Best NE player? Brady, Revis or Gronk

The overwhelming importance of the QB position always destroys this debate. Russell Wilson is the most important player on Seattle, but I can't sit here and honestly say he's better that Thomas, Sherman, or Lynch.

Bruins29 said:

That was my point. I assumed it meant at the given position against peers now or something.

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Kinda where I (OP) was going with this, yes. These 3 players, compared to peers, currently, best relative to rest of league, but the positional importance to wins creeps in, which fuzzes things up.

Revis is best talent at his position anyone has ever seen, over single seasons, relative to league.
Brady is best talent anyone has ever seen, but over the course of many seasons, relative to league.
Gronk is Gronk. A combo of both above.

I picked Revis, because I think he's the best that's ever played that position by a long shot. I can't really say Brady -currently- is best by this criteria when there are other QB's you could conceivably throw in and not have a drop off. But the important of position messes this up, so I can see why people would choose TB for sure. Gronk is off the charts, but I think TB helps him. Revis, like Brady does what he does by himself. But Revis is so better compared to league, that I think it outweighs TB's importance of position, to be qaulified as best player on NE.

I voted other. Stephen Gostkowski is the best placekicker in the NFL. What is the point of the game? To Score Points.

Gostkowski has led the NFL in points scored for three consecutive regular seasons: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/scoring_year_by_year.htm

pdangle said:

Kinda where I (OP) was going with this, yes. These 3 players, compared to peers, currently, best relative to rest of league, but the positional importance to wins creeps in, which fuzzes things up.

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Thanks for the clarification.

JackBauer said:

I doubt that.

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You think we're better or worse?

Ryan Allen

pdangle said:

Kinda where I (OP) was going with this, yes. These 3 players, compared to peers, currently, best relative to rest of league, but the positional importance to wins creeps in, which fuzzes things up.

Revis is best talent at his position anyone has ever seen, over single seasons, relative to league.
Brady is best talent anyone has ever seen, but over the course of many seasons, relative to league.
Gronk is Gronk. A combo of both above.

I picked Revis, because I think he's the best that's ever played that position by a long shot. I can't really say Brady -currently- is best by this criteria when there are other QB's you could conceivably throw in and not have a drop off. But the important of position messes this up, so I can see why people would choose TB for sure. Gronk is off the charts, but I think TB helps him. Revis, like Brady does what he does by himself. But Revis is so better compared to league, that I think it outweighs TB's importance of position, to be qaulified as best player on NE.

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Boy you really like Revis. Are you that sure hes clearly better than Sherman? It's not even close?? Best of all time by a long shot?
I would say he's even with Sherman. As for all time, it's hard to compare eras but I'm sure there are a bunch of guys in the conversation. Law, Woodson, Bailey, maybe even Deion

goheels22002 said:

I voted other. Stephen Gostkowski is the best placekicker in the NFL. What is the point of the game? To Score Points.

Gostkowski has led the NFL in points scored for three consecutive regular seasons: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/scoring_year_by_year.htm

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The Pats won the SB by 4 points. How many points did Ghost score? You guessed it, 4 points! He was the difference in this game.

lets stop with this nonsense...aaron rodgers isnt a better QB than brady. not even close. aaron rodgers has a better arm and can move around better and is a great quarterback but he is not as good as brady.

why - because a quarterbacks job is to be the admiral on the field and utilize his team and playcalls to win. brady wins. brady wins with less. aaron rodgers has how receivers that would command $9M+ WR? (nelson/cobb..and jennings before that) brady does that with less and wins. lets end this stupid discussion rodgers is a better qb.

BobDigital said:

The best player on the Pats is Gronk though Brady is more important. No other player in the NFL dominates his position the way Gronk does.

Brady or Rodgers? tough call right now (not career but currently)
Revis or Sherman or other? Pretty close.
Gronk or ??? No one else is even close.

That could just be weakness at the TE position but I think Gronk is just a once in a generation talent at the position that is currently in his prime (unlike Brady that is a 1 in a generation talent at his position but currently not in his prime).

Also when looking at the Pats you could easily include Slater and Gost in this discussion though they are not as impactful as the above 3. I believe those 2 are the best at their respective positions right now.

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bigballas said:

lets stop with this nonsense...aaron rodgers isnt a better QB than brady. not even close. aaron rodgers has a better arm and can move around better and is a great quarterback but he is not as good as brady.

why - because a quarterbacks job is to be the admiral on the field and utilize his team and playcalls to win. brady wins. brady wins with less. aaron rodgers has how receivers that would command $9M+ WR? (nelson/cobb..and jennings before that) brady does that with less and wins. lets end this stupid discussion rodgers is a better qb.

