The NE Fountain of Youth (Locked)

Ivan said:

And THE FACT IS that this case is far worse and whether it's a swap or a straight pick it's worth far more than the Briggs case.

1) The 49ers weren't on notice from a previous tamper that year

The Jets were on notice from a previous tamper that year

2) The 49ers had trade discussions with the Bears and were in contact with the NFL Management Council.

The Jets and Patriots had no contact and there was no trade in the works.

3) Woody Johnson publicly tampered with Revis

The 49ers never publicly tampered with Briggs.

4) The 49ers are not in the same division as the Bears.

The Jets are a Division rival.

5) The 49ers never leaked discussions of high level talks to land Briggs.

The Jets not only leaked that they were in discussions about signing Revis they leaked the exact details of the deal that was signed.

6) The 49ers never signed Lance Briggs,

The Jets signed Revis within hours of him becoming a free agent to a front loaded deal the Patriots couldn't possibly match.




Feel free to make a case for a 4th rounder, I have made my case.

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This your OPINION. This summation is not based on any FACTS as you requested from me. I merely provided them for you. A swap of 4ths is my OPINION based on the FACTS of previous documented cases.

Would I be psyched if the punishment were stiffer and we benefitted even better, hell ya! I'm just tempering my expectations is all. I agree it's worse, but I'm not so confident the jaded commissioners decision making process will reflect that.

Ivan said:

And for the record that isn't a case for a forth rounder it is simply a note that prior sanctions were swaps. I'll take the 6 for the 32..

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Yeahhhh, I don't see that happening. You are aware of who the commissioner is, correct?

OhExaulted1 said:

This your OPINION. This summation is not based on any FACTS as you requested from me. I merely provided them for you. A swap of 4ths is my OPINION based on the FACTS of previous documented cases.

Would I be psyched if the punishment were stiffer and we benefitted even better, hell ya! I'm just tempering my expectations is all. I agree it's worse, but I'm not so confident the jaded commissioners decision making process will reflect that.

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In other words you can't rebut it and you are simply going on exactly what I said you were going on........ But but but Goodell.............


I don't care about what people think of the league office I care about what the Jets did and what the sanction SHOULD be. If they f.ck the Patriots that's the way it goes but we should still be really clear about what was done to them.

OhExaulted1 said:

This your OPINION. This summation is not based on any FACTS as you requested from me. I merely provided them for you. A swap of 4ths is my OPINION based on the FACTS of previous documented cases.

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The case I made is fact based, Revis isn't in the hall yet but other than that it was all facts.

Ivan said:

The case I made is fact based, Revis isn't in the hall yet but other than that it was all facts.

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Well then call Roger up and give him the earfull. Don't yell at me!

OhExaulted1 said:

Yeahhhh, I don't see that happening. You are aware of who the commissioner is, correct?

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How can anyone have a discussion regarding what happened and what the consequences should be when this is the response?

Ivan said:

How can anyone have a discussion regarding what happened and what the consequences should be when this is the response?

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See response above.

Ivan said:

How can anyone have a discussion regarding what happened and what the consequences should be when this is the response?

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Besides, what you believe they should be and what will actually happen are probably very far apart being your a Patriot fan. Jus' sayin'.

OhExaulted1 said:

Besides, what you believe they should be and what will actually happen are probably very far apart being your a Patriot fan. Jus' sayin'.

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In basing it off of precedent. The Briggs case pales in comparison. It was a single incident with a good player who the 49ers never signed and they aren't division rivals. The Revis case involved repeated tampering in division with a top 3 defensive player, and the Jets signed him.

OhExaulted1 said:

See response above.

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Oh, OK, I thought you actually had a point, now I realize you don't.

Ivan said:

In basing it off of precedent. The Briggs case pales in comparison. It was a single incident with a good player who the 49ers never signed and they aren't division rivals. The Revis case involved repeated tampering in division with a top 3 defensive player, and the Jets signed him.

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It's actually alot like the Cunningham case really. The only charge that's on record as being filed is Woody shooting his mouth off on Dec. 29th. If the league or the Patriots decide they want to file additional charges sounds good to me, but currently that is all that's on the record unless you've seen an additional statement of some kind.

Ivan said:

Oh, OK, I thought you actually had a point, now I realize you don't.

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And your point is to rationalize to me what you think the punishment should be. 6 for 32, sounds great man, but I'm not the one making those decisions and I don't have much faith in the guy who is.

OhExaulted1 said:

And your point is to rationalize to me what you think the punishment should be. 6 for 32, sounds great man, but I'm not the one making those decisions and I don't have much faith in the guy who is.

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What I said was that I have yet to see a fact based argument that calls for less than high draft pick as the sanction, all I have seen are arguments saying that Goodell will screw them, and in that case no discussion is necessary. The same goes for deflategate, if your opinion is simply that Goodell will screw them then there is no point discussing it. To me both are worth discussing and making fact based arguments on, regardless of what the league does.

When it came to "spygate" the Patriots rolled over and took it, that shouldn't happen and it was actually Patriot fans who took the time and made the effort to make the case the Patriots should have made, and had they made those arguments and their case my belief is that things would have turned out differently. IMO Patriot fans should be be pissed off at the way the media and league treats the Patriots and we need to be making the case for them whenever that is merited, and hopefully those with more influence pick up on it and push the issues so that they don't keep getting screwed over. Whether or not that helps matters any is certainly open for debate but I see no harm in making the argument and I frequently see reporters picking up on those arguments and radio etc echoing them as time goes on.

Anyone who wants to can roll over and submit is welcome to but IMO it is worth making the case as forcefully as possible when the situations arise. The tampering case is one of those issues imo and when we first raised it the overwhelming response, including many on this board, was that nothing would come of it, and the idea that a high pick could come from it was ridiculed. Now it is starting to look more and more like that could be the end result. Regardless of whether or not it is it's still worth pushing for.

OhExaulted1 said:

It's actually alot like the Cunningham case really. The only charge that's on record as being filed is Woody shooting his mouth off on Dec. 29th. If the league or the Patriots decide they want to file additional charges sounds good to me, but currently that is all that's on the record unless you've seen an additional statement of some kind.

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League investigators were just in the jets offices, that was because of the recent tampering, there was no need to be there for the press conference.

OhExaulted1 said:

It's actually alot like the Cunningham case really. The only charge that's on record as being filed is Woody shooting his mouth off on Dec. 29th. If the league or the Patriots decide they want to file additional charges sounds good to me, but currently that is all that's on the record unless you've seen an additional statement of some kind.

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Feel free to compare it to the Cunningham case and we'll see if it is?

The punishment should be Patriots get Revis, but Jets have to pay the salary/cap hit.

OhExaulted1 said:

I don't think Roger goes much above and beyond his previous rulings. A swap of 4ths is what I'm predicting.

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Hi previous rulings did not include an owner tampering during a public press conference.

shmessy said:

Hi previous rulings did not include an owner tampering during a public press conference.

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Well, we've already heard Ivan's opinion of swapping #6 for #32 or burn down 345 Park Ave. so what are you're expectations of what Roger will do?

OhExaulted1 said:

Well, we've already heard Ivan's opinion of swapping #6 for #32 or burn down 345 Park Ave. so what are you're expectations of what Roger will do?

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I have actually laid out the reasons for awarding the Patriots a high pick. You have answered with absolutely nothing. You are great at making proclamations but you suck at backing any of them up.

Roger "I bleed green and white and not just because I have he clap" goddell is not punishing the jets in my opinion, I think he will send a memo and call it a day.