Goodell's letter response to the NFLPA...6/2/2015

IMHO this is a good thing. Goodell taking himself off the case then appointing someone like Ted Wells ("fair" and "thorough") would give him completely coverage of 'unbias' while getting the decision maker he wants on the case (and may have tacit power over).

Remember this case needs somewhat if not significant 'bad faith' proof for it to have its most valid pathway to the courts. I know everyone thinks the courts are a catchall for righting wrongs -- it isn't. A plaintiff needs hard law to get it to a trial. And though this is apples-orhanges a bit, take a look at Kessler in San Jose vs MLB. What MLB did was what I consider pretty bad -- and the courts basically said to Kessler "sorry, you don;t have standing".
Fortunately Brady has 'bad faith' to get there. This phrase is relative, it casts a wide net, so anything close to identifying bad faith should allow Brady to get this to a trial/proceeding. Bottom line for Brady, this is about getting this to a trial and getting it out of the NFL's hands. And this letter, IMHO, makes bad faith tangential enough for Brady to legally move forward. Consider:

(1)"Ted Wells thorough and independent" coupled with "I'm not married to it". Conclusion: Your office, the office you are in charge of, made a determination that harmed the plaintiff. You're now stating you aren't reasonably sure of your office's action after the harm has already been committed?
(2) 'I(Goodell) haven't been involved' coupled with "the commissioner had authorized me to" punish Brady. Conclusion: the very announcement of punishment notes it was through your authority, with the action "determined" by your own subordinate, yet you state you are not married to your office's conclusion of improper action by the plaintiff and therefore hear an appeal in good faith?

Look, I am not a lawyer (I configure and/or break switches and routers ) so take it for what it's worth. But from my POV, today Goodell went from innuendos of bad faith to now near certain, tangible, sufficient proof of 'bad faith' to move forward with legal proceedings. IMHO if this isn't bad faith then 'Bad Faith' was written as law in bad faith.

PonyExpress said:

The main reason Goodell should recuse himself is that he's too stupid to hear the appeal. The guy has the IQ of a turnip. Dufus-in-chief has to read the name of the first pick in the draft off of a card, despite knowing who it will be hours in advance. He'd lose a banjo duel to the kid in Deliverance

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Uh, I agree that Goodell is a vindictive a-hole who is not nearly as smart as he thinks he is....... But I think most of us would lose a banjo duel to the kid in deliverance.

Palm Beach Pats Fan said:

I have to think that Goodell is at least in part driven by the sunk cost fallacy.

That's a general human tendency. It is when time and money are gone, spent, unrecoverable on a dubious effort. You're not getting it back. You're getting nothing out of it, unless you can find some way to conjure a result that justifies even in some small way the effort, expense, and in this case, all of the hullabaloo.

He'll keep on going, because after all, he's thinking "We've come this far! Spent so much time! Surely there has to be something there that we can wrap up and put a bow on!"

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Except that he had an out permitting him to justify his costs by using this report/investigation to assess NFL protocols and use that to implement controls on procedures. He opted not to. My read on their actions is this is more about PR than it ever was costs (time or money). The general public loves this, and doesn't need logic or reason on its side to like it. A cursory look at the early stages of this mess should have convinced him to shut it down if he really wanted to pin actual misconduct on the Pats.

The only loss here for Goody is backing off. With the 'independent' and 'objective' Wells report, he would happily burn the Pats and Brady at the stake to please the addle-minded masses representing the fans from 31 other teams. This is politics at its finest.

PlainOldEd said:

Uh, I agree that Goodell is a vindictive a-hole who is not nearly as smart as he thinks he is....... But I think most of us would lose a banjo duel to the kid in deliverance.

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Hilarious.
Great movie history moment -- the director/casting did perfect on that scene. Everyone thought 'that inbred kid is downright creepy......great banjo playing though"

Joker said:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...roger-goodell-to-nflpa-regarding-brady-appeal

This is just amazing....the arrogance

"I do not have any first-hand knowledge of any of the events at issue. (That fact makes this matter very different from theRice appeal, in which there was a fundamental dispute over what Mr. Rice told me in a meeting at the league office.) Nor did I play a role in the investigation that led to Mr. Brady's discipline. Furthermore, there is no reasonable basis for dispute -- or for any testimony -- about authority for the discipline reflected in the letter signed by Mr. Vincent. The letter itself is clear on this point. And there is no basis for my testifying about prior instances in which discipline was considered or imposed for similar conduct; if that were the case, the NFLPA could seek my recusal in every conduct detrimental proceeding, directly contrary to our agreement that I have the "discretion" to hear "any" appeal."

