The Most Egregious Case of Tampering Ever

Ivan said:

The NFL is a disgrace. This is the worst case of tampering the league has ever seen. The Patriots got completely f.cked in as public a manner as possible. The Kraft's need to push this to the limit and demand the Jets number 6 pick in this draft.

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Pats Pulpit guy thinks league will force Jets to swap 1st Round picks with the Patriots.

woolster22 said:

After more thought. Why shouldn't teams be prohibited from signing players involved in illegal negotiations? Even if it is the agent involved, that is a person under legal contract to work in the players interest. Said agent should also be subject to reprocussions, mainly damages sought by the player.

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Because the agent can't do anything "illegal" without the team playing along. If team really wanted to stay on the straight and narrow (which none of them do outside the public eye) the team could simply say "Sorry -- we're not allowed to talk. Thanks for thinking of us."

Also, the agents are licensed by the NFLPA, so why on earth is the NFLPA going to sanction an agent for helping a player to get more money out of a team???

Bostonian1962 said:

Pats Pulpit guy thinks league will force Jets to swap 1st Round picks with the Patriots.

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Sounds more like a knee jerk reaction to me. But of course I will be very happy if something like that would happen.

Now that Revis has signed w the Jets (it shouldn't matter but it does in terms of strengthening the case for the damages) I expect/hope (?) that somebody from One Patriot Place is on the phone and drafting a letter to NFL Headquarters demanding an answer now to the charges of tampering. There is nothing more to investigate as it is all on tape and we have the letter of the law so to speak on what constitutes tampering.
If as I suspect there is a slap on the wrist punishment wise ( $50K fine and a "bad dog, don't do it again") with no loss or swap of draft picks, I hope the Kraft's go nuclear on Roger and make his life miserable. How many times do you want to get screwed by the NFL? If the PAts could lose a first round draft pick and get $500K and $250K in fines for camera placement, this REPEAT OFFENSE (remember the warning for DeSean Jackson last year) ought to be worth as a severe punishment, if not a first then a high rounder either forfeited or swapped. Anything less than a 3rd rounder will leave the Jets laughing....

Still waiting for someone to explain how or why this would have come out any differently if "the most egregious case of tampering ever" had not happened and the Jets had just limited themselves to doing what every team does (i.e. take away Johnson's public statement and the leaks to Mehta).

supafly said:

Deus provided a link from Ian Rapaport that stated that once the Pats declared their intentions to not pick up the option, the Jets had every right to negotiate and that there was no "24 hour exclusive rights window" that others here spoke of. For all we know, the Pats could've dropped out due to Revis' price.

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The problem with your argument is that Woody Johnson publicly stated at a press conference his intentions towards Revis 1.5 MONTHS BEFORE the Patriots declared their intentions not to pick up the option. Do you not think that the Patriots were trying to negotiate in an exclusive manner (as was their right) with Revis BEFORE they opted not to pick up the option? He was saying no during that exclusive period and the fact is that Woody Johnson had already stated his intentions 45 days before he was allowed to.

Think timeline there.

That is CLEAR tampering. Does tampering happen often? Sure. But not that openly in public.

If this stands with no penalty then nothing means anything anymore regarding this subject.

supafly said:

Why would they have some explaining to do if we dropped out on Monday, and how is this any different than any other of the 1,000 cases of clear cut tampering that go unpunished every season (including all of the examples in the past few days)?

Deus provided a link from Ian Rapaport that stated that once the Pats declared their intentions to not pick up the option, the Jets had every right to negotiate and that there was no "24 hour exclusive rights window" that others here spoke of. For all we know, the Pats could've dropped out due to Revis' price.

Again--hope you're right, but not getting my hopes up whatsoever. I don't see how Revis choosing to take a better offer changes anything. Goodell could've ruled on the tampering charge at any point over the last 2 months and chose not to, so I'm not expecting a harsher punishment now.

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First, discussing final numbers in a authorized negotiating window when you are only to speak in generalities, is not tampering to the degree in this case. Woody or anyone is not allowed to comment on employment of another teams personnel.

