Why have we heard nothing about Wilfork?

RobertWeathers · Mar 3, 2015

PatsWickedPissah said:
Yes, I think there are big run stopper NT/DTs available for ~ half Wilfy's 2015 cap hit
Plus a draft pick at DT

There are a ton of them on the FA market and 5-6 DT's in the draft that could give the team 20-40 snaps a game.

PatsWickedPissah · Mar 3, 2015

Given Wilfork's age, the argument for drafting a DT now in a draft with decent prospects available to the Pats is hard to ignore. If that's the strategy as I think it should be, we can expect to see Wilfork cut soon. Use $3-4M if necessary to sign a vet and allocate the other $5M to extending Revis. McCourty, another one of my favs is distant 2nd to Revis because McCourty does NOT change the opponent's game plan.

If we draft DT, then OL successfully, the rest of the draft is gravy. The high 4th gives us move up capital as we could use it or our 3rd to move up in the 2nd.

Miguel · Mar 3, 2015

cupofjoe1962 said:
In a perfect scenario Vince would take a team friendly deal with incentives.

What incentives are you talking about?
Super Bowl win would be LTBE and not lower his cap number.

Miguel · Mar 3, 2015

BUSTAMOVE said:
From what I heard. Maybe someone can confirm. Brady cannot restructure because there is a rule on the amount of restructures in a certain time frame. Pats and Brady are maxed out.

This is incorrect. Brady can redo his deal as long as his cap number does not exceed its current value of $14m.

Miguel · Mar 3, 2015

50-yard-line said:
You forgot to add the $4.5 they just paid Gost. They are more than 12 over the cap at this time.

My numbers include the tag number.

Ivan · Mar 3, 2015

PatsWickedPissah said:
Given Wilfork's age, the argument for drafting a DT now in a draft with decent prospects available to the Pats is hard to ignore. If that's the strategy as I think it should be, we can expect to see Wilfork cut soon. Use $3-4M if necessary to sign a vet and allocate the other $5M to extending Revis. McCourty, another one of my favs is distant 2nd to Revis because McCourty does NOT change the opponent's game plan.

If we draft DT, then OL successfully, the rest of the draft is gravy. The high 4th gives us move up capital as we could use it or our 3rd to move up in the 2nd.

I agree there are some good DTs available in the draft my concern is if there is a run n on them early the ones they like could be gone. Then the question will be how much they like the one who are left. Belichick won't just take one to fill the need me will take the player he has higher and try to find another way to address the issue. I definitely agree that the lines are the priority on the draft.

Ivan · Mar 3, 2015

Miguel said:
What incentives are you talking about?
Super Bowl win would be LTBE and not lower his cap number.

Yep. Vince pretty much erased the incentives this season. They would have to be really creative to find incentives that wouldn't be LTBE.

Miguel · Mar 3, 2015

There are a couple of ways to lower Wilfork's cap number to $4 to $5 million.
1.) Wilfork takes a paycut.
2.) Salary and/or roster bonus is converted into a signing bonus.

JarOfMayo51 · Mar 3, 2015

IllegalContact said:
why would you? the pats have exclusive rights for the next 3 years

Wow is it 3 full years? I didn't think they signed him to a long contract like that.. that's fantastic news if true.. thanks for brightening my day!

Miguel · Mar 3, 2015

Ivan said:
Yep. Vince pretty much erased the incentives this season. They would have to be really creative to find incentives that wouldn't be LTBE.

and Vince would have a reasonable chance to reach them.
A 1 million bonus for 10 sacks would be NLTBE but not reasonable for Vince

PatsFanSince74 · Mar 3, 2015

slash83 said:
How the hell are they over the cap? The team that almost never makes a splash in free agency is over the cap, but Denver has millions under?

Line 1 of Miguel's page pretty much lays it out.
http://patscap.com/

FreeTedWilliams · Mar 3, 2015

We will hear something in the next week. He is due a 4.5 Million dollar roster bonus on March 10, it would make no sense to pay him the roster bonus and then cut him later on. Chance are he restructures or they cut him before March 10.

Sfpat · Mar 3, 2015

Trade VW to Jacksonville for a 5th round draft pick. They have plenty of cap space and could use a veteran who knows how to win. Win win for everyone.

Miguel · Mar 3, 2015

Trading Wilfork means picking up his option and carrying his $8.9 million cap figure on the books until he is actually traded.

juny · Mar 3, 2015

Miguel said:
There are a couple of ways to lower Wilfork's cap number to $4 to $5 million.
1.) Wilfork takes a paycut.
2.) Salary and/or roster bonus is converted into a signing bonus.

Hoping they can work something with #2. Maybe add another year (2017) to the contract to spread out the roster converted signing bonus hit in 2015. Also lower the base salary due in 2016. Wonder if Wilfork would be open to that.

