Consider Harmon to start with Dmac?

I remember people thinking Harmon could do okay replacing Dmac had he left but perhaps should consider starting him over Chung (who played well last season but could struggle in a bigger role in coverage). Maybe have Chung more as a hybrid linebacker/safety and have Harmon start with Dmac? Love to hear from some x's and o's people about if this could work well.

Also before anyone tries to call me out again I have nothing against Chung. Him coming back last season and playing well and getting a ring was one of the coolest stories of the season.

I would think that somebody is going to have to step up and take the starting job from Chung. It would only be reasonable that Chung goes into training camp as #1 on the depth chart.

True, definitely see if Chung can handle it.

Modern day Strong Safety is more like a CB these days than a Safety in the old sense of the position. Against teams that use receiving TEs the SS ends up in man coverage a lot of the time. So the question to ask is: Which one of Chung or Harmon is better at man + a little bit of run support? Right now, I'd say Chung by quite a bit.

I think Chung remains the starter but comes off the field in obvious passing situations and when teams are going no huddle.

Unless Harmon or McCourty are prepared to get in the box and play the run you still have plenty of use for Chung.

Bottom line is these 3 need to step up and be the strength of the secondary.

Harmon pick on Flacco already paid off the price they paid on him, a 3rd round pick, considered a reach at the time. If he gets to have a solid 3rd year and I think he will, this will complete validate the pick invested on him.

varjao said:

Harmon pick on Flacco already paid off the price they paid on him, a 3rd round pick, considered a reach at the time. If he gets to have a solid 3rd year and I think he will, this will complete validate the pick invested on him.

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Wilson too for his pick six in garbage time vs the Ravens

Froob said:

I remember people thinking Harmon could do okay replacing Dmac had he left but perhaps should consider starting him over Chung (who played well last season but could struggle in a bigger role in coverage). Maybe have Chung more as a hybrid linebacker/safety and have Harmon start with Dmac? Love to hear from some x's and o's people about if this could work well.

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I think you've summed it up nicely. Harmon and Chung are different players.

Harmon is more of FS while Chung is more of a SS

While he still needs to improve, Harmon is better at tracking the receiver and the ball simultaneously.

Chung is better at defending the run and can cover in short, quick spaces.

robertweathers said:

I think you've summed it up nicely. Harmon and Chung are different players.

Harmon is more of FS while Chung is more of a SS

While he still needs to improve, Harmon is better at tracking the receiver and the ball simultaneously.

Chung is better at defending the run and can cover in short, quick spaces.

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If we return to the infamous soft zone, bend don't break secondary, I'd expect Harmon to jump ahead of Chung. Unless we trade for a true #1 CB or hit a home run in the draft, I think we will see some holes exposed in the secondary. Hopefully the addition of Sheard, a healthy Easley, and a healthy mayo freeing up Collins/Hightower to get after the passer...we may be able to mask the inaeguably downgraded talent at CB. Hopefully a healthy (and out of jail for the offseason) Dennard can return to his promising form, and Butler/Ryan buck the trend of CB regression.

It's a long offseason, only time will tell.

woolster22 said:

If we return to the infamous soft zone, bend don't break secondary, I'd expect Harmon to jump ahead of Chung. Unless we trade for a true #1 CB or hit a home run in the draft, I think we will see some holes exposed in the secondary. Hopefully the addition of Sheard, a healthy Easley, and a healthy mayo freeing up Collins/Hightower to get after the passer...we may be able to mask the inaeguably downgraded talent at CB. Hopefully a healthy (and out of jail for the offseason) Dennard can return to his promising form, and Butler/Ryan buck the trend of CB regression.

It's a long offseason, only time will tell.

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Agreed. I'm not an Xs and O's guy but in theory if they play mostly Cover-2, then DMC and Harmon are your safeties. With that config, as you suggest they can mix and match Chung and Mayo on passing downs.

My understanding is that Sheard is more of a rusher/stout vs the run guy and not terribly proficient or effective in pass defense. Maybe w/ coaching that area of his game improves.