Second , What has Rappaport's take on the 24 hours thing have to do with anything? The pats like the Bears and the Chiefs could have retained the player(s) with the tampering charges still upheld. And again as you said it is still considered tampering, discussing contract figures, a less agrievious method but just an adder.

Goddel, not ruling has been set in precedent, these items are always addressed in the March league meetings. All the tampering charges that I can recall, Branch, briggs, Page, Bounty gate, Spygate all this ****, and this year, all four infractions including deflate gate will be addressed.

rlcarr said:

Still waiting for someone to explain how or why this would have come out any differently if "the most egregious case of tampering ever" had not happened and the Jets had just limited themselves to doing what every team does (i.e. take away Johnson's public statement and the leaks to Mehta).

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Just like Deflategate. It doesn't matter if the outcome would have been different. If it is a clear violation of league rules, then it is punishable. How many times have we heard commentators around the nation call for punishment against the Patriots (without the final facts in, btw) and say at the same time "....they would have still crushed the Colts even if they were using bowling balls". Outcome is not the measuring stick THERE is it?

Deflategate is still being investigated and the Commish has stated that if found guilty, there will be punishments against the Patriots for messing with the 'integrity of the game".

Why would a CLEAR AND PUBLIC violation, like Woody Johnson's, not merit the same treatment?

RhodyPatriot said:

This is not a BB move. This is the Kraft's. No doubt in my mind that BB is pissed off right now. Darrelle Revis is a game changing defensive player. You pay top dollar for game changing HOF caliber players who play critical positions.
The contract Revis signed (forget the 70 mil, its about the guaranteed money) was actually quite a good deal for the Jets. This would not have been a cap pergatory deal for the Patriots in any way. That's what is so maddening about it. Letting this one player walk impacts the entire D. Not only is the D-backfield weakened considerably but you'll see how exposed the lack of pass rush becomes without a great cover corner to buy them time.
Fiscal discipline is nice and should be practiced within the roster but remember one thing - Patriots have NEVER won a championship without an elite cornerback.

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So signing him to a 16 mil/year contract for the first 3 years would of had us at 4 mil over the cap. That is without Browner and Wilfork. Holes to fill at RB, Oline, Dline, LB. So get Revis and forget the rest of the team.

The reason we compete every year is because we are 53 players deep. Someone goes down and a similar good player takes his role. You have quality substitutes to rotate in and out of game so your players are not gassed in 4th quater.

Need to redue Jones, Hightower, Collins, Solder etc in near future. Where is that money going to come from? We would have been 4 mil over cap so other playersa would have to be cut with no additions. Forget signing the draft picks.

Brady makes 14 mil against the cap because he plays for the rings more important than the last buck. Revis comes in for one year and bypasses all that philosophy.

This was all BB. He has used this formula for success for 15 years, come in off the ledge and enjoy the ride

shmessy said:

The problem with your argument is that Woody Johnson publicly stated at a press conference his intentions towards Revis 1.5 MONTHS BEFORE the Patriots declared their intentions not to pick up the option

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The thing is that the Patriots never stated anything publicly. They filed the fact that they won't pick up Revis shortly before the end of the old league year to the NFL and that is it. Up until the moment the Jets had no right to talk to him or his agent. It doesn't matter if a reporter tweets out that he "heard from sources" that the Patriots won't pick up the option.

[QUOTE="supafly said:

Why would they have some explaining to do if we dropped out on Monday, and how is this any different than any other of the 1,000 cases of clear cut tampering that go unpunished every season (including all of the examples in the past few days)?

Deus provided a link from Ian Rapaport that stated that once the Pats declared their intentions to not pick up the option, the Jets had every right to negotiate and that there was no "24 hour exclusive rights window" that others here spoke of. For all we know, the Pats could've dropped out due to Revis' price.

Again--hope you're right, but not getting my hopes up whatsoever. I don't see how Revis choosing to take a better offer changes anything. Goodell could've ruled on the tampering charge at any point over the last 2 months and chose not to, so I'm not expecting a harsher punishment now.

