Ranking the CBs in the draft

This is just my rank of the top players of note. I have said often I would be happy with near anyone from this group but I figure why not split hairs and start a little debate.

#1 Trae Waynes - This is by default. I know we can't get him so I have not watched any tape on him. Just included as a foot note before the real list starts.

#2 Byron Jones - He IMO has the highest upside of any CB in this draft. Maybe any player period. The tape is not far behind but there is a gap and you need to wonder if he can reach it.

#3 Marcus Peters - The best press corner in the draft. Tons of upside himself but he is more pro ready than Jones. Only off the field issues knock him down and potentially off this board all together if anything else comes up.

#4 Alex Carter - Considered perhaps the most NFL ready CB in the draft. Lacks the upside of those listed above but still projects to have a solid career as a starting #1 CB.

#5 Jalen Collins - Would be higher if he was not injured.

#6 PJ Williams - Is a bit like a slightly less talented Peters. I see him as a very solid press corner but his upside though high is not as high. Also seems to be over aggressive so more prone to rookie mistakes.

#7 Ronald Darby - He is a tough one to rank. Clearly has talent but I wonder if it will catch up to his ability as he is probably the 2nd best athlete on this list. Though I think he will find it hard to play press at the next level as he seems a bit smaller and softer than many above listed guys.

#8 Kevin Johnson - This low is probably a shock but I think you need to keep in in context of how close these players are (particularly 4-8). His combine numbers are great but his tape looked a bit slow comparatively. Maybe he needs to work on recognition and be coached up. He is steady but seeing the athlete he is on the combine makes me wonder why his tape didn't jump more.

HMs

Quinten Rollins - too raw for my taste for a top 2 round pick
Doran Grant - Hips don't look fluid and seems limited
Josh Shaw - Minor off the field stuff knocks him down a bit and he was borderline anyway.
D'Journ Smith - Have just not seen enough tape on him yet but the little I have seen makes me think he deserves an HM at least.

Edit: Also subject to change as I am still learning about them and have only really looked closely the last 2 weeks at this position.

Going mostly by the speed numbers. Waynes 1 , Jones 2 (probably goes higher because of fantastic combine numbers) Collins 3 (may drop because of injury) and I love Rowe (Utah) CB/S (I hope there at 96/97/103. All above sub 4:50 40yd

I rate Peters well ahead of Waynes.

I have a strong bias towards guys who can excel in press-man coverage, though versatility is important.

My top 9 for the Pats (ignoring Waynes):

1. Marcus Peters
2. Byron Jones
3. Kevin Johnson
4. Jalen Collins
5. Eric Rowe
6. PJ Williams
7. Josh Shaw
8. Quentin Rollins
9. Alex Carter

Honestly with our track record on CB's I'd want to take a guy like Carter

meatface said:

Honestly with our track record on CB's I'd want to take a guy like Carter

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Knowing BB he probably takes PJ Williams cause he also has good STs value.

BobDigital said:

Knowing BB he probably takes PJ Williams cause he also has good STs value.

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I wouldn't have a problem with that. Williams wouldn't be my first choice, but he's tough in press man, has good natural instincts, and can contribute immediately.

PJ williams is a great tackler. Very aggressive. Just not sure about his long speed and he would get called for a few penalties in the NFL as far as interference.

kennyb said:

PJ williams is a great tackler. Very aggressive. Just not sure about his long speed and he would get called for a few penalties in the NFL as far as interference.

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He reminds me of a thinner Brandon Browner. If he gets his hands on the WR at the LOS, the play is over for the WR. If the wideout beats him off the press, Williams could be in trouble deep.

mayoclinic said:

I rate Peters well ahead of Waynes.

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You were certainly right last year thinking BB would look past Easly's injury history for the upside. Now the question if he'll do the same for Peters character concerns.

mayoclinic said:

I have a strong bias towards guys who can excel in press-man coverage, though versatility is important.

My top 9 for the Pats (ignoring Waynes):

1. Marcus Peters
2. Byron Jones
3. Kevin Johnson
4. Jalen Collins
5. Eric Rowe
6. PJ Williams
7. Josh Shaw
8. Quentin Rollins
9. Alex Carter

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I more or less agree with your rankings and definitely agree on press man and versatility. Throwing out Peters character concerns he's the only one who's natural in press however he's not nearly as fluid in off-man or zone. After him I think there's a drop off and the rest are arguable. So that being the case I like Rowe towards the end of the second as a much great value than Jones and especially Johnson and Collins towards the top. I really think Johnson and Collins are scheme limited.

Rollins is an interesting prospect. He fits the trajectory question that was posed. After not playing football since HS he had a great year but is raw. If this was last year I would have made a case to draft and red shirt him. I think a year learning from Revis he has the athletic ability and quick feet to evolve into a great corner.

everlong said:

You were certainly right last year thinking BB would look past Easly's injury history for the upside. Now the question if he'll do the same for Peters character concerns.