With the amount of time they spend in sub packages I don't think any of this is either or and they will end up using most of their defensive backs in a variety of ways. McCourty is going to be their starting free safety and Chung the strong safety and will play b the hybrid LB role as well. Harmon will see time at safety and McCourty will see time at CB against bigger receivers. Overall most of these guys are interchangeable and we will see them moving around depending upon game plans and the opposition. They are obviously weaker at CB but I have faith that Belichick will coach them up and the secondary will be pretty good but not great. Hopefully they can add a quality CB prospect or possibly two on the draft out split it between the draft and a trade in the summer.

If they lean towards cover-2, it will probably be Harmon but if they play much as they did last year, it will be McCourty playing single high with Chung nearer the box and if they want to put a man on a TE or receiver, McCourty will do that with Harmon taking over at single high.

robertweathers said:

Agreed. I'm not an Xs and O's guy but in theory if they play mostly Cover-2, then DMC and Harmon are your safeties. With that config, as you suggest they can mix and match Chung and Mayo on passing downs.

My understanding is that Sheard is more of a rusher/stout vs the run guy and not terribly proficient or effective in pass defense. Maybe w/ coaching that area of his game improves.

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I was considering Sheard in a push rush addition. Sheard/Nink/Easley/Jones with Sheard/Jones pushing inside as a "Nascar" DT on passing downs specifically.

manxman2601 said:

If they lean towards cover-2, it will probably be Harmon but if they play much as they did last year, it will be McCourty playing single high with Chung nearer the box and if they want to put a man on a TE or receiver, McCourty will do that with Harmon taking over at single high.

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You don't think they would throw Collins at a TE instead? Granted it depends on Mayo and Hightower getting healthy as well.

woolster22 said:

You don't think they would throw Collins at a TE instead? Granted it depends on Mayo and Hightower getting healthy as well.

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They often moved McCourty up into a slot safety role last year when they needed some man coverage and Harmon replaced him in the FS role. I'm sure Collins will do his own man coverage on TEs, it just depends on the match up.

Just to say what's been said already, but not in exactly these terms. In the general case...

...when we run Cover-2, it will likely be Harmon and DMac over the top.
...when we run Cover-1, it will likely be Chung in the box and DMac deep.

Best I can tell, this is how they ran the deep secondary in 2014, too. So, not much of a change in fundamentals, year over year. Conveniently, this plays to the strengths of each of the individual players.

I'm really curious to see if Dennard can come into his own this season and lock down a starting job and provide them with a really quality starting CB. He was considered to be a late first round early second round pick on most pre draft mocks but dropped because he couldn't work out due to injury and the last minute incident with the off duty cop. He has the talent to be a good CB but needs to put together a healthy season and show the consistency necessary to be a full time starter. If Dennard and Ryan can step up this season the secondary could be considerably better than we currently think it will be.

Ivan said:

I'm really curious to see if Dennard can come into his own this season and lock down a starting job and provide them with a really quality starting CB. He was considered to be a late first round early second round pick on most pre draft mocks but dropped because he couldn't work out due to injury and the last minute incident with the off duty cop. He has the talent to be a good CB but needs to put together a healthy season and show the consistency necessary to be a full time starter. If Dennard and Ryan can step up this season the secondary could be considerably better than we currently think it will be.

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I would have liked to see pre-last season Dennard and Browner. Maybe they don't feel very confident in Dennard right now if they didn't want to try it. Or maybe they wanted to go zone regardless who knows. I feel like Dennard will ultimately get traded on draft day for a sixth round pick but I hope I'm wrong.

Froob said:

I would have liked to see pre-last season Dennard and Browner. Maybe they don't feel very confident in Dennard right now if they didn't want to try it. Or maybe they wanted to go zone regardless who knows. I feel like Dennard will ultimately get traded on draft day for a sixth round pick but I hope I'm wrong.

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I'm an optimist, I'm hoping Belichick can turn Dennard and Ryan into good NFL cornerbacks but even with that in mind think they need to keep working to upgrade the position as much as possible before next season starts. A high draft pick and a trade for quality CB would make me feel more confident in the unit when the season starts.