some specs on possible brady suit? from WaPo

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ibly-start-week-1/?postshare=7971436995536489

Tweeted out by mike reiss!
Thx for covering pats news, mike!!

Now, if we could just find somebody to start a do you like poll about a made up fine....

That's all well and good but where is the argument that says "well according to credible science the balls were never actually deflated in the first place so no crime was committed." Because that's what Brady and the PA needs to push hard.

VectorPrime said:

That's all well and good but where is the argument that says "well according to credible science the balls were never actually deflated in the first place so no crime was committed." Because that's what Brady and the PA needs to push hard.

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They (Brady, NFLPA) don't get to go to trial over the facts of the case. They get to go to trial over whether the penalty and process was fair and consistent.

They can argue strongly, as suggested in the article, about the consistency of the Carolina/Minnesota ball.

They can argue that Goodell can't issue the penalty (which he says he did because the CBA didn't give Vincent that authority, just the Comnmissioner) and then arbitrate that penalty.

But the facts of the report won't be part of this.

BelichickFan said:

They (Brady, NFLPA) don't get to go to trial over the facts of the case. They get to go to trial over whether the penalty and process was fair and consistent.

They can argue strongly, as suggested in the article, about the consistency of the Carolina/Minnesota ball.

They can argue that Goodell can't issue the penalty (which he says he did because the CBA didn't give Vincent that authority, just the Comnmissioner) and then arbitrate that penalty.

But the facts of the report won't be part of this.

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Agree in general but I'm sure they will find a way to work it into their narrative.

Brady is going to mop the floor with them.

BelichickFan said:

They (Brady, NFLPA) don't get to go to trial over the facts of the case. They get to go to trial over whether the penalty and process was fair and consistent.

They can argue strongly, as suggested in the article, about the consistency of the Carolina/Minnesota ball.

They can argue that Goodell can't issue the penalty (which he says he did because the CBA didn't give Vincent that authority, just the Comnmissioner) and then arbitrate that penalty.

But the facts of the report won't be part of this.

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OK.

What about the part where the NFL purposefully released KNOWN INCORRECT PSi measurements to Mortenson and the New England Patriots (via the Gardi letter) without correction for 4 months until the Wells report, thus knowingly allowing a false circus to ensue?

To anyone, that would entail a central question about the "process".

BelichickFan said:

They (Brady, NFLPA) don't get to go to trial over the facts of the case. They get to go to trial over whether the penalty and process was fair and consistent.

They can argue strongly, as suggested in the article, about the consistency of the Carolina/Minnesota ball.

They can argue that Goodell can't issue the penalty (which he says he did because the CBA didn't give Vincent that authority, just the Comnmissioner) and then arbitrate that penalty.

But the facts of the report won't be part of this.

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So when would the facts of the actual ball deflation come into play or would that have to be a separate case altogether?

Tony2046 said:

So when would the facts of the actual ball deflation come into play or would that have to be a separate case altogether?

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The article observes that Brady is likely to win only if he can prove that the decision-making PROCESS was skewed. Whether the actual decision was correct is almost irrelevant.

(I justify inserting the word "almost" by observing that the outcome may shed light on the process.)

shmessy said:

OK.

What about the part where the NFL purposefully released KNOWN INCORRECT PSi measurements to Mortenson and the New England Patriots (via the Gardi letter) without correction for 4 months until the Wells report, thus knowingly allowing a false circus to ensue?

To anyone, that would entail a central question about the "process".

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Appeals are about process, they aren't retrying the case they are ensuring the right processes were applied. We know Brady is innocent of the charges but that's not what they are considering, they are looking to see if the league followed the right protocols, processes, and precedents were followed, and in this case they clearly weren't, on fact the league will be hard pressed to show where they followed any of those in determining their sanctions.

But it's absolutely critical to Brady's legacy and reputation that it be made clear that no crime was committed in the first place and that the Wells Report was fundamentally flawed. If Brady simply gets off due to an account of procedural errors no one will take it seriously. In the eyes of the general public it'll just be seen as an example of a clearly guilty criminal who got off because of a talented legal team finding crafty legal loopholes. Which is bullsh.it.

eom said:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ibly-start-week-1/?postshare=7971436995536489

Tweeted out by mike reiss!
Thx for covering pats news, mike!!

Now, if we could just find somebody to start a do you like poll about a made up fine....

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Good article. Thanks for posting.