Translation: "I do whatever the hell I please, say whatever I want and you can go pound sand"...signed, Your Ruler

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I have a feeling that years from now we will see Roger on the front page of Vanity Fair labeled " Just call me Rogina"

ChesBay said:

Goodell's letter clearly indicates there's significant group-think going on at the League office...no ability to step back and take a hard look at oneself (organizationally, or otherwise). Its tone of petulance, contradictory construct, and overall verbosity makes one wonder who's advising them, and how they'll ultimately fare in the real court of law, vs the public one they "court".

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He's always spouting off about integrity of the game, what about integrity in the front office, there's ZERO

You know what's a real bummer? I spent valuable time trying to think of a good demeaning nickname for Goodell, and then I found out his middle name is Stokoe.

He seems like a Stokoe.

MassPats38 said:

Except that he had an out permitting him to justify his costs by using this report/investigation to assess NFL protocols and use that to implement controls on procedures. He opted not to. My read on their actions is this is more about PR than it ever was costs (time or money). The general public loves this, and doesn't need logic or reason on its side to like it. A cursory look at the early stages of this mess should have convinced him to shut it down if he really wanted to pin actual misconduct on the Pats.

The only loss here for Goody is backing off. With the 'independent' and 'objective' Wells report, he would happily burn the Pats and Brady at the stake to please the addle-minded masses representing the fans from 31 other teams. This is politics at its finest.

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It's not a bad theory (cost justification) but I tend to agree with you that this was about PR/politics(ultimately will be about saving face).
Other elements are in play:
1) The easy target syndrome (I can punch this guy in the face and everyone will back me up-I can get away with it). Goodell knew punishment would be well received by the dumb masses as long as the team or player was the Patriots. The NFL just needed a simple to understand story to push that would prove punishment was justified. If the same thing happens with P Manning involved, this probably results in a latter to his team reiterating rules/containing a warning.

2) The bubble effect. It sometimes happens in corporate/government/academic culture where dissent get's you the office on the first floor next to the bathroom or just a pink slip. The inner circle and their thought process become disconnected with 'outside bubble' common sense. The paths of their conversations and "logic" become so far removed from the conventional thinking that their decisions are head scratchers/inexplicable.
It is this one, IMHO, that best explains why this bizarre, surreal episode took place as it did. This did not have to happen -- the bubble thinking made sure it did happen.

TheBostonStraggler said:

2) The bubble effect. It sometimes happens in corporate/government/academic culture where dissent get's you the office on the first floor next to the bathroom or just a pink slip. The inner circle and their thought process become disconnected with 'outside bubble' common sense. The paths of their conversations and "logic" become so far removed from the conventional thinking that their decisions are head scratchers/inexplicable.
It is this one, IMHO, that best explains why this bizarre, surreal episode took place as it did. This did not have to happen -- the bubble thinking made sure it did happen.

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A bubble full of Jets fans.

Goodell and the Jets already have the victory thanks to Kraft. They arbitrary took away 2 picks thanks to Kraft's capitulation.

Now all Goodell has to do is vacate Brady's suspension and Goodell's victory is complete. Brady and the NFLPA would then have no case to bring to an outside court so the league won't be exposed. Any allegations of a pro-Jet bias will be dismissed with him saying something like "I just gave Brady the benefit of the doubt despite a report telling us we shouldn't." No one will care about the illogic of the Patriots penalties standing despite the Brady suspension being vacated and the Wells report concluding that the organization itself did nothing wrong.

I will NEVER forgive Kraft for putting us in this position and for his continued support of this NY scumbag commissioner.

Deus Irae said:

When it comes to CBA matters, neither the Patriots nor the NFL is Brady's team. Brady's a team player, and his team is the NFLPA.

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And if he wants a golden future in MA politics, he negates the damage done by the NFL* by playing the labor hero against crony management and wins the support of the unions. Nothing personal, Robert. Just business.

YOUGOTMOSSED said:

Goodell and the Jets already have the victory thanks to Kraft. They arbitrary took away 2 picks thanks to Kraft's capitulation.

Now all Goodell has to do is vacate Brady's suspension and Goodell's victory is complete. Brady and the NFLPA would then have no case to bring to an outside court so the league won't be exposed. Any allegations of a pro-Jet bias will be dismissed with him saying something like "I just gave Brady the benefit of the doubt despite a report telling us we shouldn't." No one will care about the illogic of the Patriots penalties standing despite the Brady suspension being vacated and the Wells report concluding that the organization itself did nothing wrong.

I will NEVER forgive Kraft for putting us in this position and for his continued support of this NY scumbag commissioner.

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Brady can still sue for damages to his reputation which are real and have and will continue to cost him money. Kraft had no chance of victory against the NFL. They have agreements and Kraft is an owner of the NFL. He put up the web site, took his shots but was never going to win in court. The other owners hate him for the Patriots success. Revenge is a dish best served cold.