I more or less agree with your rankings and definitely agree on press man and versatility. Throwing out Peters character concerns he's the only one who's natural in press however he's not nearly as fluid in off-man or zone. After him I think there's a drop off and the rest are arguable. So that being the case I like Rowe towards the end of the second as a much great value than Jones and especially Johnson and Collins towards the top. I really think Johnson and Collins are scheme limited.

Rollins is an interesting prospect. He fits the trajectory question that was posed. After not playing football since HS he had a great year but is raw. If this was last year I would have made a case to draft and red shirt him. I think a year learning from Revis he has the athletic ability and quick feet to evolve into a great corner.

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Right now I'm Peters > Jones > Johnson with our 1st pick, and Collins > Rowe > PJ Williams with our 2nd (and potentially a trade up), but that could change. Peters and Rowe and really the two guys I like best. I had been hoping we might luck into Peters at 32 and get Rowe at the end of the 3rd, but that's not happening. I'm not sure yet about Rollins. Raw is one thing. Raw and lacking foot speed is another.

mayoclinic said:

Right now I'm Peters > Jones > Johnson with our 1st pick, and Collins > Rowe > PJ Williams with our 2nd (and potentially a trade up), but that could change. Peters and Rowe and really the two guys I like best. I had been hoping we might luck into Peters at 32 and get Rowe at the end of the 3rd, but that's not happening.

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I really don't know if I'd use 32 on any of them just because of the dismissal. I think Rowe in the late second is the best value with a lot of upside, flexibility and press man capable.

mayoclinic said:

I'm not sure yet about Rollins. Raw is one thing. Raw and lacking foot speed is another.

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Peters 4.53 '40', 37.5 VJ, 121 BJ, 7.08 3C, 4.08 SS, 11.26 LS
Rollins 4.57 '40', 36.5 VJ, 122 BJ, 7.10 3C, 4.28 SS, 11.53 LS

I don't think his film shows a lack of foot speed and the combine numbers are pretty comparable. Either way I cannot see using a guy who even by my standards needs a red shirt year in the second. If he happens to last to our cluster at 96, 97 and 101 I think I'd roll the dice.

Matt Miller:

(PJ)Williams is a target for the Saints and Patriots at the end of Round 1.

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https://twitter.com/nfldraftscout/status/581519037475127296

I've asked him whether he actually knows this for a fact. It would surprise me if he does. I'll let you know if he responds.

Belichick is more likely to take character and other risks as the draft goes on but generally wants high character players early. I doubt he would take Peters in the first.

Ivan said:

Belichick is more likely to take character and other risks as the draft goes on but generally wants high character players early. I doubt he would take Peters in the first.

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I'm not sure it's necessarily character he's interested in, but intelligence. Of course the two tend to go hand in hand.

mayoclinic said:

Right now I'm Peters > Jones > Johnson with our 1st pick, and Collins > Rowe > PJ Williams with our 2nd (and potentially a trade up), but that could change. Peters and Rowe and really the two guys I like best. I had been hoping we might luck into Peters at 32 and get Rowe at the end of the 3rd, but that's not happening. I'm not sure yet about Rollins. Raw is one thing. Raw and lacking foot speed is another.

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I agree with this 100%. Peters tape is really special. I would be very happy if we took him at 32.

Hey Manx.
Ur opinion on this guy. SaQwan Edwards? Converted from WR to CB.

mihap said:

Hey Manx.
Ur opinion on this guy. SaQwan Edwards? Converted from WR to CB.

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I'd never heard of him so I googled him. First thing I found out was that he's a 6', 200lb CB which is nice the second thing I found out was that he'd been accused of rape although the charges had been dropped. Unless you have a compelling reason to consider him, I think a rape allegation puts me off to be honest.

I saw someone writing about him and first thing on my mind was, lets ask manx

A day three guy I think they'll take a look at is Justin Coleman of Tenn. I think he has both slot and outside potential. Is a very good special teams player. Against Alabama he looked better than Jalen Collins did on Amari Cooper. But more or less you're drafting him on his athleticism and hoping he can develop and become more consistent. Very good in run support.

He had the best 3-cone of any DB at the combine and was top 6 in the short shuttle, long shuttle and bench. 5'11" and 185 with the short area quickness, his 4.53 40 wasn't bad, I think he has definite slot potential and he plays tougher than his size.

manxman2601 said:

Matt Miller:



https://twitter.com/nfldraftscout/status/581519037475127296

I've asked him whether he actually knows this for a fact. It would surprise me if he does. I'll let you know if he responds.

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I can't exactly put my finger on it, but I am not a huge PJ Williams fan. On tape, the plays that put him in a positive light were when he was blitzing. He loses track of the ball and panics, and that leads to him getting very grabby. I would be disappointed with that pick at the end of round 1.