Is Brady's Appeal Against the NFL a Fight He Can Even Win?

It's not getting reduced at all. Goodell wants to make it contingent on Brady waiving his right to sue and that ain't happening.....unless Goodell vacates the entire suspension.........then there is no reason to sue....

JoeSixPat said:

I'd love to see this re-run as a guest commentary on some mainstream national outlet if there's any way to submit it

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Sally Jenkins has been saying the same thing in the Washington Post and all the newspaper who syndicate her column.

It is a good question by the OP. I'm not convinced this is going to be easy.

At some point judges are going to start getting more particular about the cases they take firm NFL players, it will happen. Also its just a matter time when and NFL player loses.

If Brady takes this to court the concern would be that he ends up serving a suspension late in the season or playoffs. That would be devastating to the team.

I'll have five or six guys here disagree but I just have a bad feeling about all this and if he does two games then what's the big deal. Don't say "exonerate" because in the public eye it is too late for that.

Its not totally too late for some measure of exoneration, but that will disappear forever if Brady accept a compromise. I think the NFLPA wants to go all in with this case, which is good news for Brady.

obgod3 said:

It is a good question by the OP. I'm not convinced this is going to be easy.

At some point judges are going to start getting more particular about the cases they take firm NFL players, it will happen. Also its just a matter time when and NFL player loses.

If Brady takes this to court the concern would be that he ends up serving a suspension late in the season or playoffs. That would be devastating to the team.

I'll have five or six guys here disagree but I just have a bad feeling about all this and if he does two games then what's the big deal. Don't say "exonerate" because in the public eye it is too late for that.

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The players have been winning cases where they're clearly guilty, Brady's innocent so I'd say this won't be the case that they finally lose. This may be the case that does permanent damage to Goodells reign of terror.

obgod3 said:

It is a good question by the OP. I'm not convinced this is going to be easy.

At some point judges are going to start getting more particular about the cases they take firm NFL players, it will happen. Also its just a matter time when and NFL player loses.

If Brady takes this to court the concern would be that he ends up serving a suspension late in the season or playoffs. That would be devastating to the team.

I'll have five or six guys here disagree but I just have a bad feeling about all this and if he does two games then what's the big deal. Don't say "exonerate" because in the public eye it is too late for that.

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I wouldn't disagree with you because it is an obvious concern but I do think that if Brady takes this to court the final result would be devastating to Goodell and his lackeys even if Brady is initially suspended for a couple of games. I also think that no team would want to face the Patriots this year in the playoffs even if all their games are on the road.

PatsFans.com Article said:

Is Brady's Appeal Against the NFL a Fight He Can Even Win?

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In it's present form the appeal is a fight Brady cannot win. The very second the NFL announced their suspension and fine of Brady to the public, any tangible chance of Goodell changing the official NFL narrative on Brady was unrealistic.
However, once Brady gets the form of the appeal changed -- a venue where the decision is not made by or can be bullied by the NFL behind the scenes -- his chances are plausible. Nevermind the underlying weakness of the facts NFL's case which have been well documented, the NFL's own behavior shows they feel insecure about their actions and decisions in the matter. Leaks of phony statistics, "experts" that have a sordid past of salesman type science, questioning the NFLPA's wisdom and very right to appeal the punishment and declaration of guilt, Goodell himself publicly declaring his expert's were thorough, independent, excellent but of course he has an open mind. All that isn't the mark of an organization that feels confident and at ease with the rightness of their actions and decisions. that's the mark of a group that knows the facts and realities, then decided they have to sell their actions/decisions like a salesman selling a used car.
Given that reality, once the venue is outside the immense power of Goodell and his lackeys the chances of success are unquestionably tangible. The sooner it gets to that venue the better...

Patsfanin Philly said:

It's not getting reduced at all. Goodell wants to make it contingent on Brady waiving his right to sue and that ain't happening.....unless Goodell vacates the entire suspension.........then there is no reason to sue....

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Brady will also need exoneration as well... the crux seems to be that he did not turn over his cellphone, but the question I pose is why did he need to do that if they had the cellphones of Jeremski and McNally??? They did not need Bradys cell. Was the NFL seeking ammo for TMZ???

Roger will have to save face, as he spent a lot of cash on this whitewash and subsequent legal proceedings.. so I do not see this happening. OTOH Roger probably fears Federal Court and due process issues which are obviously violated here..

Not sure if a Federal Court can overrule a union contract agreed to by both sides.. but there seems to be so many constitutional violations in this process, maybe they can.. stay tuned.

VectorPrime said:

Its not totally too late for some measure of exoneration, but that will disappear forever if Brady accept a compromise. I think the NFLPA wants to go all in with this case, which is good news for Brady.

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Not sure the NFLPA has a choice, as if he loses on this level(almost completely certain) and he proceeds to Federal Court, NFLPA would look stupid among the players if they chose not to go along with an action that would benefit the union as a whole.

Despite Vincent's "altruistic" concern about how the NFLPA spends money, if the NFL did not massively screw this up there would not be any legal fees..

obgod3 said:

At some point judges are going to start getting more particular about the cases they take firm NFL players, it will happen. Also its just a matter time when and NFL player loses.

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Huh?

ThatllMoveTheChains!!! said:

Huh?

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Throw this through the internet typese translator:

At some point, judges are going to start getting more particular about the cases they take firm from NFL players, it will happen. Also its just a matter time when and until an NFL player loses his case during the Federal appeal process.

