Maybe we just cheated?

the jellyfish basically admitted it.

dales804 said:

I would say so. And Brady was probably generally aware of it.

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"Probably"?!?!?! Either he knew or he didn't. If Brady said he didn't and you can't prove it, then "probably" isn't good enough. Am I missing something here?

fair catch fryar said:

"Probably"?!?!?! Either he knew or he didn't. If Brady said he didn't and you can't prove it, then "probably" isn't good enough. Am I missing something here?

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Did you see what I quoted? It was sarcasm. Do you truly believe I think the Patriots commuted the laws of physics and Brady knew about it?

We saw during cameraplacementgate that Kraft wasn't willing to lift a finger to challenge the league. We expected this to be different, with no smoking gun and his actions post-Wells report (the publishing of Wells report in context, the press release after the penalties were handed down, the King interview). But really, why did we expect that, when we've seen other evidence of Kraft backing Goodell and the league on all sorts of things we hated.

It's far, far more likely that Kraft showed up to the owners meetings and found he had no friends on his side. Kraft wears big pants in the NFL hierarchy, Goodell wears bigger ones--at least now, and in the context of deflategate.

Kraft saw that he'd have absolutely no help if he fought this in any way, and rather than making waves he chose to toe the line, it's as simple as that. He chose the path of the businessman, not the longtime fan and team owner. And that'll be fine for his bottom line and his strength in ownership circles, but it's done irreparable damage to his reputation among us fans, and of course he's allowed his teams legacy to be tainted beyond repair.

It's incredibly sad to see, but honestly after cameraplacementgate it's also a shame that any of us expected anything different...he's a billionaire NFL owner first, a 'Pats fan' (if we can call him that still) second.

BobDigital said:

cheat means doing something the rules say not to do. So like I said... pretty much what every team does.

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You believe that Brady cheated by conspiring with staff members to remove air from the footballs below the required psi?

dales804 said:

Did you see what I quoted? It was sarcasm. Do you truly believe I think the Patriots commuted the laws of physics and Brady knew about it?

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My apologies. My sarcasm radar is out of order lately. because of all the bull$hit being shoveled around.

fair catch fryar said:

My apologies. My sarcasm radar is out of order lately. because of all the bull$hit being shoveled around.

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No worries. Sarcasm still doesn't translate perfectly over the internet.

fair catch fryar said:

You believe that Brady cheated by conspiring with staff members to remove air from the footballs below the required psi?

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I know conspiracy fits but it is kind of a strong term to use here. As for Brady... Honestly idk. There is a lot more suspicion surrounding McNally than Brady for me.

If McNally did something he probably did so on Brady's order or at least had a wink/nod. Also he did lie about knowing McNally IMO and also did not hand over his text.

I don't feel quite as strong as 55/45 here (which is what I said is my guess on McNally doing something with the balls) as you are branching out suspicions form one person to implicate another who would very likely be connected... Maybe 50/50 on Brady. IDK.

If the Patriots did do something improper and aren't coming forward to explain it, they're doing a disservice to the fanbase. They basically said "stand with us" and are now saying "stand down".

Sometimes you fight a fight because it needs to be fought..even if you think you'll lose. If the fight shouldn't be fought because the Patriots did something, then tell us. Otherwise, they backed down from a fight they should have fought...even if they lose. I can respect someone who fights a losing battle for a just reason.

BobDigital said:

We don't know exactly what they should have measured. The Wells report said something like 1.1 or whatever it was. That is incorrect. They did not properly include the rain variable IMO. in other experiments in which balls were simulated with rain conditions it dropped to below 1.7. The Patriots measurements were actually above this mark.

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The Wells report says that they should have been between 11.32 and 11.52 without the effect of rain.
The average of all 22 measurements was 11.49.

How did they cheat if your comment that they measured above the mark is correct?

However it can also be illustrated that the ball once dried and brought in doors gains PSI fairly rapidly. How long were they in inside and what is the average PSI gained after they are brought inside from similar conditions per minute? At what exact minute did they start to measure the balls?

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They cannot gain more psi due to the effect of wetness than they lost due to the effect of wetness.

5? 6? 7? 8 minutes? This was not gone over in the report so honestly we don't know what it should have measured. I found the science in the report to be meaningless either way cause these things were not explored and these factors were unknown.

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If the science is meaningless, what are you basing your conclusion that they cheated on?
Any version of the science would need to show footballs under what they measured to prove or even suggest tampering.

BobDigital said:

McNally threatening to go to ESPN. That looks bad and I don't think the Pats gave a good explanation
McNally taking the balls into the bathroom in the first place and the particular one he choose
No follow up in person interview for McNally
Brady Refusing to hand over his phone or text
I don't believe Brady did not know McNally. I think he lied and why lie?

