Greg Bedard on Brady vs Garopollo

1960Pats said:

In the Mount Rushmore thread that came up here I think I chose Russell, Brady, Orr and Williams.

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Of course. Not really debatable. If there was an order I might put Orr just ahead of TB because of the fact that he understandingly changed the game, along with his statistics were miles ahead of everyone else, along with revolutionizing a position. He is also referred by peeps as the greatest to ever play his sport. But I have no issue with TB 2nd since he played in a league that was desperate to keep parity either by a cap or cheating.

let's start JAG and force to TB retire when

1. brady doesn't look fit
2. brady throws like pennington
3. brady loses edge
4. brady is indecisive
5. brady doesn't care about the team (skipping practices, doesns't interact with teammates)
6. brady doesn't care about winning (smile after loss)
7. brady says things like 'maybe it's time to retire'

Armchair Quarterback said:

So everyone's got Krafty's back now? Unreal.

As if we need another, further proof of Brady's greatness and Kraft's shadiness. Funny how he'll only pay Brady an average QBs salary but is the man most responsible for Goodell's grotesque salary.


http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/kraft-brady-ultimatum.1120719/

http://blog.masslive.com/patriots/2015/05/tom_brady_new_england_patriots_7.html#incart_story_package

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Kraft is not the one making roster/cap decisions. If Kraft told Tom he wasn't paying him it was because Bill said so. If bill said Pay Tom 20m he'd write the check.

wolverinejoe80 said:

let's start JAG and force to TB retire when

1. brady doesn't look fit

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I guess we can start in 2000 at his Pro Day

Bruins29 said:

I guess we can start in 2000 at his Pro Day

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all hail avocado ice cream.

patfanken said:

4. JG is under contract to the Patriots through the end of the 2018 season.

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No, he is not. He is under contract through the end of the 2017 season. Signed a four-year (2014/2015/2016/2017) deal last year.

Miguel said:

No, he is not. He is under contract through the end of the 2017 season. Signed a four-year (2014/2015/2016/2017) deal last year.

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And, equally importantly for this discussion, his contract can't be renegotiated/extended until after next season, whereas Brady's can be at any time.

TriplecHamp said:

Kraft is not the one making roster/cap decisions. If Kraft told Tom he wasn't paying him it was because Bill said so. If bill said Pay Tom 20m he'd write the check.

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Agree. But if Kraft felt it was useful to have this conversation with Brady personally, that's exactly the limited sort of owner involvement that makes sense. Kraft has tried to personally help with team morale and, overall, it's obvious that over the years he's generally succeeded.

Miguel said:

No, he is not. He is under contract through the end of the 2017 season. Signed a four-year (2014/2015/2016/2017) deal last year.

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This is why I don't think Bedard is at all off the mark. Consider:

- I agree that Brady is the GOAT. But he will be 38 this year and optimistically has 2 to 3 years left of elite performance. If Brady is 33, we're not having this conversation, but what are the odds of winning a Superbowl with an over 40 QB?

- Young QB's like Jimmy G are hard to come by. He appears to have a strong arm, outstanding accuracy and good leadership skills. If Billy O'Brien got his wish & drafted Garapollo last year, I bet the Texans would win their division this year. The Pats will be hard pressed to find a better replacement for Brady, particularly because they are too talented and well coached to tank Colts style and get anywhere near the first pick in the draft.

- If there's one thing we've learned over the past 10 years, it's that Bill Belichick has the biggest balls in the NFL. Think 4th & 2, 17 & 0, Lawyer Malloy, Richard Seymour, "Pete Carroll appears to be soiling himself, let the clock run". We're talking about the modern day Red Auerbach, who was famous for saying "better to trade a player a year to early, than a year too late". If your surprised when TB is traded before JG's contract is up, you'll only have yourself to blame.

For example, assume Brady shows no signs of slowing down this year, JG continues to improve & the Rams move to LA. If the Rams offer a high 2016 second (to effectively replace the pick Goodell stole) & two forward year 1's for Brady. Does anyone really think BB wouldn't pull the trigger on this?

All this said, I'm not sure BK would go for it. Ironically, the one man who should be most focused on the long term interest of the franchise, appears to be the one least concerned about it.

I dont know why the boston media has this constant mania to discuss how long their hof player will last or how long before he will be traded. This crap happens every year -will bb trade brady ? he is cutthroat,no one lasts in new england, they dont value their player contributions Blah blah blah . One the team has some competition to their player they constantly talk about this.
Same old s***t year after year.

sportnik said:

This is why I don't think Bedard is at all off the mark. Consider:

- I agree that Brady is the GOAT. But he will be 38 this year and optimistically has 2 to 3 years left of elite performance. If Brady is 33, we're not having this conversation, but what are the odds of winning a Superbowl with an over 40 QB?

