Comforting tweet from Sharks of Vegas

Koma said:

Did anyone here post on the old ESPN Patriots board? I ask because SOV sounds a little like the NewEnglandInsider poster. NewEnglandInsider showed up in the late spring or maybe summer of 2008 and made a bunch of authoritative statements about the inner workings of the team; things like how much the team like Mayo and how team management disliked Matt Walsh. It sounded good and was presented in a convincing manner, but some posters (not me) were sharp enough to notice that NEInsider wasn't saying anything that wasn't already public info. For example, he didn't say anything about the team targeting Mayo before the draft and the team being unhappy about a former employee who said negative things about him wasn't a surprising leap in logic. He only made 2 or 3 posts, but enough people had caught onto NEInsider's act and he disappeared.

The situations are different, but I kind of feel the same way about the SOV tweets. I'd like his predictions on this matter to be true, but he really hasn't shown that he has any inside information. SOV wasn't first in mentioning Kensil and we probably won't know until the Wells report comes out if his other statements are accurate. If would be great for Patriots fans if SOV is right and it would be a bonus for SOV's credibility if they're right, but I'm skeptical at this point.

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Yep, I was a regular over there. I remember NEInsider. Wanted to believe he/she was legit. As you know that board was badly moderated and unreadable a lot of the time from trolls running wild and NEInsider's posts just seemed like an awful lot of effort if he or she just wanted to post for kicks.

FWIW I do remember NEInsider was the first to mention a "cheerleader tape" and this was not public info yet....

I guess we'll see how right SOV is....

BradyManny said:

EXHIBIT A:
January 25th, 1:50 pm.
Tom E Curran posts the first mention of Mike Kensil.
January 25th, 7:10 pm.
Sharks of Vegas‏@SharksOfVegas
Mike Kensil, remember that name guys.......

6 hours later, they piggyback Tom E's hard work and get credit for it.

EXHIBIT B:
February 6th, 11 AM
Schefter goes on WEEI on February 6th, says some people think the Colts deflated the ball on their sideline.
February 6th, 12:45 PM
Sharks of Vegas‏@SharksOfVegas
We heard some rumors that the NFL believes the Colts tampered with the D'Qwell Jackson ball but they are still rumors at this point.

If by "heard some rumors" they meant "listened to WEEI today and heard Adam Schefter say," then they have made an accurate statement.

Be skeptical, and do not believe the hype. We've seen guys like this on the internet before.

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I'm talking about the early message board posts (Boston Barstool) when he said the NFL had nothing on the Patriots. This came out well before the press conferences, it came out on Tuesday, long before everybody.

The evidence is even on this board. We were all reading the Shark quotes here before we knew anything else about the case. There are threads on this very board that prove it.

upstater1 said:

I'm talking about the early message board posts (Boston Barstool) when he said the NFL had nothing on the Patriots. This came out well before the press conferences, it came out on Tuesday, long before everybody.

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I'm sure if you perused patsfans, you would see posters here making similar comments to Sharks of Vegas. However, they attributed it to common sense or understanding of science, not nebulous sources like Sharks of Vegas.

Here's what SoV did say that week:

Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 22
Official announcement is expected sometime over the weekend. NFL simply has no "proof" the Patriots themselves tampered with the balls.

300 retweets108 favorites
Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 22
BREAKING - Our source has CONFIRMED there will be NO penalties imposed on the Patriots by the NFL in the wake of deflategate.

The notion that the NFL had no proof of tampering at that point was not unique at that point. The only new information in those tweets are that definitively no penalties were to be imposed on the Patriots and that it would be announced over the weekend. That information turned out to be absolutely false. They may be right that the Patriots ultimately are not punished, but the one thing in that statement that required something beyond common sense was the timing of the announcement. They were wrong.

Sorry, these guys are no different than you, I or any poster on here. They are taking what information they have, applying common sense, and coming to a conclusion. The only difference is that as we don't make a living off of seeming informed about sports, we're not trying to make it seem like we have inside intel.

patman52 said:

Grigson is a Purdue grad

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If Grigson got a college degree, it had to be on the special "football team track". The guy is dumber than a field of corn.