TheBostonStraggler said:

It's not a bad theory (cost justification) but I tend to agree with you that this was about PR/politics(ultimately will be about saving face).
Other elements are in play:
1) The easy target syndrome (I can punch this guy in the face and everyone will back me up-I can get away with it). Goodell knew punishment would be well received by the dumb masses as long as the team or player was the Patriots. The NFL just needed a simple to understand story to push that would prove punishment was justified. If the same thing happens with P Manning involved, this probably results in a latter to his team reiterating rules/containing a warning.

2) The bubble effect. It sometimes happens in corporate/government/academic culture where dissent get's you the office on the first floor next to the bathroom or just a pink slip. The inner circle and their thought process become disconnected with 'outside bubble' common sense. The paths of their conversations and "logic" become so far removed from the conventional thinking that their decisions are head scratchers/inexplicable.
It is this one, IMHO, that best explains why this bizarre, surreal episode took place as it did. This did not have to happen -- the bubble thinking made sure it did happen.

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There seem to be some similarities with Spygate in the sense that they both had "concerns" ahead of the game from whining teams, they both were borderline sting operations that involved NFL execs, and they both saw a hell of a lot of running around at halftime in an attempt to justify their actions. Both situations occurred within the opening quarter or so, then saw a bunch of scrambling at the half.

I would assume that this falls into your former grouping of "easy targets," particularly after 2007. The sad thing is that it may not stop--at least with our team, anyway. They may eventually try for the old trifecta, especially if N.England continues to win.

So Roger says he is not a " central witness"....
>>>>>>>>>“I do not have any first-hand knowledge of any of the events at issue,” Goodell explains in his letter to the NFLPA regarding the Brady case. “Nor did I play a role in the investigation that led to Mr. Brady’s discipline.”<<<

1 Mr. Goodell, did you have any conversations with Ted Wells? We would like to see your computer and cell phone to verify the contacts, for the integrity of the game. Two can play that game.
2 do you or anyone under you tell Wells not to investigate the NFL itself or the leaks and misinformation?
3 why did you have the Patriots sign a non disclosure agreement about correctly patently false information about PSI of the balls?
4 I realize he is NOT a lawyer but he really needs to look up the term " due process"

Sorry Roger, you are a central witness and this Star Chamber is a joke......

As much as we believe that Goodell is an idiot and wrong, he has to have legal minions advising him on how to proceed on this case.... not sure he would pose himself as being a complete idiot, but he is a Jets Fan so anything is possible.

With that being said, he should have recused himself from this case due to the obvious bias... not sure what will happen if the NFLPA/Brady's Atty's want to question the "neutral" arbitrator??? This whole situation has Judge Doty written all over it..

This is the biggest crock of crap that I have ever read..

"I do not have any first-hand knowledge of any of the events at issue"..

Dr Pain said:

Brady can still sue for damages to his reputation which are real and have and will continue to cost him money. Kraft had no chance of victory against the NFL. They have agreements and Kraft is an owner of the NFL. He put up the web site, took his shots but was never going to win in court. The other owners hate him for the Patriots success. Revenge is a dish best served cold.

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I don't pretend to know everything about the operative CBA. I've never read it or even seen it.

From what I've heard, it has to be the one of most ineptly drafted legal agreements ever. If a commissioner can simply pluck away draft picks and suspend players arbitrarily and with impunity, this is a real problem if the commissioner turns out to be a tyrant and/or a horse's ass (we seem to be blessed with a commissioner who happens to be both).

BradyFTW! said:

You know what's a real bummer? I spent valuable time trying to think of a good demeaning nickname for Goodell, and then I found out his middle name is Stokoe.

He seems like a Stokoe.

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He seems more like a Stokhole.

PonyExpress said:

The main reason Goodell should recuse himself is that he's too stupid to hear the appeal. The guy has the IQ of a turnip. Dufus-in-chief has to read the name of the first pick in the draft off of a card, despite knowing who it will be hours in advance. He'd lose a banjo duel to the kid in Deliverance

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And he still screwed up the second pick "Marioto" versus "Mariota"......mispronouncing it....

While this ridiculous Kabuki theater that is deflategate seems to be front and center in NFL news, no one seems to notice or care about the NFL's maneuvering to fleece the taxpayers of San Diego out of about a billion dollars to build a new stadium under threat of moving the team to LA.

I can't help but wonder if the sleazeballs in the NFL are doing this by design. Deflatgate is the smokescreen while the greedy, corporate scumbags running the league pull off another grand theft from local taxpayers with zero media scrutiny. FIFA scandal? Chump change compared to the NFL.