McCourty Back to Corner?

I could see it if the object is to play more zone. McCourty has shown himself to be an excellent CB with the play in front of him.

BradyManny said:

Assuming McCourty is as good at CB as you recall, if we stay in Cover 1 with Harmon, it's possible the dropoff at safety is less - in which case I see your logic. However, I am not as confident in McCourty's CB play as you. He was returning to form before we switched him largely out of necessity, but the sample size of that form is not nearly enough to inspire the confidence reflected in his large contract extension.

Here's a nice little refresher on McCourty's transition to safety:

http://www.nepatriotsdraft.com/2014...e-rise-of-patriots-safety-devin-mccourty.html

Again, people cite Talib or Revis as the reason our secondary improved - I think McCourty's play at safety was as much the reason.

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As pointed out in that link, the only problem McCourty ever had at corner was in year 2 where he was beaten deep 7-8 times. People overreacted to this as if he just couldn't play corner. It was a blip.
I get that he is outstanding at safety, but BB may decide his impact is greater at corner when he looks at the roster. That would not be uncharacteristic of BB at all.

Bobs My Uncle said:

I could see it if the object is to play more zone. McCourty has shown himself to be an excellent CB with the play in front of him.

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This is the thing though, aside from 2011, he did a great job on the deep routes. It's hard for me to say the guy can't do something when he only had trouble with it in one season.

FreeTedWilliams said:

Ummm, he was awful after his rookie year at CB, that is why he is an overpaid safety now.

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You should just type Patriots suck, are doomed and they have no clue what they are doing so you can save time by cutting and pasting it into every thread.

I expect we'll have a rookie CB and no matter how talented, you need a veteran presence behind them so they can play with confidence. I like that better than McCourty back at CB and inexperience on the back end.

AndyJohnson said:

This is the thing though, aside from 2011, he did a great job on the deep routes. It's hard for me to say the guy can't do something when he only had trouble with it in one season.

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OK, I see this as a valid point. Nevertheless, I am more comfortable with him defending the play in front of him. But, my opinion doesn't matter.

AndyJohnson said:

As pointed out in that link, the only problem McCourty ever had at corner was in year 2 where he was beaten deep 7-8 times. People overreacted to this as if he just couldn't play corner. It was a blip.
I get that he is outstanding at safety, but BB may decide his impact is greater at corner when he looks at the roster. That would not be uncharacteristic of BB at all.

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Fair enough. No real argument from me, other than restating my opinion it is unlikely a CB McCourty can surpass his value at safety, but we'll see.

AndyJohnson said:

I think it is possible that BB is considering moving McCourty back to corner. Harmon has looked OK in a reserve role and could be ready to step in for McCourty at S, as well as the possibility of moving Ryan there. Thoughts?

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I couldn't disagree more. McCourty was moved to safety in the first place because he struggled at cb. He hasn't played corner in years so it makes no sense to move him back to a position he struggled at.

Bobs My Uncle said:

OK, I see this as a valid point. Nevertheless, I am more comfortable with him defending the play in front of him. But, my opinion doesn't matter.

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Neither does mine, just thought it was an interesting thought to kick around.

NO.

1. You dont break two positions to fix one position.

2. Not sure I buy the he sux at CB position; but the he would need to re-learn the position argument and forget what he was doing as S is a valid argument that he might not be able to immediately step in as a #1 CB and look great.

3. (actually the # 1 priority reason): HE IS A CAPTAIN and the leader of the SECONDARY; to my (limited and atrocious) knowledge I thought he was calling the Def plays for the secondary. You just cant do that very well from ONE SIDE OF THE FIELD as a cb. As the Safety he not only has that looking back at the field perspective DURING THE PLAY, but ALSO BEFORE THE PLAY --- so he can audible out to a different coverage if necessary.

so all in all: great thought experiment; terrible idea.

AndyJohnson said:

You should just type Patriots suck, are doomed and they have no clue what they are doing so you can save time by cutting and pasting it into every thread.

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You can pretend that the losses of Revis and Browner does not mean that the Pats will be back to the days of regularly giving up 14 yard completions on 3rd and 10, some people like to live in denial.

McCourty is a decent safety, BUT he is no where near the player that some here make him out to be. The Pats could have easily survived his departure (and would have claimed a 3rd round comp pick courtesy of whatever team over paid him). Unfortunately it was the Pats who overpaid him while letting Revis slide out the door. I'm pretty much convinced with the egregious Jets tampering, the Pats were never going to re-sign Revis once he hit the open market (anyone who thought he would take less than a King's ransom, just hasn't been paying attention to the last 7 years). So the only logical move should have been to clear the cap space and pick up the 20 million dollar option. Then the Pats would have had another year to negotiate. Once the Pats signed McCourty, Revis was gone. I'm sorry but I will forever look at McCourty's contract as the money that the Pats should have spent on Revis. Brady has 3 years left, keeping Revis for at least one more of them, would have been the smarter choice.