IllegalContact · Mar 3, 2015

JarOfMayo51 said:
Wow is it 3 full years? I didn't think they signed him to a long contract like that.. that's fantastic news if true.. thanks for brightening my day!

doesn't matter......if you signed a rookie for a 1 year deal, at the end of the deal, he's either a restricted free agent or an exclusive rights free agent.....I'm not 100% sure of the detail, but he belongs to the pats for relatively short money until he can become a full free agent and I think that's after either 3 or 4 years

Brady6 · Mar 3, 2015

BradyFTW! said:
If you're going to cut them this year, why would you use a post-6/1 designation? Why would you be so eager to kick the can down the line into a season where Hightower and Jones will be commanding major raises on their fifth year options, and where the Pats will have to extend or replace Solder while Collins, Hightower, and Jones are impeding FAs? If the Pats have decided that they can get by without Arrington and that those guys need to go for the long-term health of the cap sheet, then the Pats are much, much better off just eating the money now, rather than hurting their cap number next year by cutting these guys in a 2016 cost-neutral way and then having to pay their replacements.

You seem to be advocating for systematically cutting guys post-6/1 in order to squeeze under the cap this year and kick the can down the road. While that cap strategy is at least slightly viable when the cap is expanding dramatically every year, the end result is almost always that you gut the middle of the roster, tread water at the top, and rapidly decline as a result. I really, really don't want to watch the 2016 Patriots turn into the 2014 Saints.

Instead, I think this is a pretty good year to bite the bullet if you feel that you have to. Cut Wilfork, let McCourty walk if you have to, sign Revis long-term because he's an incredibly rare talent and the rare kind of guy who's worth that money. I would've let Gost walk and used his $4.5M elsewhere, but apparently I'm the only person here who feels that way. As I see it, right now priority 1 is getting Revis under contract. Priority 2 is setting the team up so that it can comfortably extend two of the Jones/Hightower/Collins trio next year. If this means using a first round pick on a LT this year so that Solder can walk in FA after this season, then that's a pill you have to swallow. If that means cutting Mayo knowing that you only save a few million by doing so, then fine. At least you clear his cap figure off the books now so that you have that money to pay to your younger linebackers next year.

And lastly, if you're going to clear up cap space now, you do it in a way that won't push more money (in the form of current contract plus replacement contract) into next year. I would rather cut Browner for no dead money and hope that Butler/Dennard/Ryan can replace him than post-6/1 Arrington and Amendola, pay their replacements in a way that hurts next year's cap, and still save a million less in 2015 than Browner alone would.

I'm advocating to split a sunk cost between 2 league years. Unless you are planning on giving Amendola $5.5M in new money for 2016 there will be a $2.4M hit against the cap in 2016 either way. I think that is what is being overlooked, the money is on the cap, throwing more money at him does not make sense. Posters who do not understand the cap or simple economics will think wow it makes sense to keep him, I am not one of them though.

Are you giving Amendola $5.5M for 2016 and $6.5M for 2017? Just curious?

hwc · Mar 3, 2015

All of these proposed solutions ignore the obvious:

Wilfork got his high paid sentimental farewell tour bonus year (and a retirement ring) in 2014. I think we are all thrilled for him.

Having said that, with Wilfork as the "anchor", the Pats were the worst team in the NFL against short yardage 3rd down, 4th down, and goal line running plays.

It's time to move on.

Miguel · Mar 3, 2015

Brady6 said:
Posters who do not understand the cap or simple economics will think wow it makes sense to keep him, I am not one of them though.

Suggestion to increase your popularity on this board - avoid diminishing the intellectual capacities of your fellow Patriots fans. I understand the cap. Majored in economics. Understand the argument for keeping him.
Another suggestion - resurrect a Danny Amendola thread.

Amendola could agree to lower his salaries for 2015/2016/2017 years in return for a small signing bonus (4 to 5 million).

Brady6 · Mar 3, 2015

hwc said:
All of these proposed solutions ignore the obvious:

Wilfork got his high paid sentimental farewell tour bonus year (and a retirement ring) in 2014. I think we are all thrilled for him.

Having said that, with Wilfork as the "anchor", the Pats were the worst team in the NFL against short yardage 3rd down, 4th down, and goal line running plays.

It's time to move on.

Well when you try to run a 3-4 base with a 33 year old NT who had played in a 4-3 for the previous 3 seasons and flank him with undersized 5techs like Vellano and Chris Jones or heck Chandler Jones it is likely to have those types of issues.

People talk about the lack of play making by Wilfork but his best playmaking seasons came in a 4-3 defense, his production this past season was very similar to his production in the late 2000s and 2010 when he was a 0tech in a 3-4.

Why have we heard nothing about Wilfork?

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