RelocatedPatFan said:

Throw this through the internet typese translator:

At some point, judges are going to start getting more particular about the cases they take firm from NFL players, it will happen. Also its just a matter time when and until an NFL player loses his case during the Federal appeal process.

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It's a forum not a memo, get over it

DarrylS said:

Not sure if a Federal Court can overrule a union contract agreed to by both sides.. but there seems to be so many constitutional violations in this process, maybe they can.. stay tuned.

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Sure, it can be in the interpretation of the contract. For instance, the CBA says the players will "reasonably cooperate" in the investigation. At no point is it specific to turning over personal cell phones. A player could argue that the answered all questions and since they had the other parties cell phones, they knew of any and all text communications and with the history of leaks from the NFL, he had a reasonable fear that personal non relevant information of a confidential nature would leak in to the public domain.....

What are Roger's options?? I think I parsed out a few options and my thoughts on the percentages of each occurring.

1) He decides he didn't hear anything new and keeps all punishments in place. Chances of happening 49%.
Upside, he has 31 happy owners and fan bases ....until it gets to court and IF they smack him down.

2) He lowers the suspension to 1-2 games based on either "new evidence" or that the original was too harsh with no consultation with team Brady. -Chances of happening 1%. Goodell is not reducing the punishment unless he has a waiver of Brady's right to go to court.

3) He exonerates Brady and drops the punishment to 1-2 games for "failure to cooperate" with no agreement by Team Brady not to sue. Chances of happening <1%. Again, Goodell is not reducing the punishment unless he has a waiver of Brady's right to sue.

4) He consults with team Brady and offers to reduce the suspension to 1-2 games IF they agree not to go to court and sue. Chances of happening. 45%. Will Team Brady accept? I hope not and that they roll the dice in court. This is most likely the NFLPA position as they would like to see Kessler rack up another win at Goodell/Vincent/Kensil etc expense. Upside for Goodell? He can claim "see he was guilty because he accepted the punishment" and upside for Pats is Brady is on the field for a few more games. Downside for Pats? Many will consider it as accepting a plea and an admission of guilt.

5) He drops the punishment entirely and returns the draft picks. Chance of happening- You have a better chance of playing cards with Jimmy Hoffa, Amelia Earhart, D.B. Cooper and Judge Crater...0%. It would lead to the swift end of his regime...win win all around...

6) Some other outcome out of left field... ??? This is the" WTF just happened" option....... Chances 4%. There is always the possibility of a development that nobody predicted that could keep everyone with a positive outcome, even if not happy...

I would love an outcome that exonerates Brady, gets him on the field for hopefully 19 games and gets the draft picks back but it ain't happening. What is the best hope? He gets the suspension overturned and is vindicated which is understood by anyone with a brain which eliminates major parts of fan bases in metro NY, and several other places...

DarrylS said:

Brady will also need exoneration as well... the crux seems to be that he did not turn over his cellphone, but the question I pose is why did he need to do that if they had the cellphones of Jeremski and McNally??? They did not need Bradys cell. Was the NFL seeking ammo for TMZ???

Roger will have to save face, as he spent a lot of cash on this whitewash and subsequent legal proceedings.. so I do not see this happening. OTOH Roger probably fears Federal Court and due process issues which are obviously violated here..

Not sure if a Federal Court can overrule a union contract agreed to by both sides.. but there seems to be so many constitutional violations in this process, maybe they can.. stay tuned.

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Felger and Mazz believe Brady's phone contained incriminating communication with BB.

Jackson 2 said:

Felger and Mazz believe Brady's phone contained incriminating communication with BB.

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OMG I GOT THE DEFLATOR LETTING A THIRD OF A POUND OF AIR OUT OF THE BALLS JUST LIKE U ASKED BELI LOLOL

Patsfanin Philly said:

Sure, it can be in the interpretation of the contract. For instance, the CBA says the players will "reasonably cooperate" in the investigation. At no point is it specific to turning over personal cell phones. A player could argue that the answered all questions and since they had the other parties cell phones, they knew of any and all text communications and with the history of leaks from the NFL, he had a reasonable fear that personal non relevant information of a confidential nature would leak in to the public domain.....

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Ppl go on and on about the cba but they forget there's a to of labor law baked into that which isn't explicitly spelled out -- the language in the cba doesn't override any of this more general labor law

eom said:

Ppl go on and on about the cba but they forget there's a to of labor law baked into that which isn't explicitly spelled out -- the language in the cba doesn't override any of this more general labor law

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A good reading of the law of the shop and some of the hurdles Brady faces if it goes to court were written in Judge Doty's decision in the Peterson case..detailing general labor law.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/257166733/Doty-Peterson-Ruling

Patsfanin Philly said:

A good reading of the law of the shop and some of the hurdles Brady faces if it goes to court were written in Judge Doty's decision in the Peterson case..detailing general labor law.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/257166733/Doty-Peterson-Ruling

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From Doty's ruling: "Henderson simply disregarded the law of the shop and in doing so failed to meet his duty under the CBA." Henderson refers to the NFL arbitrator. Brady and the NFLPA will argue that the Favre $50K fine for non-cooperation and the warning given to teams that had warmed up balls in cold weather all constituted precedent that make up law of the shop.

Question I have is, when will the NFL appeal of the Doty ruling be heard and ruled upon?

obgod3 said:

It's a forum not a memo, get over it

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Nothing for me to get over.

Sorry you're offended. I was just trying to be helpful (as I thought I understood what you were saying) and clarify the "huh" comment, not being the grammar police (especially me). Maybe I needed a smiley face at the end or try not to get to cute with that typese translator comment.