It may be stating the obvious but these types of articles only appear on media that don't rely on the NFL for access or as sources. You won't see ESPN, MMQB*, Fox or CBS doing this type of journalist for fear of being denied access to "inside scoops"....
For all the crap we give him as Pats fans (rightfully so), Florio/PFT is the only one I can think of who has ripped the Wells Report, the NFL and Goodell and relies on insiders to feed him information that might be affected by writing a story like this...
One other point, Washington Post is 'the' newspaper in DC and the powerbrokers/Congressman read it and if it is one thing the NFL fears, it is Congress sticking its nose into the NFL and its business....


* King has been all over the spectrum on this and while he has criticized the NFL, it has been a weak type of criticism designed to keep him in their good graces and not a "shout it from the mountaintops" type of NFL bashing

There is an underlying assumption that Federal Court will entertain this suit, which may or may not be true as there is a chance that the whole thing will be rejected as the remedy has been spelled out in the NFLPA labor contract with the NFL.. sometimes Federal Courts do not want to get involved in this type of thing.

This could be the sticky wicket as there may not be a role for the court in mutually agreed upon rules..

Despite this, I would like to think there is, and pretty sure that Brady's legal team has minions posted in Minnesota ready to run on over to Judge Doty's Courtroom to file appeals..

Patsfanin Philly said:

One other point, Washington Post is 'the' newspaper in DC and the powerbrokers/Congressman read it and if it is one thing the NFL fears, it is Congress sticking its nose into the NFL and its business....

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Congresspeople have very little time for reading, and generally read only what their staffs give them, which tends to be articles pertaining directly to the committee work they are doing, and stuff from their home district. Sad but true. WaPo just isn't read that broadly anymore, now that everyone has access to everything through their tablets.

BelichickFan said:

They (Brady, NFLPA) don't get to go to trial over the facts of the case. They get to go to trial over whether the penalty and process was fair and consistent.

They can argue strongly, as suggested in the article, about the consistency of the Carolina/Minnesota ball.

They can argue that Goodell can't issue the penalty (which he says he did because the CBA didn't give Vincent that authority, just the Comnmissioner) and then arbitrate that penalty.

But the facts of the report won't be part of this.

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I don't think this is entirely true. They would be fighting the entire procedure would be at issue. Arguably, the procedural aspect of this case would cover the entire investigation and focus on the idea that the outcome was preordained from the outset. For example when Kensil told the Patriots that they had been caught and were f***ed on the night of the championship game and then through the leaks and the Wells investigation and the switching of the experts from the ones from Columbia to Exponent etc. the article does a good job of covering the likely issues, but those issues could involve a very broad set of facts.

Ivan said:

Appeals are about process, they aren't retrying the case they are ensuring the right processes were applied. We know Brady is innocent of the charges but that's not what they are considering, they are looking to see if the league followed the right protocols, processes, and precedents were followed, and in this case they clearly weren't, on fact the league will be hard pressed to show where they followed any of those in determining their sanctions.

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Agreed.

But I wasn't talking about the appeal. I was talking about the federal court case.

And a "right process" does not include KNOWINGLY propogating false measurement information and KNOWINGLY allowing it to remain in the public for almost 4 months without correction. Meanwhile, it is standard operating procedure for the NFL to correct what they see as a false information report within minutes (see; Schefter June 14).

That is a process problem.

Federal courts do not care whether footballs were deflated or not. It is irrelevant to the violating of any law.

They do care a lot about whether a union worker's rights were trampled by management by a failure to comply with procedures and protocols that were specified in a collective bargaining agreement. That is relevant to violations of labor law.

Some specs on a possible Brady suit?

Navy blue w/pinstripes
Arm length - 35"
Inseam - 36"

Best article I've read yet. Presents in clear terms the case Brady's team will try to make as well as the risks of going to court in the first place ("The bar for a federal court to reverse a private arbitration result is notoriously high.") Also reminds people that Brady is in the driver's seat. When I read the reports that came out yesterday, I noticed that they all seemed to have been sourced to someone in the NFLPA, not Brady.

I'm not so sure, but I heard a rumor that newspapers in Boston were following this case as well, but I guess that's not true, as the best reporting on this seems to be coming out of Washington.

BelichickFan said:

They (Brady, NFLPA) don't get to go to trial over the facts of the case. They get to go to trial over whether the penalty and process was fair and consistent.

They can argue strongly, as suggested in the article, about the consistency of the Carolina/Minnesota ball.

They can argue that Goodell can't issue the penalty (which he says he did because the CBA didn't give Vincent that authority, just the Comnmissioner) and then arbitrate that penalty.

But the facts of the report won't be part of this.

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They won't get to argue the facts for this appeal but if Brady decides to sue for defamation instead then they will. I don't think it's out of the question that will be the road his team will choose.