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Speaking of nonsense, who here has said that AR is definitively better than TB. There is nothing wrong with what anyone said. Oh, and BTW we are talking about right now, not what people did in the past with less and all that crap. Right now AR is in his prime and playing lights out. Someone who made an argument that right NOW he is playing better than TB would be able to present one. Big Phucking Deal. It dosent diminish what TB is or does or what he will do.

And for everyone who has said that TB has won with less there are plenty of people who could also rationalize that TB has has BB his whole career who is obviously head and shoulders above all other coaches. That is more of a factor than anything.

The point was that the distance between TB and AR is no where near the distance between Gronk and the next best TE.

People either better learn to read and understand threads or stop being such blind homers about everything. Some day TB wont be the clear cut best QB in the league. As long as he wins a superbowl who cares.

203Pat said:

You think we're better or worse?

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I don't think this is a .500 team without Brady. That's not a knock on Brady; rather, a credit to the rest of the team.

Bruins29 said:

Speaking of nonsense, who here has said that AR is definitively better than TB. There is nothing wrong with what anyone said. Oh, and BTW we are talking about right now, not what people did in the past with less and all that crap. Right now AR is in his prime and playing lights out. Someone who made an argument that right NOW he is playing better than TB would be able to present one. Big Phucking Deal. It dosent diminish what TB is or does or what he will do.

And for everyone who has said that TB has won with less there are plenty of people who could also rationalize that TB has has BB his whole career who is obviously head and shoulders above all other coaches. That is more of a factor than anything.

The point was that the distance between TB and AR is no where near the distance between Gronk and the next best TE.

People either better learn to read and understand threads or stop being such blind homers about everything. Some day TB wont be the clear cut best QB in the league. As long as he wins a superbowl who cares.

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i agree with your statement regarding diff between Gronk and next best TE vs AR/TB...

..however when you go to point out people should learn to read, you should do so yourself. My point was never about brady being better than rodgers over his career. I'm talking about right now...this past season. You switch the receivers and I beleive Rodgers stats dip while Brady's gets better...yes, Rodgers makes some sick throws and has a great arm but I clearly pointed out he is great in my post.

As to Rodgers being better than Brady, there are plenty of threads posts that buy into that over the board and my statement was that it is not the case.

laterz

bigballas said:

i agree with your statement regarding diff between Gronk and next best TE vs AR/TB...

..however when you go to point out people should learn to read, you should do so yourself. My point was never about brady being better than rodgers over his career. I'm talking about right now...this past season. You switch the receivers and I beleive Rodgers stats dip while Brady's gets better...yes, Rodgers makes some sick throws and has a great arm but I clearly pointed out he is great in my post.

As to Rodgers being better than Brady, there are plenty of threads posts that buy into that over the board and my statement was that it is not the case.

laterz

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I would take TB over AR right now. I never get into the switching of the receivers thing. Do you agree that the distance between AR and TB is less than the distance between Gronk and the next best TE?

Gronkandez said:

Boy you really like Revis. Are you that sure hes clearly better than Sherman? It's not even close?? Best of all time by a long shot?
I would say he's even with Sherman. As for all time, it's hard to compare eras but I'm sure there are a bunch of guys in the conversation. Law, Woodson, Bailey, maybe even Deion

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I do. But I'm not blazing new territory here. For something like 6 or 7 of the last 9 years, Revis has been the Jordan of the NFL's CB position. With Sherman (when you objectively discount to 85% how often and good he says he is ) , it's now like Magic/Bird. Both players are far, far superior to their peers. Because there are two players, it doesn't discount how great Revis is. And yes, he's the best of all time by a long shot. His solo ability to neutralize offensive weapons is truly remarkable when you look at it objectively IMO. Who else has done it. The list is short. Especially when you consider the landscape of offensive advantages enacted by rule change compared to those in the eras of his historical peers.

Bruins29 said:

I would take TB over AR right now. I never get into the switching of the receivers thing. Do you agree that the distance between AR and TB is less than the distance between Gronk and the next best TE?

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yes, i full agree that the difference between Gronk and next best TE is bigger than TB/AR. I think AR is a great qb but as you said, I would take TB over AR right now also. In 2 years who knows...but what I saw out of brady this past year was amazing to me.

Few highlights for me:
- after week 4 being left to dead...the streak he put together against some top defenses
- leading two 14pt comeback in divisional playoffs
- playing lights out 4th quarter down 10 vs arguably top defense in super bowl