Why Bob folded - and what it should tell you.

Chiuba E. Obele said:

sounds intriguing....can u elaborate please?

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which part?

IllegalContact said:

which part?

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Bill Parcels disliking Kraft.....Patriots playing with passion, despite hardly making the playoffs

Chiuba E. Obele said:

Bill Parcels disliking Kraft.....Patriots playing with passion, despite hardly making the playoffs

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I don't think Parcells ever liked Kraft.....Parcells was the one who set up the Pats to be in place to win championships......look at all the Parcells guys who were critical to the early success of the Pats under BB. Supposedly, Parcells left over being outvoted on the drafting of Terry Glenn......you don't leave a team right after the super bowl over something like that.....I can perfectly well see how the Parcells personality can't stand the Kraft personality......

you have to understand one thing......when it comes to the actual football part of this, he has made exactly one good decision and is still living off of it.

as for passion, I didn't say 'playing with passion'....you did

although they were idiots, the Sullivans were passionate owners......junior getting into fights with Matt Millen, etc

Kraft's passion is money conveniently placed behind this notion that he is some sort of fan of the team......he just proved he is no fan.....a fan would not sell out his team like that

The conspiracy theories are just getting ridiculous.

Bountygate was unprecedented; a team PAYING players who injured opponents and knocked them out of games. That has nothing to do with the fact that they won a Super Bowl or were in the ascendency at the time. That's just disgusting football and that had to be punished. Do you really think if an 0-16 team did that they wouldn't receive the same punishment?

I don't think so. The league aren't trying to maintain parity by knocking top teams off of their perch!!

Neither Spygate or Deflategate are league conspiracies.

I'm not sure what happened with these footballs and I'm actually past caring. I don't care any more. Kraft wasn't winning this battle unless Brady was cleared. All the while Brady is held accountable and guilty the Pats won't win over their 'ignorance isn't an excuse' punishment. That will always stand.

It's absolutely fruitless. I think Kraft just wants to move on more than anything because he just can't be bothered. Which is exactly how I feel right now...because the longer this drags on the more my enjoyment is being sucked out of this league and this team.

UK_Pat37 said:

The conspiracy theories are just getting ridiculous.

Bountygate was unprecedented; a team PAYING players who injured opponents and knocked them out of games. That has nothing to do with the fact that they won a Super Bowl or were in the ascendency at the time. That's just disgusting football and that had to be punished. Do you really think if an 0-16 team did that they wouldn't receive the same punishment?

I don't think so. The league aren't trying to maintain parity by knocking top teams off of their perch!!

Neither Spygate or Deflategate are league conspiracies.

I'm not sure what happened with these footballs and I'm actually past caring. I don't care any more. Kraft wasn't winning this battle unless Brady was cleared. All the while Brady is held accountable and guilty the Pats won't win over their 'ignorance isn't an excuse' punishment. That will always stand.

It's absolutely fruitless. I think Kraft just wants to move on more than anything because he just can't be bothered. Which is exactly how I feel right now...because the longer this drags on the more my enjoyment is being sucked out of this league and this team.

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With all due respect, just because the league decided to slam the Saints for bountygate you can make no judgement on whether this type of thing was relatively common practice or not.

Take a look at some evidence that is contrary to your baseless opinion:

Bounties, for lack of a better term, have been around forever in the NFL (and they exist in the NHL as well. Ever hear of a player being put "on the board?" Look it up.). Many retired players have come out of the woodwork to talk about this made-up issue. Few have denied hearing such vile things, but others confidently confirm its existence.

Washington Redskins QB Joe Theismann, best known today for having his leg snapped like a twig by New York Giants drug-fueled LB Lawrence Taylor on Monday Night Football, recently was quoted in a Sports Illustrated article saying, "In a sick way, I guess it's flattering. If you had a bounty on you, you were a pretty good player and they wanted to get rid of you."

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http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...unty-gate-why-the-nfl-broke-this-story-itself

The same as non-Patriots fan are incredibly (and deliberately) ignorant about the details of Deflategate so are a lot of people on the subject of bountygate.

