Lewis v White

varjao said:

BB on White (From Reiss):

"I think [he] has really had a good camp and a good offseason; he’s performed well in the opportunities that he’s had. He’s made yards on his own, made people miss in space, caught the ball well, his blitz pickup has been good. Like a lot of our second-year players, he’s improved in a lot of ways from Year 1 to Year 2 – mentally, the overall understanding of our opponents and defenses and things like that. His offseason training improved and his fundamentals at his position have improved. He works really hard [and] he’s a smart kid."

Looks like a lock to me.

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Thats kinda the thing. To be drafted in the 4th round, improve in Year 2 and do well and then get cut... It happens but IMO doesn't make a whole lotta sense from a team building standpoint. If he sucked eggs and was screwing up all over the place then I can understand. You can make an easy case that he still has plenty of upside.

On the other hand, Lewis has done very well. Tough call.

BlueThunder said:

White does look good in space......but showed me nothing inside or speed to the edge.......If he's PS eligible, stash him there when Blount returns....JMHO

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He already looks like a better runner than Vereen.

robertweathers said:

He already looks like a better runner than Vereen.

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White? No way.

Oswlek said:

White? No way.

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You and I are disagreeing a lot these days...

I know his ypc is ok but I thought Vereen was a weak runner and not that elusive. If that pile wasn't pushed back he was going nowhere. Went down way too easy for my liking.

I thought vs NO White showed some decent inside running.

As a receiver no one is coming close to Vereen.

robertweathers said:

I know his ypc is ok but I thought Vereen was a weak runner and not that elusive. If that pile wasn't pushed back he was going nowhere. Went down way too easy for my liking.

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Oh, Vereen was lousy for most of 2014, and downright terrible for the last 10 games or so.




But he was still better than White.

No hyperbole, White goes down easier than any running back I've ever seen in a Patriots uni. He is elusive in the open field and can make a guy whiff with a jump cut, but the next tackle he breaks will be his first. I almost feel sad for the guy.

Oswlek said:

Oh, Vereen was lousy for most of 2014, and downright terrible for the last 10 games or so.

But he was still better than White.

No hyperbole, White goes down easier than any running back I've ever seen in a Patriots uni. He is elusive in the open field and can make a guy whiff with a jump cut, but the next tackle he breaks will be his first. I almost feel said for the guy.

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I thought the line sucked vs GB so I don't blame White too badly for his bad night.

I really thought he did well vs NO. Especially on that 11 yard run.

We'll see how he does vs CAR.

robertweathers said:

I really thought he did well vs NO. Especially on that 11 yard run.

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That run involved a jump cut, which is his only move. He did the same to get the TD as well. Absent that, it is a one way ticket to the ground.

Oswlek said:

That run involved a jump cut, which is his only move. He did the same to get the TD as well. Absent that, it is a one way ticket to the ground.

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On that run he met contact, kinda leaned forward, and ran though it.

I will concede that might have been his best run as a Pat- which isn't that impressive.

Stats from last year regular season.

Blount 4.7 ypa
Gray 4.6
White 4.2
Vereen 4.1
Ridley 3.6
Bolden 3.2
Devlin 1.7

As 3rd down pass catchers.

Vereen 8.6 ypr on 52 receptions
White 4.6 ypr on 5 catches

Preseason 2015

White 17 runs for 2.1 ypa
Lewis 3 runs for 4 ypa

White 5 receptions for 14.4 ypr
Lewis 5 receptions for 7.2

Stats kind of confirm the eye ball test in preseason. Lewis looked the better runner but White the better pass catcher. I would say just based on the limited production he had last year that White probably has the edge over Lewis. Belichick seems okay with White's blitz pickup.

Here is what Belichick had to say about White.

James I think has really had a good camp and a good offseason. I think he’s performed well in the opportunities that he’s had. He’s made yards on his own, made people miss in space, caught the ball well, his blitz pickup has been good. Like a lot of our second-year players, he’s improved in a lot of ways from year one to year two – mentally, the overall understanding of our opponents and defenses and things like that. His offseason training improved and his fundamentals at his position have improved. I think he’s having a good camp, he’s doing well, and again, like a lot of our second-year players he’s shown a great deal of improvement. And he works really hard, he’s a smart kid, he works hard."

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/belichick-lauds-lb-james-morris-typical-iowa-kid

robertweathers said:

He already looks like a better runner than Vereen.

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On the contrary. I think they look like mirror images. Blow on them and they'll fall over.

For those who have been asking, no, Lewis isn't PS eligible.

Cadet's going to get a chance to make the team v. Carolina. I think we'll see him plenty. It's nice to have a camp battle that's not determined by "Well, this guy sucks less".

Getting all 3 in vs Carolina with the same OL and running/catching against the same D should sort them out.....I hope they all tear it up, but have a feeling the difference between them will be noticable...their ST contributions may well be the difference who sticks......

TommyD4207 said:

For those who have been asking, no, Lewis isn't PS eligible.