- Young QB's like Jimmy G are hard to come by. He appears to have a strong arm, outstanding accuracy and good leadership skills. I... The Pats will be hard pressed to find a better replacement for Brady, particularly because they are too talented and well coached to tank Colts style and get anywhere near the first pick in the draft.

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This is an interesting point. I think it's reasonable to suggest that in today's NFL, if Jimmy shows he has the ability to be a long-term capable starter then he will have more value to the Patriots at the end of 2017 than Tom Brady will, even if Brady doesn't diminish any further and comes off a SB win. One just has to look at the Browns, Jets, Jaguars, Bills.......the list goes on an on...to see how valuable it is to secure your long-term future at the QB position.

TriplecHamp said:

Kraft is not the one making roster/cap decisions. If Kraft told Tom he wasn't paying him it was because Bill said so. If bill said Pay Tom 20m he'd write the check.

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He is certainly involved in Brady/Seymour/Revis type contracts with large signing bonuses, upfront money and escrow accounts. I believe one of the reasons they didn't sign Revis is because Kraft would have had to put almost all of the potential guaranteed contract in escrow by writing a $30,000,000 check. You think that BB has carte blanche when it comes to contracts?

Wait. What?

‏@TonyGrossi 4m4 minutes ago
#Browns shutting down Johnny Manziel (elbow) on Monday. 3rd QB will be Kevin O'Connell, the QB coach.

Just be thankful we don't have to suit up Josh McDaniels to play QB.

Edit: I'm aware this is the former Patriot.

One of the biggest myths that exists in the NFL is the one that claims Tom Brady is grossly underpaid. Granted his isn't paid top dollar, but we all seem to forget that when he signed his last contract he was paid a signing bonus (IIRC) in excess of $30MM.

To Brady's and the Pats great foresight, they created a contract that would allow both Brady and the Pats not to have to consider cap space as a major issue in determining Tom's end game with the Pats. Now when 2017 comes around the only questions both sides have to deal with will be Tom's will to continue playing and his ability to do that at a high level.

As miguel pointed out I was wrong in thinking the Pats had JG's contract through the 2o18 season. But it doesn't make much of a difference in my basic premise, except to accelerate any decision the Pats need to make as it pertains to JG.

IF Tom is done after the 2017 season, and IF JG is ready to take over the transition will be a smooth one. However its rare that something like this is ever smooth, so there undoubtedly have be a very difficult and painful decision to be made that will likely end the Patriots career of one of the the 2 QB's

But in the end NONE of it will matter for another 3 full seasons, so why worry about it now?

patfanken said:

One of the biggest myths that exists in the NFL is the one that claims Tom Brady is grossly underpaid. Granted his isn't paid top dollar, but we all seem to forget that when he signed his last contract he was paid a signing bonus (IIRC) in excess of $30MM.

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That's what John Clayton says, and I think it's true, but misleading.

If you look at Miguel's site, you can see that before he signed his new deal, Tom Brady was due $30 million over the next two seasons. After he signed the deal, he was getting $57 million over the next five. That's three more years and $27 million more -- $9 million year.

Yes, he did get $30 million to sign, but that really just was a prepayment of the $30 million he was already scheduled to receive.

There can be no denying Tom Brady took a below market contract.

(He did add $1 million per year to it later in exchange for giving up a guarantee. I also expect it will be adjusted by the amount of any fine he receives)

manxman2601 said:

Wait. What?

‏@TonyGrossi 4m4 minutes ago
#Browns shutting down Johnny Manziel (elbow) on Monday. 3rd QB will be Kevin O'Connell, the QB coach.

Just be thankful we don't have to suit up Josh McDaniels to play QB.

Edit: I'm aware this is the former Patriot.

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As an interesting aside, if that happens, whatever they paid O'Connell as a coach should, IIRC, hit their cap.

Edit: Looking at Twitter, nobody else seems to think this is a season-ender; it sounds like they expect him back in practice sometime this week.

This **** again?

We are talking about the GOAT Qb, just a crazy ass guess but I'm think one of the top 3 coaches of all time just might wait till he sees some decline in his skills.

If he wanted 20M/per he'd get it. Compare the supposed best QB currently Rogers, against the Seahawks D in the 2nd half of the NFCCG, vs the expendable old over the hill Brady in the 2nd half of the SB.

Stop the madness NOW.