I'm not sure what the point of your post was because simply stating that something is not the case, despite evidence to the contrary is a waste of anyone's time.

Why was it necessary to merge PATS16N0's post into this thread?

KontradictioN said:

Why was it necessary to merge PATS16N0's post into this thread?

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Zeus' thread was also merged into this one for some reason.

livinginthe past said:

Zeus' thread was also merged into this one for some reason.

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Yeah. It's totally unnecessary. The forum is filled with these kinds of threads. Just let them stand out on their own.

To the person who compared Kraft to Art Modell, I don't think Kraft has his name on the
list for the new Los Angeles or English franchise. For the rest of us, I think we are probably
over reacting. Kraft did what he did to avoid being black balled. I have gone thru some bad
days in my 55 years of following the team but I will still be up in section 333 rooting for
them. Tough to break old habits.

Jimke said:

To the person who compared Kraft to Art Modell, I don't think Kraft has his name on the
list for the new Los Angeles or English franchise. For the rest of us, I think we are probably
over reacting. Kraft did what he did to avoid being black balled. I have gone thru some bad
days in my 55 years of following the team but I will still be up in section 333 rooting for
them. Tough to break old habits.

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I don't think Kraft is Modell. What Modell did was despicable. What Kraft did was only purely vile. There's a difference. Basically, Kraft isn't much lower on the totem pole.

Jlaff said:

Maybe, but if that's the case, I still see the lack of interest being drawn out slowly, and maybe not even necessarily on purpose. Next year might see some fans who normally wouldn't miss any of 16 games now watching 12. Other commitments start to take precedence over Pats games, etc.

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That's my feeling right now. It's not an immediate impact, and with Brady retiring in a few years the graph has a clear tendency

So the revisionist history to rebuild Bob Kraft's image begins.

Deflategate starts........Fans become critical that Kraft isn't backing Bill, Tom and the team......here comes Bob full of piss and vinegar. Wells report comes out and Bob immediately caves.........fans get pissed that Bob is taking it lying down............Context report comes out Bob starts fighting...........Owner's meeting comes and the 31 plus Fraudger let Bob know what a bad boy he's been, Bob caves, fans are pissed but Bob has no more appeasement moves left.

Bob has stutter-stepped at every junction trying to be everything to everybody and thus failing to be anything but a failure. He'll never get that the other 31 are laughing at him. The rest of the country hate him and his team. So now his legacy in this region is shot. He's alienated his biggest supporters. And for what? The league will treat him no better the next time around. He hasn't built bridges as the media would now like to portray it. He's appeased his way into losing the war.

Henry Clay, Neville Chamberlain and Bob Kraft. Who are three losers through appeasement Alex.

Brady6 said:

I am not sure about you all but I have sent a few text messages in my day. All of them appeared on my phone and the person’s phone I sent them too, so when they read the balls boy’s phones they would have seen the conversation if any between Brady and them. Making the need for Brady's phone a moot point at best.

Second point, I see Goodell mentioning the integrity of the AFCCG, etc. Well the Colts intentionally losing to “suck for Luck” is likely the only reason they were in the game, but channeling your inner, Pete Rose with some points shaving to position yourself for the top draft pick that is just integrity at its best. Ironic...

Honestly, I think Kraft is a little ***** for laying down, but I am not going to put all my anger towards him, because the reality is he is a senior citizen who was backed into a corner by this generation’s corruption that he never even should have had to deal with. As a man slightly younger than Goodell I actually find it appalling that he bullies 73 year old men like Robert Kraft and preys on them being weak to exhibit his power.

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I won't click "dislike" as I agree with some points of your post. HOWEVER...

Kraft runs multiple, successful businesses. There has been no indication (up until this nonsense) that he's senile or somehow unfit to run the team. If he is, indeed, fit to run the team... then the culture aspect doesn't matter. If he is NOT fit to run the team, then why in the hell is he the one running it? Nobody is forcing him to be the owner. Many (most?) of us are calling for him to step down, actually. He's shown enough business acumen over the years to indicate he'd know when to start handing the keys over before things go south.

