplished in the salary cap era

SideNote Question, just in case there are any Quantitative Analysts around here:

In 1965, for instance, there were 14 Teams in the NFL, and and 2014 there were 32.

That might suggest, employing rudimentary Mathematics, that winning the Championship in 2014 was literally more than twice as hard ~ leaving all other Factors such as the debilitating effects of The Infernal Salary Cap aside ~ as it was in 1965, and that we should therefore be awarded Double Word Score!!

I don't think that that's how it would go, though.

The other side of the Argument might posit that the number of Competitors is immaterial, or close to it.

Of course it's all ultimately subjective...But is there such a thing as a Formula that could be applied?

DarrylS said:

BB may not have the longevity of Halas, Shula or Landry.. but his accomplishments are incredible..

Most playoff wins 22

Highest playoff win percentage 71%(there are a couple of outliers with a couple of wins higher than this)

His winning percentage is .659, right behind Shula, Halas and Paul Brown..

All time number of combined wins(reg season and playoffs) is 233... Shula is at 347, Halas is 324 and Landry is at 270... last year he passed Paul Brown(231) and Curly Lambeau(222)..

BB has been a HC for 20 years compare to Shula 33 years, Halas 40 years and Landry 29 years...

All of this is difficult to compare because of the "era" issue, but it is quite impressive, particularly as no current coach behind him is on a similar trajectory..

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/coaches/

Click to expand...

Great post, but I have to disagree with the bolded. Lombardi and Walsh are not outliers.

quality over quantity.....BB is top 3, indisputable....

It really is 1a, 1b, 1c, 1d or even 1a, 1a, 1a, 1a. The best coach is a generational thing. The one thing BB, Walsh, Lombardi, Noll, Brown all have in common is that they innovated over and over and over again. The Chess-versus-Checkers is cliché but absolutely true when you talk about the all time greats.

As someone who is a die hard Patriots fan but doesn't live in NE let me tell you how luxurious it is for us to rarely/never have worries about our head coach getting out coached. I lived in San Diego for a while where there are fans from every team. You won't believe how many team's head coaches BB has absolutely pantsed in the playoffs over the last 15 years. It leaves their fans with an unshakeable inferiority complex.

AndyJohnson said:

Great post, but I have to disagree with the bolded. Lombardi and Walsh are not outliers.

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Walsh(.714) and Belichick(.710) are a virtual tie, but missed Lombardi as he was buried further down.. mea culpa.

belichick is simply the greatest.
look at parcells, couldn't win jackshit without BB!

DarrylS said:

Walsh(.714) and Belichick(.710) are a virtual tie, but missed Lombardi as he was buried further down.. mea culpa.

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No problem, but FYI one nice thing about that site is you can sort by category.

HomerSchooled said:

This is sports, so winning should trump everything. No one has won like BB, so that should put him at the start of any conversation for greatness.



People forget that BB has coached 7 whole seasons without Brady. He has a sub .500 record and a single playoff appearance to show for it.

You can't argue with 4 SBs, a winning percentage over .700, and 22 postseason wins, though.

Click to expand...

I think if you discount the Cleveland "announced move" year, bb is above 500. And one of those no playoff years was the first team in nfl history to win 11 games and NOT go to the playoffs. So I find your stat a bit disingenuous