BradyManny said:

EXHIBIT A:


EXHIBIT B:
February 6th, 11 AM
Schefter goes on WEEI on February 6th, says some people think the Colts deflated the ball on their sideline.
February 6th, 12:45 PM
Sharks of Vegas‏@SharksOfVegas
We heard some rumors that the NFL believes the Colts tampered with the D'Qwell Jackson ball but they are still rumors at this point.

If by "heard some rumors" they meant "listened to WEEI today and heard Adam Schefter say," then they have made an accurate statement.

Be skeptical, and do not believe the hype. We've seen guys like this on the internet before.

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LOL - - He wasn't piggybacking Schefter. Schefter didn't invent that. WE were saying that well before Feb 6th.

shmessy said:

LOL - - He wasn't piggybacking Schefter. Schefter didn't invent that. WE were saying that well before Feb 6th.

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Right, SoV has said nothing unique that has turned out to be right.

The point is, in two cases, hours after a release of real story with unique information by a legitimate reporter, Sharks Of Vegas comes out and makes it sound like they have breaking news from their sources. That's not a coincidence. Add to that, the most specific prediction they have made (no punishment, announcement on weekend between AFCCG & Super Bowl) proved to be very wrong.

upstater1 said:

The evidence is even on this board. We were all reading the Shark quotes here before we knew anything else about the case. There are threads on this very board that prove it.

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Schefter said on January 22nd that the league was having trouble finding any evidence. Later that day, SoV released the tweets I cited above, saying the NFL had nothing. That was their first tweets of substance on the matter.

Well, technically, this is their first deflategate tweet:

Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 18
Haters, LICK MY BALLS!

But aside from that, their first tweets above were their first comments on deflategate (NFL has nothing, no punishment coming). And all they did was take something Schefter said, then take it further, and where they took it further, they were 100% wrong.

On January 25th, Profootballtalk says that only one of the balls was a full 2 PSI under. Later that day, SoV tweets:

Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 25
CONFIRMED - 10 of the 11 balls that were first reported as "significantly" under inflated, were in the 11.5 range

That's four examples of them tweeting something after someone legitimate did. The reason why you can't come up with any specific examples of how they were right and can only quote a vague sense of them being on top of things is because if you look specifically, you see they did not break anything. In all these cases, they are relying on you forgetting that someone else broke it first. In some cases, they would go on to say something even more dramatically pro-Patriot and anytime they said something new, it was wrong.

Trust me, I want them to be right. And I think they very well might be, but I sincerely doubt its from any inside information. At times I have trusted them during this whole mess, but as I go back and look at what they tweeted and when they tweeted it, it's very clear that they do not have sources.

BradyManny said:

Add to that, the most specific prediction they have made (no punishment, announcement on weekend between AFCCG & Super Bowl) proved to be very wrong.

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Perhaps not. If the NFL had evidence at that point they would have punished the Patriots and not called in Wells. They didn't call in Wells for the Browns or the Falcons at the same time to do a comprehensive investigation. I think is is 100% clear that the NFL had no proof at that juncture. Kraft upped the stakes demanding an apology. I think that it was headed to there was no proof against the Patriots and thus no penalties at that point.

My guess is this was a sting between Ravens, Colts and NFL. Ravens measured in that cold day they lost (below freezing). Brady made know the rules dig, Ravens tell Colts, Colts tell NFL (Grigson-Kensil) Colts intercepted ball, immediately measure it, it is down a pound so they take another pound out to match what Ravens said, Girigson tells Kensil who jumps, finds rest of the balls down a pound, figures they have the Patriots and blow it to the press who go nuts.

Kensil can't find proof, science starts to emerge, Kensil gets worried and half truth leaks start (11 down 2 PSI, Ball boy takes balls in secret room etc...) Now as far as the reports on the 11 balls down and 1 ok, it gets kind of awkward here. Did not Blount toss a ball in the stands the 1st quarter? If so there should only be 11 balls at the half but they talk about 12. The new 12th being the unapproved ball submitted by an NFL official attempting to replace the stolen ball. Additionally why would any kicker deflate a K ball? That makes no sense.