So regardless of what a crud situation he's in, there's really no excuse. Beyond that, please remember that some of the cruddy situation he's in now is because YOUNGER Kraft mishandled Spygate. Older/Wiser Kraft apparently learned literally nothing from that fiasco either.

There's also an ageism aspect to your post that makes me uncomfortable. But leaving that issue out there remember, a lot of people RETIRE when they are unable to perform their duties. Especially when, like Kraft, they have so much money there's no financial benefit to keep going.

Sorry, there's just no way to support your argument if any additional thought is given to it at all.

borg said:

First off...short term ...Both Kraft and the league would spend millions if not tens of millions in legal fees ....in order to recoup his $1 million dollar fine. Given the supposed $45 million in fees Wells has collected from his last two investigations, the NFL does not skimp in defending the badge.
More important though...long term......the NFL is at a crossroads. Despite record revenue, the sport itself is constantly under attack due to its violent nature and permanent injuries. Don't let the massive dollars flowing in distract you from the reality that these owners have much to worry about. High schools across the nation are dropping the sport because of cost and liability issues. Parents are refusing to allow their children to join teams. These changes will slowly trickle up into the college ranks as well. When injury litigation starts to ensnare the major universities.....and it will.....this sport will be transformed into something we may not recognize.
My point, the league understands it must maintain a united front at all times...and deflategate is simply an annoying pimple compared with the sports real issues. The "32" realizes that if the commissioner loses his "moral authority" over the sport, then the buzzards will descend fast and furious....the NFLPA, retired players, Congress. Given the PR fiascos the league has been faced with over the past few years, no doubt the "32" understand that they must circle the wagons and regain control of their league. Their will be bigger battles ahead that demand a unified front.

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There's another very easy way the league can be unified, they can revise their position making a suit unnecessary. The league concocted a ******** witch-hunt to handicap the Patriots, and if it wasn't bad enough they decided to trash the reputation of the man who is one of THE most important pieces in the franchises success, that's something I CANNOT forgive.

livinginthe past said:

Bob Kraft is a business man - and there aren't any billionaires who haven't mortgaged huge part of their soul at one point or another.

Yesterday was just another business decision for Bob Kraft - its not about Bob 'being weak' or 'lacking spine' - its about Kraft going along with the leagues efforts to handicap the team that has had the good fortune to have the best QB/HC the game has seen.

In short, its about trying to get some parity back in the game - its about letting someone else from the AFCE make the post-season (we don't want to lose those Buffalo/Miami/NYJ fans do we?).

It's best to think of the 32 franchise owners, not as competitors, but as partners in a business venture - 31 fanbases are overjoyed - 31 fanbases have increased their odds of winning the Superbowl.

One fanbase is going to bellyache a whole lot - but eventually get straight back in line and buy NFL merch, watch NFL games.....at least this is how Kraft et al think the plebs will react.

Good business, in short.

Anyone who thinks that Kraft accepted this team punishment to lower Brady's is delusional - I would not be surprised that this be taken as a green light to increase Brady's punishment to 8 games after his appeal is rejected.

What you see on the field might not be the WWE fix that some might believe, but what transpires between the 32 partners absolutely is.

The question is, do you really want to be a part of that?

Personally, after 26 years as a fan - i'm likely done - i'll always appreciate the greatness of Belichick and Brady - and i'll enjoy watching my 3GTG DVD's - but watching football on a Sunday is tacitly agreeing with the pantomime that the NFL has become...and thats something i'm not prepared to do.

All the best.

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livinginthe past said:

Bob Kraft is a business man - and there aren't any billionaires who haven't mortgaged huge part of their soul at one point or another.

Yesterday was just another business decision for Bob Kraft - its not about Bob 'being weak' or 'lacking spine' - its about Kraft going along with the leagues efforts to handicap the team that has had the good fortune to have the best QB/HC the game has seen.

In short, its about trying to get some parity back in the game - its about letting someone else from the AFCE make the post-season (we don't want to lose those Buffalo/Miami/NYJ fans do we?).

It's best to think of the 32 franchise owners, not as competitors, but as partners in a business venture - 31 fanbases are overjoyed - 31 fanbases have increased their odds of winning the Superbowl.