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http://www.cincyjungle.com/2014/8/3...-squad-eligibility-salary-rules-size-and-more

["E]ach club will be permitted to sign a maximum of two Practice Squad players who have earned no more than two accrued seasons of free agency credit."

Lewis has only accrued 2 seasons as a free agent. That makes him practice squad eligible. But if he keeps playing as well as he did Saturday, the Pats won't get him through waivers before he even gets to PS

Chiuba E. Obele said:

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2014/8/3...-squad-eligibility-salary-rules-size-and-more

["E]ach club will be permitted to sign a maximum of two Practice Squad players who have earned no more than two accrued seasons of free agency credit."

Lewis has only accrued 2 seasons as a free agent. That makes his practice squad eligible. But if he keeps playing as well as he did Saturday, the Pats won't get him through waivers before he even gets to PS

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Are you sure? I think he made the opening day roster with the Browns last year before he was cut. I think that gives him 2+.

TommyD4207 said:

Are you sure? I think he made the opening day roster with the Browns last year before he was cut. I think that gives him 2+.

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dunno, he might have still been under his rookie contract by that point

TommyD4207 said:

Are you sure? I think he made the opening day roster with the Browns last year before he was cut. I think that gives him 2+.

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Miguel says he is eligible.

http://www.patsfans.com/salary-cap/2015/05/03/2015-new-england-patriots-eligible-for-practice-squad/

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/who-is-3rd-down-back-still-key-patriots-question

The competition to be the Patriots changeup back got interesting in New Orleans. Dion Lewis got his first game action and lit it up as a pass-catcher, blitz protector and receiving target. Then James White came in and put together a similarly solid performance.

This week, with Travaris Cadet nearing a return, we may get a new flood of data. Cadet, the free agent signee from New Orleans has been at practice this week and is close to playing.

While the three seem similar – especially White and Lewis – there are some nuances that separate them. Lewis is much more solidly built than White. Closer to the ground with thick legs, he appears to be the kind of back that could run between the tackles if necessary.

White, who had an 11-yard touchdown run (as did Lewis) is a bit more slight and doesn’t seem as well-suited for the inside work.

Cadet is a 6-footer who’s got a leaner build than either and may be as well-equipped to work at wideout as he is in the backfield.
More information is needed.

In the locker room Wednesday, I latched on to White as he passed and asked about where things stand.

“I thought I played pretty well,” against the Saints. “There’s still things I need to improve on. There’s always room for improvement. We’re trying to carry over and get ready for Carolina.”

Having played extensively in the 2014 preseason as a rookie (29 carries, 80 yards; 4 catches for 45), White handled the ball just 14 times in the regular season as Shane Vereen and the rest of the Patriots backs took precedence.

This year, White is starting to feel as if he can play more quickly.

“The more football you play, the more things you get to see and the more repetitions get added and you’re able to react faster,” White explained. “Whether you’re seeing it on the practice field or seeing it in the game, it allows you to play a little bit faster too.

“You have to play with confidence. Trust in the playcall, trust in what you know and react to what you see. When you play fast and with confidence, the sky’s the limit.”

Chiuba E. Obele said:

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriots/who-is-3rd-down-back-still-key-patriots-question

... and lit it up as a pass-catcher, blitz protector and receiving target.

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That's like saying it took 60 minutes or maybe an hour.

ashley1992 said:

Like most Pat fans, I was impressed by both last night. I wonder if there is any room on the 53 man roster for both men?

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As someone else mentioned, it wouldn't be far-fetched for the Pats to use both White and Lewis together as traditional 3rd down backs, since Trevaris is more of a pure pass catcher, he could be included on the roster as a WR.

Let's see if Bill sees it that way

robertweathers said:

Yes! I noticed that as well.

We have all seen the Pats split out wide their 3rd down backs.

Its the added layer of lining up Cadet in the slot, wide and in the backfield that makes his role so unique on this team AND having White/Lewis in the backfield.

Keep in mind, Cadet is 6-1 210...he looks like a WR out there. Payton played him all over the place in New Orleans. Maybe @pherein has some additional insights into his strengths?

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We loved Cadet. He was a fan favorite

"I just want to help my team in any way I can. It's not about me, it's team, team, team. I'm just here to help the team win, whether it's at running back, receiver or special teams."

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http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/2012/09/new_orleans_saints_rookie_trav.html



Thing about cadet is hes a very hard worker. Good at special teams, pass catching, blocking, and running.
His strength is around the ends, the short relief pass, he only goes north, not afraid of a hit, Very good hands, works hard, special teams, and not injury prone.
Weaknesses would be he has no 1/10th of second sight you see in great runners, not an effective bruiser back, mediun intellegence might take him a couple games to figure things out, and ok at kick off returns.

Hes someone you can depend on to do his best, and a good team mate. Its my opinion that any team would be smart to have him on the 53 man roster, because he can fit into most positions when injuries hit.

He's still not > Lewis.