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Florio: Source Says that Wells Report takings so long because investigation turned to the NFL


Fair, but I'm looking for a connection to Grigson. Harbaugh says he wasn't involved specifically. Pagano claims the same. I sort of want to take both at their face value, at least Pagano, b/c he had bigger fish to try that week than some ball ********.

Harbaugh I can see stirring the pot. But again, this started with Grigson. Very curious to see where his impetus came from.

Pagano would have been busy that week while Grigson would have had plenty of free time
 
Fair, but I'm looking for a connection to Grigson. Harbaugh says he wasn't involved specifically. Pagano claims the same. I sort of want to take both at their face value, at least Pagano, b/c he had bigger fish to try that week than some ball ********.

Harbaugh I can see stirring the pot. But again, this started with Grigson. Very curious to see where his impetus came from.

Based on other rumors out there, Grigson was big on catching the Pats and Pagano was upset that he interfered with the halftime of the Colts. It was supposedly chaos in their lockerroom at halftime because of it.

I think if Harbaugh and Pagano are involved, Harbaugh told Pagano and Pagano told Grigson and then Grigson ran with the ball. I don't know if there was a sting between the Kensil and the Pats if Pagano was actually involved.
 
He is sometimes right. Sometimes not even in the ball park.
Doesn't that define unreliable?




I am saying he explicitly states that he doesn't know if his source is telling him facts or rumors being spread as facts. He writes it right in the article.

Again here is the quote from Curran:



Look up the meaning apocryphal.
So he is really on what a source heard. Adding that comment just makes it like any other source.

And Wells being to Foxboro multiple times means nothing. They had problems scheduling interviews with Belichick and Brady. If they were interviewed on different days, that could account for multiple Foxboro visits.
It meant something in the context of our last discussion where you said Breers guess was proof it wasnt about the Patriots.
It means something in terms of dismissing that the Patriots are being investigated at all.
In the sea of rumors, it is just another one.



Not in the slightest. Curran isn't sure if he source is right or just spreading rumors that may considered facts.
Curran cites a source, Florio cites a source. Both could be right or wrong, but if they conflicted I would have more faith in Curran, based upon track record.



I trust Florio's source more than Curran's just because Curran states that he doesn't know if his source is right in the article.
Because Curran added that line and Florio didnt? That doesn't make Florios source better it makes Curran a better journalist.


Again Curran states in the article that he doesn't know if his sources is telling him facts. Big difference.
Not really because Florio doesn't either. Curran doesn't know if it is first hand or not. That doesn't change its value as a sourced rumor.



I am just beating you to the punch considering any "discussion" with you goes this way.
And you know that is wrong. I believe you will never find a single example of me insulting you, and am certain you will never find one that isn't retribution.
I tend to post about things I feel strongly about. The fact that I disagree with your attempts to change my opinion and do not care to be polite about it (since after all this is a message board) does not open up a license for you to act like a baby. Feel free to find any example of me insulting you, or putting words in your mouth.
 
It has been as close to confirmed as anything. But it really doesn't matter, Wells was never going to end his investigation on science alone no matter what.
How can something be as close to confirmed as anything?
How could they not have measured the balls at halftime if they say they were underinflated. They pretty much had to.
The only 'confirmation' that the balls were not measured before the game is that people jumped on Blandino using 'gauged' instead of measured.
There is nothing but unsupported rumor about this.

What are you using as the 'close to confirmed as anything'? Did I miss something?
 
I think if Harbaugh and Pagano are involved, Harbaugh told Pagano and Pagano told Grigson and then Grigson ran with the ball. I don't know if there was a sting between the Kensil and the Pats if Pagano was actually involved.

Yeah, could very well be, but I thought it's been said Pagano didn't know anything about it, at all, until mid-game. Maybe he's FOS though. Either way, that chain of events is probably what I'm most interested in when this report comes out.
 