One fanbase is going to bellyache a whole lot - but eventually get straight back in line and buy NFL merch, watch NFL games.....at least this is how Kraft et al think the plebs will react.

Good business, in short.

Anyone who thinks that Kraft accepted this team punishment to lower Brady's is delusional - I would not be surprised that this be taken as a green light to increase Brady's punishment to 8 games after his appeal is rejected.

What you see on the field might not be the WWE fix that some might believe, but what transpires between the 32 partners absolutely is.

The question is, do you really want to be a part of that?

Personally, after 26 years as a fan - i'm likely done - i'll always appreciate the greatness of Belichick and Brady - and i'll enjoy watching my 3GTG DVD's - but watching football on a Sunday is tacitly agreeing with the pantomime that the NFL has become...and thats something i'm not prepared to do.

All the best.

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All great points, on paper Kraft is likely making the smart business move, I happen to think that he actually killed the goose that laid the golden egg, but he is definitely trying to make the best financial move...but why should I care? I don't care about the profitability of the franchise, the Packers are owned by the people of Green Bay as a non-profit corporation and that works just fine.

One of the reasons I like football is because the outcome isn’t decided by money, we deal with that so often in our lives and it’s such a refreshing escape when you see 2 groups of men battling it out with the winner being decided by what they do on that field. I want to see a situation where the best team wins, even if it means they win a dozen Superbowls in a row, even if that team is the goddamned Jets. Even though I despise the Jets I’d support a system that allows them to prosper BECAUSE THEY EARNED IT!

Like many Americans I treasure the idea of a meritocracy, where one gets what they earn, no more no less. Under Goodell we’ve seen the opposite, we’ve seen the league act as an attack dog against the Patriots for minor nonsense and completely ignore significant offenses from other teams. “Parity” may increase profitability for the owners but why would I have any interest in a rigged system designed to create equality by bringing down the strong rather than having the incompetent franchises up their game? Why would I have any interest in supporting that kind of system which operates so openly in that manner and then turns around and lies to me about it?

Why would I have any interest in supporting a man who values his already incredible wealth over the reputation of Tom Brady, who (along with BB) is most responsible for the wealth generated by the team? Bob chose to sit by as the league pulled ridiculous ******** out of its ass in an attempt to frame Brady and Kraft sides with them?

Having a society that rewards virtue is THE essential foundation for wealth to be generated, Kraft chose to ignore that and go straight for the money, seriously, does he not have enough? Is it me or would Kraft actually be fighting the league if Myra was still alive?

“The Patriot Way” is now a term without meaning, this team doesn’t deserve people like BB, TFB, and Edelman. I never thought I’d say this but I REALLY want them to leave New England and win a few championships in a more deserving atmosphere.

PatsWickedPissah said:

While I agree most will continue, some of us won't.
Myself and others I attend games with have declined our tickets for 2015 already.
Not enriching Kraft with tickets, parking, concessions, material.
Not buying the 3 Games Blu-Rays for self or gifts as planned.

GFY Kraft.

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I had to have my payment in by Feb.30. Long before Kraft's betrayal. Did you recently decline and get a refund? Or did you decline a few months ago? If I could get a refund I would let my tickets of 21 years go

I get tickets every year from ST holding friends. Just not buying any this season.

supafly said:

I have no reason to not believe you, as your word has always been good with me. I do however, question the authenticity of some other fans here who claim the same. If a game were coming on tomorrow afternoon at 1:00, about 99 percent of us would be tuning in---and guys like Kraft and Goodell KNOW that.

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This is dead on.

Come September all of the names saying they will no longer watch football because of this will be posting in the gameday threads about how the season is over the very first time theres a 3 and out. And the defense will be garbage and BB is an awful GM the first time a pass is completed.

Just like always.

strngplyr said:

This is dead on.

Come September all of the names saying they will no longer watch football because of this will be posting in the gameday threads about how the season is over the very first time theres a 3 and out. And the defense will be garbage and BB is an awful GM the first time a pass is completed.

Just like always.

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