Neither the Colts or the Ravens measured their own footballs as they wouldn't think of it because they knew they did not deflate them. It never occurred to the Ravens, Colts or NFL sting team that science was behind it because they are all blinded by hatred of the Patriots. They ended up creating an out of control press firestorm which thank god did not keep the Patriots from winning. I am confident the Patriots did nothing with the PSI, tests have confirmed the drop is a requierment of science.

BradyManny said:

I'm sure if you perused patsfans, you would see posters here making similar comments to Sharks of Vegas. However, they attributed it to common sense or understanding of science, not nebulous sources like Sharks of Vegas.

Here's what SoV did say that week:

Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 22
Official announcement is expected sometime over the weekend. NFL simply has no "proof" the Patriots themselves tampered with the balls.

300 retweets108 favorites
Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 22
BREAKING - Our source has CONFIRMED there will be NO penalties imposed on the Patriots by the NFL in the wake of deflategate.

The notion that the NFL had no proof of tampering at that point was not unique at that point. The only new information in those tweets are that definitively no penalties were to be imposed on the Patriots and that it would be announced over the weekend. That information turned out to be absolutely false. They may be right that the Patriots ultimately are not punished, but the one thing in that statement that required something beyond common sense was the timing of the announcement. They were wrong.

Sorry, these guys are no different than you, I or any poster on here. They are taking what information they have, applying common sense, and coming to a conclusion. The only difference is that as we don't make a living off of seeming informed about sports, we're not trying to make it seem like we have inside intel.

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Troy Vincent also said the matter would be wrapped up in a few days. He must not have any inside information.

Dr Pain said:

Perhaps not. If the NFL had evidence at that point they would have punished the Patriots and not called in Wells. They didn't call in Wells for the Browns or the Falcons at the same time to do a comprehensive investigation. I think is is 100% clear that the NFL had no proof at that juncture. Kraft upped the stakes demanding an apology. I think that it was headed to there was no proof against the Patriots and thus no penalties at that point.

My guess is this was a sting between Ravens, Colts and NFL.

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I think this is a perfectly valid narrative - and would love if it were the case. But the key word here is that you admit this is your guess based on the information available to you. Sharks Of Vegas is doing the same thing, but not calling a spade a spade.

Those criticizing SOV have yet to post anything they were wrong about other than the timing of the investigation and the league office was wrong about that at the same time. SOV may or may not turn out to be right but so far they have not been wrong or someone would have posted it.

Ivan said:

Troy Vincent also said the matter would be wrapped up in a few days. He must not have any inside information.

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That has nothing to do with whether SoV had accurate information or not. SoV didn't just say it would be wrapped up in a few days, they said an announcement of no punishment would come over the weekend. That hypothesis proved false.

We're going out of our way to try and justify SoV's mistakes because we all want them to be right. And again, they might be right because of their intuition, but there's overwhelming evidence they have no inside information. Let's not make the mistakes of our detractors, folks.

Ivan said:

Those criticizing SOV have yet to post anything they were wrong about other than the timing of the investigation and the league office was wrong about that at the same time. SOV may or may not turn out to be right but so far they have not been wrong or someone would have posted it.

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OK, so someone has:

- not been right about anything that a media outlet didn't report first
- been wrong about the one thing that a media outlet didn't report first

Why would you believe this person's further speculation anymore than any other person on Twitter or patsfans or wherever? You should demand more from so-called inside sources. They should be treated with great skepticism, especially when they exhibit the behavior of someone like SoV (quick "inside scoop" posts right after another media member broke something.)

SOV has posted nothing that many of us said, only we said it earlier.
ALL of their "significant" tweets have followed within hours posts by other journalist sources.

The only exception was when they said it would be over in 3 days, it wasn't.

Please someone, anyone post a SOV tweet on a new news item EARLIER than a Curran, etc. article or statement.

BradyManny said:

I'm sure if you perused patsfans, you would see posters here making similar comments to Sharks of Vegas. However, they attributed it to common sense or understanding of science, not nebulous sources like Sharks of Vegas.