Just those things and some other. Not proof at all but reasonable suspicion... slightly over 50%. Now if you want to ask do I believe slightly over 50% should be the threshold for a penalty I think not. I think it you should need to be a bit closer to "Certain" before handing a penalty out. However that is not how the NFL works sadly.

In a perfect would that would be how it works and I would say "there is not enough here going by the letter of the NFL law".

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I see you attended the Ted Wells School of Let's Get 'Em, Facts Be Damned.

McNally threatening to go to ESPN. -- A joke in a text message

McNally taking the balls into the bathroom in the first place and the particular one he choose. -- 100 seconds to take a leak and wash his hands, or let air out of 12 footballs?

No follow up in person interview for McNally. -- He already was interviewed FOUR times, including a SEVEN-HOUR interview by Wells. He has a full-time job and family. If Wells didn't get what he "needed" in the first SEVEN-HOUR interrogation, that's his problem.

Brady Refusing to hand over his phone or text -- He wasn't required to and was advised not to because it would've set a precedent in subsequent disciplinary cases. Besides, Wells already had all pertinent messages between Brady and the ballboys.

I don't believe Brady did not know McNally. I think he lied and why lie? -- Why do you think he lied? He might not have known McNally by name or remembered his face before or even after the sting occurred.

BobDigital said:

I know conspiracy fits but it is kind of a strong term to use here. As for Brady... Honestly idk. There is a lot more suspicion surrounding McNally than Brady for me.

If McNally did something he probably did so on Brady's order or at least had a wink/nod. Also he did lie about knowing McNally IMO and also did not hand over his text.

I don't feel quiet as strong as 55/45 here as you are branching out suspicions form one person to implicate another who would very likely be connected... Maybe 50/50 on Brady. IDK.

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IDK either, but I'm willing to give Brady the benefit of the doubt and actually believe him for 1) being the type of person he has portrayed himself to be as legit, 2) believing him on his word, and 3) because they can't prove it! I don't blame Brady for not giving up his phone for several reasons let alone the main concern of personal privacy and the way **** seems to leak out of the NFL.

AndyJohnson said:

The Wells report says that they should have been between 11.32 and 11.52 without the effect of rain.
The average of all 22 measurements was 11.49.

How did they cheat if your comment that they measured above the mark is correct?


They cannot gain more psi due to the effect of wetness than they lost due to the effect of wetness.


If the science is meaningless, what are you basing your conclusion that they cheated on?
Any version of the science would need to show footballs under what they measured to prove or even suggest tampering.

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I made a post about why I think they cheated which his basically a list of suspicious activity not related to the science.

FirstAndGoal said:

If the Patriots did do something improper and aren't coming forward to explain it, they're doing a disservice to the fanbase. They basically said "stand with us" and are now saying "stand down".

Sometimes you fight a fight because it needs to be fought..even if you think you'll lose. If the fight shouldn't be fought because the Patriots did something, then tell us. Otherwise, they backed down from a fight they should have fought...even if they lose. I can respect someone who fights a losing battle for a just reason.

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If you accept an egregious penalty without a fight, you might as well admit guilt if you are guilty because you already did so by default, and it can't get worse.

Even if the ball boys manipulated the footballs to Brady's preference, the Wells report was so butchered and no tangible evidence was uncovered, Kraft could have won with a neutral arbitrator.

The severe punishment based on that crap report was a fight he needed to fight.

BobDigital said:

I made a post about why I think they cheated which his basically a list of suspicious activity not related to the science.

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So basically if Bob Smith was acting "suspicious" about the murder of Joe blow but Joe Blow was still alive you would still think Bob Smith may have done it.

Ahhhhhh brilliant.

BobDigital said:

I know conspiracy fits but it is kind of a strong term to use here. As for Brady... Honestly idk. There is a lot more suspicion surrounding McNally than Brady for me.

If McNally did something he probably did so on Brady's order or at least had a wink/nod. Also he did lie about knowing McNally IMO and also did not hand over his text.

I don't feel quiet as strong as 55/45 here (which is what I said is my guess on McNally doing something with the balls) as you are branching out suspicions form one person to implicate another who would very likely be connected... Maybe 50/50 on Brady. IDK.

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so evidence isn't part of your analysis, just a feeling huh?

RhodyPatriot said:

For Kraft nothing is more important than his own legacy.
That's all this is.

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If true, he's severely disconnected from reality.

This thread is bringing out all the Beta males.

Only Pat fans would wonder if Pats cheated when the Pats balls were in normal range. Cheating is gaining a competitive advantage, and sticking a needle in a ball so the psi goes down .1 is not that. >Tampering big ****e
Besides that if I was TB and I saw this thread...I would say what the heck am I fighting for, our own fans dont believe me.
close the thread