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Actually the Patriots had not announced anything or notified the league office by 3:00 pm Tuesday and no negotiations are allowed until the Parrots notified the league .

patman52 said:

The pats will get compensated for the tampering, my guess is a switch of 3rds and a late rd pick. Not strong enough but in line with past rulings.

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F.ck past rulings, none involved a first ballot HOF player being tampered with in division. This is without question the worst case of tampering ever and the penalty needs to reflect. The 6 overall is the minimum.

luuked said:

Not that I believe this is what will happen but if the NFL would make the Jets swap picks with us that would actually be a not insignificant punishment. I was just pointing out the value of that 6th pick compared to 32.

Just a theoretical question, would you rather have them lose their first round pick completely and stay at 32 or make them swap the pick with us ?

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I want both their first and keep their own. F.ck the jets and anyone who feels they are being treated "unfairly." That team had caused more sh.t to flow the the Patriots way than any in football and they deserve to be strung up.

A fair penalty would far exceed the one for CameraPlacementGate. The two main excuses for the harshness of that penalty were:

• Everybody knew it was against the rules, and it was done anyway.
• It might have influenced the outcome of the game.

Both factors are much greater for Revis tampering.

That said, my bolded "the" above should really be "a fair". We all know that the actual penalty for CameraPenaltyGate was on a Jean Valjean level of excess.

From mmqb today.

" I think there’s going to be pressure on the league to look into Jets owner Woody Johnson’s comments—harmless or inviting, depending which side of the argument you come down on—on how much he wanted Darrelle Revis back in January. Goodell will be pressured to consider taking a draft choice away from the Jets this year so that more teams don’t say as a matter of course how much they like and want Player X."

http://mmqb.si.com/2015/03/11/jameis-winston-roger-goodell-nfl-trades-free-agency-retirement/5/

It is egregious tampering, but I for one think nothing will happen. The NFL, particularly the "man" at the helm is all about public opinion, and everyone outside of NE thinks the Pats are a bunch of "cheaters" and got what they deserved in this matter. The NFL picks and chooses which of their stupid rules to enforce, and the tampering rule won't be one of them, particularly in this case.

If it is true that the Pats cut off talks on Monday, then they already knew that Revis had an offer that they could/would not match. So being as they had the exclusive rights to speak to him until 4pm on Tuesday, how is that not tampering?

FreeTedWilliams said:

If it is true that the Pats cut off talks on Monday, then they already knew that Revis had an offer that they could/would not match. So being as they had the exclusive rights to speak to him until 4pm on Tuesday, how is that not tampering?

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I agree with what you are saying and I hope that there is some evidence to support it.

But let me play devils advocate here and say that Camp Revis will most probably say that the 40m/3y was the lower limit they set for themselves and only when Revis became a FA the Jets called and offered more or less exactly that.

Again, we all know they were tampering but the question is whether they were stupid enough to leave some evidence (e.g. like that photograph of him sitting in broad daylight next to the jets helmet)

luuked said:

I agree with what you are saying and I hope that there is some evidence to support it.

But let me play devils advocate here and say that Camp Revis will most probably say that the 40m/3y was the lower limit they set for themselves and only when Revis became a FA the Jets called and offered more or less exactly that.

Again, we all know they were tampering but the question is whether they were stupid enough to leave some evidence (e.g. like that photograph of him sitting in broad daylight next to the jets helmet)

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Look Goodell is so corrupt, Woody could have emailed the contract offer last week to [email protected] and he still wouldn't do anything about it.

I can only hope that Kraft has a "sit down" planned with the former Jets employee.

RhodyPatriot said:

Fiscal discipline is nice and should be practiced within the roster but remember one thing - Patriots have NEVER won a championship without an elite cornerback.

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Did you start watching them in 2007?

They won the Superbowl against the Panthers with Troy Brown playing corner, because their elite guy Ty Law was in an ice tub on injured reserve.

Outside of Seattle and NE, the last 6+ SB winners did not have elite CB play