As for moving McCourty back to CB, after his rookie year, he was constantly getting beat. Just check out the Baltimore game last year and see how bad he was at covering TEs, let alone a #1 WR. Talib was a major upgrade from McCourty and Revis was an upgrade from Talib. Everyone in the Pats secondary (especially McCourty) benefited from Revis being out there. McCourty has never had to play safety without a top end CB in front of him. Now its going to be Dennard and Butler, yeah good luck with that.

I liked the signing of Chandler, I think he is an upgrade over Hooman.
I agreed with not picking up Vince's option.
I love the Sheard signing.
I thought that resigning Branch was good.

I really think the Pats should have resigned Vereen, I think they might regret letting him go. Everyone says that he is replaceable, BUT it seems all the replacements, have shunned the Pats offers. I saw nothing from White last year that makes me think he can do the job.

and oh, BTW, the Pats still don't have a replacement for Connelly.

Hopefully the draft will be a great success for the Pats, but so far, this off-season has been god awful for the Pats!

Tell me the Pats wouldn't be in much better shape right now, if they had retained Revis instead of McCourty!

FreeTedWilliams said:

You can pretend that the losses of Revis and Browner does not mean that the Pats will be back to the days of regularly giving up 14 yard completions on 3rd and 10, some people like to live in denial.

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Please clarify what you mean by REGULARLY. Ten times a game? 6? One a month?

McCourty is a decent safety, BUT he is no where near the player that some here make him out to be.

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It would seem that most people who are knowledgable about football see this differently than you.

.So the only logical move should have been to clear the cap space and pick up the 20 million dollar option.

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Comments such as this is what makes your posts unreadable.

As for moving McCourty back to CB, after his rookie year, he was constantly getting beat.

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This is not true. In his second season he was beaten deep 7 times. That is the only time it has happened with any regularity in his career.

Tell me the Pats wouldn't be in much better shape right now, if they had retained Revis instead of McCourty!

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the contract Revis got from the Jets was bad management. Simple as that.

the pats have 4 CB's on the roster who started and have played lots of snaps vs top WR's and at times were very good so I don't see them moving a Elite FS back to being a just above average CB.

don't get me wrong the pats will a hard time getting off the field but moving McCourty IMO would hurt more then it would help

Yes, I've been saying this since Revis left. McCourty and Butler will be a good tandem for us and Harmon/Chung will be better than people think as our starting safeties. Beef up the front 7 and the D will be good enough.

Also, the offense should be even better than the one that carried us to the SB last year.

I wouldn't be against it, I think DMC was a little worse in 2011 than AJ states, however he is fully correct that he recovered very nicely in 2012 pre-Talib trade, and he definitely was not moved to Safety because he was struggling in 2012, he was moved because safety was a HUGE issue (and his skill set translated nicely) and the team could get by with Talib at corner.

Harmon also played nicely at FS/S1 late last season, Chung is our SS/S2, and Logan Ryan could be experimented with when we need multiple FS on the field.

McCourty across from Butler/Dennard with Arrington playing his slot role shouldn't be anything close to a train wreck, in fact, it may still be an upper tier secondary if Dennard plays like he did in late 2012 and 2013 (hoping 2014 was mostly injury issues).

If Sheard plays at DE for us like he did at DE for CLE (his last 2 seasons were at OLB with different DC's) then our edge pass rush and run defense should be better and Easley will now be closer to 2 years removed from serious injury with a full offseason to regain his explosiveness and continue learning the defense. Siliga, Branch, and a run stuffer from the draft to clog the middle.

The demise of the defense is vastly overrated on this board. Nobody disagrees that losing Revis hurt, but to think we went from a top 10 to a bottom 5 (which is what it sounds like when you read some of the stuff here) because of one player is stupid.

FourierSeries said:

Yes, I've been saying this since Revis left. McCourty and Butler will be a good tandem for us and Harmon/Chung will be better than people think as our starting safeties. Beef up the front 7 and the D will be good enough.

Also, the offense should be even better than the one that carried us to the SB last year.

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I think we need to pump the brakes a little on Butler as a starting corner.
I mean I love him for that final play as much as anyone, but he is the same guy the whole room was yelling at for getting picked on earlier in the game. One great play doesn't change a season of being targetted heavily, and successfully whenever he took the field.

If the secondary remains as is in terms of personnel which I don't think it will, its very plausible we see him take some reps at CB. He is far and away the best DB we have and will be gameplan specific as to how he is utilized.

I expect McCourty to start camp at safety, any switch to CB will be a plan C change during camp if a , presumably drafted, rookie doesn't show enough to start in the early part of the season.

AndyJohnson said:

I think we need to pump the brakes a little on Butler as a starting corner.

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If that's the case, ought we not pump the brakes on Harmon as a starting safety?