Fair, but I'm looking for a connection to Grigson. Harbaugh says he wasn't involved specifically. Pagano claims the same. I sort of want to take both at their face value, at least Pagano, b/c he had bigger fish to try that week than some ball ********.

Harbaugh I can see stirring the pot. But again, this started with Grigson. Very curious to see where his impetus came from.

I understand that you want to make a direct connection and maybe Brown did give Grigson the heads up. However I don't think any info flows from BAL to Indy without a conversation first between Brown & Harbaugh, then Harbaugh & Pagano and lastly Pagano & Grigson. Seeing that it's at a GM level, I bet Ozzie was in the loop as well. Hell, I wouldn't put it past Biscotti and Irsay chit-chatting over the issue. Both are slime balls....
 
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Doesn't that define unreliable?

It defines any reporter who lives off of rumors. Same goes with almost every reporter. Even guys like Adam Schefter fall into this categtor.




So he is really on what a source heard. Adding that comment just makes it like any other source.

He is just saying what Mike Reiss said. He is hearing this, but he doesn't know if it is true or not. Reiss doubted the motives of his source. Curran just doesn't know if his source is just spreading rumors he thinks are facts.




It meant something in the context of our last discussion where you said Breers guess was proof it wasnt about the Patriots.
It means something in terms of dismissing that the Patriots are being investigated at all.
In the sea of rumors, it is just another one.

And you are complaining about me putting word in my mouth. Everyone other than Sharks of Vegas knows the Wells investigation will be largely about the Pats. Breer never said otherwise. He just said he thinks the key part of the report will be about the League and Colts. Huge difference.



Curran cites a source, Florio cites a source. Both could be right or wrong, but if they conflicted I would have more faith in Curran, based upon track record.

The sources do not conflict at all. Curran doesn't talk about what his sources are saying about the investigation of the Patriots. Florio is only talking that his source says that Wells looks to be looking at the league with the same effort that Curran said his source is doing with the Patriots. Neither report confirms or denies the other. Curran never says that his source said that the investigation is exclusively or even primarily on the Patriots. Florio never says that Curran's report is false and that the investigation has turned away from the Pats.

This is a case where both Curran's and Florio's sources could be 100% correct. I am having a hard time finding a single way these sources contradict each other. Wells has been investigating this thing for nearly three months. I am sure he has put everyone involved under a microscope from the Pats to Kensil to Grigson to the refs to whoever.


Because Curran added that line and Florio didnt? That doesn't make Florios source better it makes Curran a better journalist.

When a reporter openly questions the validity of his source, I always give it less weight. If Curran had a strong feeling about his source, he wouldn't have added that line. The direct quote Curran puts in the article seems like hyperbole to begin with.



Not really because Florio doesn't either. Curran doesn't know if it is first hand or not. That doesn't change its value as a sourced rumor.

Again, if Curran openly questions the validity of the source's information in the article. It does change the value as a sourced rumor.




And you know that is wrong. I believe you will never find a single example of me insulting you, and am certain you will never find one that isn't retribution.
I tend to post about things I feel strongly about. The fact that I disagree with your attempts to change my opinion and do not care to be polite about it (since after all this is a message board) does not open up a license for you to act like a baby. Feel free to find any example of me insulting you, or putting words in your mouth.

You are insulting and condescending to everyone you argue with. Not just me. And yes, you have insulted me multiple times calling my arguments stupid and stuff like that. It seems like such in your nature that maybe you just don't see it when you post it. You insult people all the time.
 
Oh please, please, let this lead to the downfall of R. Stokoe Goodell.

View attachment 9154
Nah. But, if we're lucky, he'll throw Kensil and a couple of others under the bus and apologize to the Pats, not for conducting the investigation but for what it revealed of how his staff behaved.
I'll choose to say that that is a glass that is half full.
 