Here's what SoV did say that week:

Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 22
Official announcement is expected sometime over the weekend. NFL simply has no "proof" the Patriots themselves tampered with the balls.

300 retweets108 favorites
Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · Jan 22
BREAKING - Our source has CONFIRMED there will be NO penalties imposed on the Patriots by the NFL in the wake of deflategate.

The notion that the NFL had no proof of tampering at that point was not unique at that point. The only new information in those tweets are that definitively no penalties were to be imposed on the Patriots and that it would be announced over the weekend. That information turned out to be absolutely false. They may be right that the Patriots ultimately are not punished, but the one thing in that statement that required something beyond common sense was the timing of the announcement. They were wrong.

Sorry, these guys are no different than you, I or any poster on here. They are taking what information they have, applying common sense, and coming to a conclusion. The only difference is that as we don't make a living off of seeming informed about sports, we're not trying to make it seem like we have inside intel.

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Read my post again. There were message board posts before the tweets. SOV said he spoke to someone in the Patriots who said that it was certain that no one on the Patriots messed with the balls.

This came out long before anything like that was said anywhere, including on the message boards. No one here said that no Patriot employee had messed with the balls prior to SOV. No one.

upstater1 said:

Read my post again. There were message board posts before the tweets. SOV said he spoke to someone in the Patriots who said that it was certain that no one on the Patriots messed with the balls.

This came out long before anything like that was said anywhere, including on the message boards. No one here said that no Patriot employee had messed with the balls prior to SOV. No one.

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Sorry - my bad, I only looked at the tweets. Which board?

I'm not sure about no one here saying the Patriots employees hadn't messed with the balls. I think folks like @PatsWickedPissah were on the science from the getgo. Original deflategate thread:

PV = NRT
if a ball is inflated to league minimum in a locker room temp environ then brought outside to a lower T what do you think will happen to P?

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Similarly, by page 2 of the original deflategate thread, @Danger Zone posted a temperature-pressure post that referenced Sports Science and had this quote:

a football kept at 10°F for an hour had its air pressure reduced by 20 percent—which makes them less bouncy.

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Blizzzard posted a similar thing that day. Neuronet as well.

1/19 Jeff Howe says:

Jeff Howe ‏@jeffphowe 2m2 minutes ago
Reading ball rules, it seems pretty damn difficult for a team to sabotage balls during a game. Much ado about nothing in my opinion.

And not to toot my own horn, but my initial post on 1/19 on the matter was:

Embrace the hate. PV = nRT MFers.

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Matt Chatham dismissed it from day one.

Lots of people assumed Patriot innocence, some out of loyalty, some out of reason. Unless given reason to otherwise, I don't see any evidence SoV has any inside info.

BradyManny said:

I think this is a perfectly valid narrative - and would love if it were the case. But the key word here is that you admit this is your guess based on the information available to you. Sharks Of Vegas is doing the same thing, but not calling a spade a spade.

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I haven't studied their tweets but don't ever recall them stating they had an inside source. Honestly I think any of us could say I heard, read, was told pretty much anything based on this group

And it is nice they have 106k followers. Getting the message out that things are not as they seem has value. I only have 7 followers

Dr Pain said:

I haven't studied their tweets but don't ever recall them stating they had an inside source. Honestly I think any of us could say I heard, read, was told pretty much anything based on this group

And it is nice they have 106k followers. Getting the message out that things are not as they seem has value. I only have 7 followers

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Well they've referenced "our source" or "source" a few times.

Accuracy will be confirmed once Wells finally releases his report, but its "entertaining" at least.

Now he's calling out Indy media:

Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · 1h 1 hour ago


Do you have your apology ready? @GreggDoyelStar

juny said:

Accuracy will be confirmed once Wells finally releases his report, but its "entertaining" at least.

Now he's calling out Indy media:

Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · 1h 1 hour ago


Do you have your apology ready? @GreggDoyelStar

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I torture Doyle and Kravitz on twitter about this every once and a while too. Small payback when I have a slow day Those two have been too busy with their years long investigation of the Suck for Luck campaign to talk Deflategate though.