How can something be as close to confirmed as anything?
How could they not have measured the balls at halftime if they say they were underinflated. They pretty much had to.
The only 'confirmation' that the balls were not measured before the game is that people jumped on Blandino using 'gauged' instead of measured.
There is nothing but unsupported rumor about this.

What are you using as the 'close to confirmed as anything'? Did I miss something?

Again, it has been pretty much confirmed that they did not RECORD the air pressure for the balls. I never said they didn't check the air pressure. They measured the balls at halftime to see how much under regulation they were. Not how much each ball deflated from when the refs first gauged them. That is a huge difference. We know that 11 balls were under 13.5 PSI, but I don't think (actually I am pretty sure I know) anyone knows how much each ball lost in air pressure from those two points.

Science is about facts. If you do not have all the facts, it becomes a theory not fact. You cannot use science to prove anything without facts.
 
Yeah, could very well be, but I thought it's been said Pagano didn't know anything about it, at all, until mid-game. Maybe he's FOS though. Either way, that chain of events is probably what I'm most interested in when this report comes out.

I think that if there is any hard damning evidence, it will be against people in the league and/or the Colts.

I think Goodell distancing himself from the whole thing is the most damning thing for Kensil and others in the League office. The fact he said specifically that if Grigson told the league that he didn't know looks to be him getting ready to make someone in the League office the fall guy (whether it is right or not).

You add that Kraft around the same time said that he doesn't blame Goodell, but people in the league office tells me that it is fairly widely known at the upper echalon level that the Wells Report is not going to look good for the League office.
 
Again, it has been pretty much confirmed that they did not RECORD the air pressure for the balls. I never said they didn't check the air pressure. They measured the balls at halftime to see how much under regulation they were. Not how much each ball deflated from when the refs first gauged them. That is a huge difference. We know that 11 balls were under 13.5 PSI, but I don't think (actually I am pretty sure I know) anyone knows how much each ball lost in air pressure from those two points.

Science is about facts. If you do not have all the facts, it becomes a theory not fact. You cannot use science to prove anything without facts.
Please show me the confirmation that the balls were not measured.
You don't have to go off about what is scientific, the point at hand is that you are saying it has been 'as close to confirmed as anything' that they did not.
I don't believe that is that case, so show me your facts.
 
Fair point

It's a mess, BradyManny. I think this thing became 1000 times larger in scope than the league ever thought possible- thus the reason Ted Wells and his band of merry Kenneth Starr wanna-bes have included the Colts, the Ravens (big assumption here) and the NFL game-day ops people in its investigation.

Lets hope (non-Patriots) heads roll...
 
I think Goodell distancing himself from the whole thing is the most damning thing for Kensil and others in the League office.

Same. Which is why - on the whole - I'm excited, not nervous, for this report to come out. At the very least, it will provide some offseason entertainment.
 
Please show me the confirmation that the balls were not measured.
You don't have to go off about what is scientific, the point at hand is that you are saying it has been 'as close to confirmed as anything' that they did not.
I don't believe that is that case, so show me your facts.

I am sorry, I misspoke. That isn't pretty much confirmed. It was 100% confirmed. Dean Blandino, head of officials, confirmed that pregame all balls were only given pass/fail ratings and the PSI was not recorded.

The NFL has no proof that the NFL referee checked the PSI in the Patriots’ footballs prior to the AFC Championship Game, the league’s VP of officiating Dean Blandino told a group of reporters after a news conference Thursday. NFL officials don’t log the PSI in footballs. They either approve them or disapprove them.


http://nesn.com/2015/01/dean-blandino-deflategate-wasnt-a-sting-psi-in-footballs-werent-logged/

Whether they did it at halftime is irrelevant for scientific standpoint.

Again, with no data stating how much each ball was deflated, it is impossible to exonerate or incriminate the Pats on science alone.
 
So the 4,767 quote pissing contest is on?

I'm done. Andy and I can go away think that we each won the argument. Unless anyone is up for us arguing for 10 pages why each of know we won the argument. Anyone?
 


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